Sutter re: recalling prospects

[hixxes]

I suspect the Flames don't consider Phillips to be a legit NHL prospect. Otherwise he would have been given more than a 1 game look by now. He's done everything he can at the AHL level to justify a shot.

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by hixxes

I suspect the Flames don't consider Phillips to be a legit NHL prospect. Otherwise he would have been given more than a 1 game look by now. He's done everything he can at the AHL level to justify a shot.

Which is a bit annoying to be honest.

Phillips is small...listed at 5'8" and 165 lbs this season.

But you'd think a organization that has had Fleury (5'6"; 182), St.Louis (5'8"; 175), Gaudreau (5'9"; 165), and Mangiapane (5'10"; 184) would have a but more understanding that height isn't the end all be all.

His height and lack of size didn't hurt him in the WHL, hasn't hurt him in the AHL, why not give him a shot to at least prove himself in the NHL.

Plus size isn't this team's problem right now...speed and talent in the bottom 6 is.

Gaudreau-Lindholm-Tkachuk
Mangiapane - Backlund - Coleman
Lucic - Dube - Phillips
Lewis - Monahan - Pitlick/Richie

That team is still plenty big enough.

And honestly I'm not sure what Richardson provides at this point of his career. He doesn't PK, he's a possession black hole, his defensive impacts aren't very good, and he has the worst offensive impact metrics on the entire team.

No real argument to keeping him on the roster / in the lineup over any of Gawdin, Phillips, Ruzicka, or Pelletier IMO.

Plus now is the time to experiment with something like this. Right now it looks like we need a top 9 winger, and a top 6 center at the trade deadline to be a true contender. But if somebody like Phillips or Pelletier can emerge and take one of those 3rd line winger spots then you can really focus all your assets on upgrading Backlund in the top 6 center role.

[TheScorpion]

If the Flames don't consider Phillips an NHL prospect then they shouldn't have drafted him. He's progressed about as well as he possibly could've since his draft day and has been one of the very best players in the AHL for the last two seasons.

[Psytic]

They think hes great to hold onto as a piece in a larger trade deal or if we lose or move one of Johnny or Eat bread. I agree with the sentiments others have stated that its unlikely we see all three together in the NHL at once for an extended period of time.

[Wastedyouth]

Phillips reminds me of Marchessault, who didnt get a chance till he was 24-25.

Smallish, big producer but never given a chance till he blew the doors off.

Phillips has time. They all do. Build a winning team and winning culture. These young guys arent going anywhere.

[Wastedyouth]

Of note, there was a recent statistical analysis of players 22 and under in the NHL and the scoring for players in the NHL this age and younger has been falling off for over 5 years.

Being young and in the NHL isnt necessarily a good thing anymore.

[mile]

Wished they asked him about Phillips

[kyuss275]

Not surprised by his comments at all. I kind of chuckle to my self when posters say we should call up so and so and out them in the top 9. Do they not realize who our coach is right now? If a player is being called up with Sutter in charge, he better be sound defensively or he will be getting 6 minutes on the 4th line.

[Goriders]

Originally Posted by TheScorpion

Darryl obviously knows what he's talking about, he's a good coach, but the bottom third of the forward lineup has been very poor all season. The bar isn't for a Pelletier or Phillips to come in and blow the doors off. They just have to be better than Brad Richardson.

I don't understand the patience at this point when we're already close to halfway through the season and they clearly have guys in the AHL boosting a powerhouse team. Even if he thinks Pelletier is too young ... this is Phillips' fourth season and he's dominating the league, top 10 in AHL scoring. Isn't that the threshold he needs to reach to get a look?

Phillips weighs 150 pounds though. Can’t see him coming up with Sutter at the helm.

[kobasew19]

I love how Sutter is such a straight shooter. He’ll tell you how he feels and won’t hide anything. There’s no second guessing with him.

[TheScorpion]

Originally Posted by Goriders

Phillips weighs 150 pounds though. Can’t see him coming up with Sutter at the helm.

No pun intended ... but if he's good enough to merit an audition, why should him being 165 pounds outweigh all the positives he brings on the ice? Seems like such a binary way to assess a player.

[SuperMatt18]

I was just thinking about an interesting comparison between calling up Mangiapane in January 2019 and potentially calling up Phillips now.

Flames final recall of Andrew Mangiapane occurred on January 11th 2019 (he was sent down over the all-star break that year but missed no NHL games). Up to that point in his career he had played 17 NHL games and had no points.

