Gun Control

[Igottago]

Aren't illegal handguns, originally legal? Meaning, people bought them, legally, and they were somehow stolen and got into the wrong hands. Or are there places that manufacture illegal handguns? Wouldn't this program reduce the quantity of handguns out there overall, thus reducing the base of guns that could be stolen and turned into "illegal" guns?

[Tron_fdc]

Originally Posted by Igottago

Aren't illegal handguns, originally legal? Meaning, people bought them, legally, and they were somehow stolen and got into the wrong hands. Or are there places that manufacture illegal handguns? Wouldn't this program reduce the quantity of handguns out there overall, thus reducing the base of guns that could be stolen and turned into "illegal" guns?

That would cover guns legally sold or manufactured in Canada......but not Russian AK47's or Israeli Uzi's, or American Desert Eagles that are smuggled in.

[Winsor_Pilates]

Originally Posted by Tron_fdc

That would cover guns legally sold or manufactured in Canada......but not Russian AK47's or Israeli Uzi's, or American Desert Eagles that are smuggled in.

And? It would still be step in the right direction, wouldn't it? Just because we can't get rid of all of them, doesn't meen we shouldn't get rid of some.

[flamingchina]

I think most peoples objections to this stem from the fact that realistically, it's just not going to be that useful of a policy.
Increased sentencing for gun crimes, sure. trade in programs, sure. more police, sure.

[Tron_fdc]

Originally Posted by Winsor_Pilates

And? It would still be step in the right direction, wouldn't it? Just because we can't get rid of all of them, doesn't meen we shouldn't get rid of some.

And.....it won't do much of anything. How many handguns that are made/sold legally in Canada, are used in violent crimes? Probably not many.

If you're going to do anything, propose an increase in spending on policing and focus on the illegal gun trade. Way more effective IMO.

[DementedReality]

Originally Posted by Mike F

Give me a break.

Here in Vancouver there have been a number of handgun deaths recently, with a high profile one this week in which a local skateboarder was shot and killed outside a club when he tried to break up an incident. Police are reporting that there is growing "handgun culture" amongst young men who think it's cool to carry around a gun. We're not talking about criminals or gang members, but just young men with too much testosterone and not enough brains.

If people want to have rifles and go out hunting for sport or food, that's their business, but there is no need for handguns in our society.

so, should we outlaw crowbars and kitchen knives as well ? they are capable of killing.

i think the answer is in the court system, make the penalties harsher for illegal use of ANY weapon, including handguns.

if there was a mandatory 5 year sentance for improper storage of a fire arm, plus another mandatory 10 years sentance for improper use of a firearm, plus another mandatory 25 year sentance for manslaughter with a hand gun, you would think that would do more to curb gun use than a law forbing owning one.

[CaptainCrunch]

If any of you are bored, there is a book called the road to hell which chronicles the Hells Angels rise to power, they are one of the foremost criminal organizations involving the smuggling of clean illegal guns in front the States, and China.

Making guns that are already illegal even more illegal isn't going to do a lick of good at all, the majority of the guns used in violent crimes are not sold legally in Canada, probably have had thier trackable serial numbers removed and are virtually untracable.

Its a half assed measure, now if the Liberal's got really tough on crime and said that a gun based offense was a manditory life sentence with no parole, then we'd be talking, but thats unlikely to happen under a Liberal Government.

Gun control is a complete pipe dream unless the Feds are willing to inspect every single package, crate and bag that comes into the country.

As it stands its currently nearly impossible to buy a active hand gun in Canada or a automatic weapon in Canada, so there's no point in spending more money on what would be a adendum to the gun registry.

Poor that additional money into the various police forces.

Oh and a snitch law, don't make me laugh, most people are not going to go against organized crime or a gun toting nut for a few dollars, its not worth it.

[transplant99]

As many have mentioned, but the Lib spin-masters continue to deny, the proposed law would be absilutely useless.

Some local police chime in on the subject...

The law overlooks the real source of violence -- illegally procured, often smuggled handguns, said Al Koenig, president of the Calgary Police Association.
"It might be easier just to ban crime," said Koenig. "I doubt they'll follow through with this but even if they did, it wouldn't save a single life."

And...

Smuggling the weapons has been made easier since the port-control duties were taken over by the RCMP, who have complained they lack the proper resources, said Koenig.

Const. John Burke of the city police firearms support unit said he sees no compliance problems among Calgary's handgun permit holders.

http://calsun.canoe.ca/News/Election...45354-sun.html

And an editorial that says this is nothing more than a ploy to let the Liberals spin the Cons into "gun-lovers" and of course "scary".

The issue of gun crime was bound to become front and centre in the current election campaign in the wake of a spate of horrible and highly visible street murders in the Jane-Finch area of Toronto, a poor suburban ethnic neighbourhood that has become Canada's most active shooting gallery.

So, why would the Liberals bother?

The answer is not so much to position themselves as the new law-and-order posse as it is to bait the Conservatives into a public relations trap of being portrayed as the party of right-wing gun-lovers. In short, scary. Even by the usual standards of Martin's spin-machine, the Liberal ban on banned guns has been a masterpiece of shameless politicking.


http://calsun.canoe.ca/News/Election...45378-sun.html

[DementedReality]

"It might be easier just to ban crime," said Koenig.

lol .. i can see Paul Martin up on stage with this new platform. I am not sure whats sadder:

1) that Martin believes what he is saying
or
2) his supporters dont see right through him

[Fozzie_DeBear]

I agree that the benefit of the ban on guns is 99% political, although it won't cost much. I am more interested in knowing more about the other components of the plan, such as increased punishment and increased resources for the police (looooong overdue).

An interesting idea was tried in schools down in the states. A local emergency room doctor went into high schools and gave a vivid presentation of what gunshot wounds looked like (VERY graphic) and lo and behold it had an immediate and dramatic effect on the kids attitudes towards guns. It removed the romantic veneer that many young kids (99% male probably) have with handguns. I think that a no-nonsense realistic unpatronizing approach to educating kids about what guns actually do would go a long way to solving the problems, especially in urban hotspots.
________
Rene4u live

[return to the red]

so a younger society is carrying handguns because it is "cool". By all accounts wouldn't it make it "cooler" to carry an illegal handgun? I agree with the statement that making handguns illegal will reduce the number out there but it's not going to take away from those committing the crimes. Someone isn't going to shoot a person and then reflect back on it and say, crap I shouldn't have used that illegal handgun to do it

[JiriHrdina]

[quote=CaptainCrunch]If any of you are bored, there is a book called the road to hell which chronicles the Hells Angels rise to power, they are one of the foremost criminal organizations involving the smuggling of clean illegal guns in front the States, and China.

quote]

Slightly O/T but I read this book as well - what a fantastic read. A tremendous inside look into a world that few of us have any understanding of. One of the best books I've read in the last few years.

[Azure]

Didn't Britain try something like this already, which resulted in an increase in crime?