Mangiapane was 22 years old. He had 17 points in 15 AHL games that season, and had 104 points in 120 AHL games for a 0.87 PPG average.

However from January 11th onwards he became a huge part of the team over the final 37 games, finding chemistry with Derek Ryan and Garnet Hathaway. Over the final 37 games he had the following ranks at 5v5.

TOI: 358 Minutes (9th)
xGF: 61.6% (1st)
GF%: 75.8% (3rd)
Goals: 8 (5th)
Points: 13 (8th)

So he was called up after having no NHL success prior, and really found his game in a sheltered role on that roster. He became a big part of that team's bottom 6 down the stretch and into the playoffs.

Phillips is in a similar spot this year. Phillips is 23 years old (both Mangiapane and Phillips are April birthdays). He has 27 points in 26 AHL games this season (similar to Mangiapane's PPG before being called up), and has 120 points in 160 AHL games (0.75 PPG, a little below Mangiapane's clip)

I just think there is an opportunity to give Phillips a shot here, very similar to how they gave Mangiapane a shot in 18-19.

[EVERLAST]

Darryl changing his past philosophy of favoring vets over AHLers is quite a refreshing change.

It also says allot about the work guys like MacLean, Huska and Love are doing/ have done.
Trust goes a long way.

I don't think he has a choice either. I'm sure he'd cook these guys a little more in the AHL but time isn't a luxury, covid complicates things and his once favored vets aren't producing as advertised.

Also....IF Kenny Holland is willing to play the second chance game with the most volatile cancer he can get his hands on since the real deal was bought out.....bwah ha ha...wow.
Good luck with that Kenny.

I'm sticking with Darryls plans . It means he's in agreement with his assistants, scouts , and AHL coach.

[cannon7]

Originally Posted by Wastedyouth

Phillips reminds me of Marchessault, who didnt get a chance till he was 24-25.

Marchessault had to bulk up before he made the NHL, mainly his lower body strength. Same story as Martin St. Louis. When you watched St. Louis as a Flame, the skill was always there, but he was getting manhandled.

[Mindtravellee]

Shame we can't bump them to the taxi squad without the waiver process.

[Sylvanfan]

I know very little about the player but this is his 4th year as a pro. At some point you need to at least see how he fares at the NHL level, and if there is a role for the player. These players won't stay with the same team long if they don't taste some type of opportunity. Maybe he's Austin Czarnik, maybe he's Paul Byron, but you'd like to at least have a look at him with some sort of sample against NHL competition before you decide to let him go. If he shows well you have a keeper.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by TheScorpion

While I understand what Darryl is getting at here, groan @ the "undersized" comment — and there are also prospects in Stockton who have played more than one or two years. Although I'm not sure that matters in Pelletier's case when he's already top-3 in scoring and the Flames' existing forward depth is horrendous.

It's not like Pelletier, Phillips, or Gawdin necessarily have to come up and turn into elite players right away to be able to stick. That's ludicrous and unrealistic. But when you have four forwards who are barely NHL calibre, if that (Ritchie, Richardson, Lewis, Pitlick) in your rotation every night — where's the downside in making a change?

You seem to be under the impression that Peletier, Gawdin and Phillips are better hockey players than Ritchie, Richardson and Lewis.

They are not.

Pelletier will be, maybe even next year. The others aren't.

[Bend it like Bourgeois]

Originally Posted by TheScorpion

If the Flames don't consider Phillips an NHL prospect then they shouldn't have drafted him. He's progressed about as well as he possibly could've since his draft day and has been one of the very best players in the AHL for the last two seasons.

You might have your Heats colored glasses on.

He’s been a fine AHL pro and steadily getting better but it’s not like he’s been crushing the league.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

You seem to be under the impression that Peletier, Gawdin and Phillips are better hockey players than Ritchie, Richardson and Lewis.

They are not.

Pelletier will be, maybe even next year. The others aren't.

The other thing is that Sutter has very specific notions about the roles the players are to fill on each line. Ruzicka and Phillips are both just over PPG in the AHL, but Ruzicka was called because Sutter thinks he’s a better fit as a 4C as he sees the role.

I suspect if Sutter wants to make a change in top 9 wing, Pelletier would then see some time.

[D as in David]

This could just be Sutter setting the expectations low for a young player from fans and the media - expect to see a call up soon!