[News] And so begins the end... (or: Vegas can eat a giant D)

[RedHawk12]

Originally Posted by opendoor

They'd still have to pay Leddy his contract and have his cap hit against their upper limit, so they're no further ahead. They'd be taking on a $5.5M cap hit just to allow them to exceed the cap by $5.5M more, which creates a net gain of $0 cap space.

Hmm ok...never mind then.

That makes sense, I think. Thanks for clarifying.

[powderjunkie]

Originally Posted by Sylvanfan

No two injuries are the same. With a neck injury he might be able to resume light skating a lot earlier than you could with a knee injury. So the timeline to be cleared for full contact here may be longer than when a guy can start skating after a knee injury.

If I remember correctly the NHL does a paycheque cycle of every two weeks starting in like the first week of October, thru to the end of the season. So although the pay structure of the contract may not pay out that way, the cap accrual does. So every day the remaining cap hit comes down like 1/182 of the total AAV. Say the NHL ends up extending the season by 2 weeks for Covid delays, I wonder how that would work with the Cap Consumption cycle. Might there be time where the cap hits are consumed, and a guy like Eichel essentially can play games for no cap hit?

I imagine the cancelled Olympic break has already had some impact here...along with introducing the taxi squad mid season. The daily accruals must be a mess.


On that note, the simplest solution to the "Kucherov" is to have a minimum threshold of days a player (earning say $2M+) has to count against the cap to be eligible for the playoffs.

Minimum ~40 days (however long TDL to end of season is), but even better would be a 3day to 1 playoff game ratio. Want to be eligible for all 28 possible playoff games? That means 84 days on the cap. But, if a team wants to get cute, maybe they go for 22 playoff games and only 66 days against the cap.

LTIR can still serve it's purpose, and if the player won't return for the playoffs you've got nothing to worry about.

[Bend it like Bourgeois]

The athletic Vegas writer has a pretty good article recently.

He speculated on ways they might clear 5M or more depending on how short they run the roster.

They’ll also have to dump another player in the summer I’d think.

[dissentowner]

You just know they are going to find a way to abuse LTIR and the NHL will look the other way because it is their new golden boy franchise.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by FanIn80

Where did I pick up that the cap doesn't matter after the deadline? Or am I just simplifying it? Is it something to do with pro-rating a salary from deadline to start of playoffs that makes it insignificant to activate a player after the deadline?

I'm legitimately confused, cause I've been talking about this here since before Eichel was traded and this is the first time I've been corrected. I'm not suggesting the correction is wrong, just trying to understand what made me think this in the first place...

Probably the talk of prorating AVV the closer you get to the TDL.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by JackIsBack

They have just under 5 million in space with their LTIR...Pacioretty is worth 7 million on IR and who knows when he's back.... and another 6 million in LTIR when Eichel comes off that list... so they need 5 million and I don't know how they do that... and when Pacioretty comes back after wrist surgery (Dec 30th).... who knows what they do to clear space for both to play.

This. They are going to have to dump something big - I suspect they’d love to move Smith, but they might have to include a real sweetener. I’d insist on getting Stephenson as part of a deal (and they might do it, because Eichel would be taking his lineup spot anyway).

[greyshep]

Its gonna be annoying to see this unfold either way. Watching us struggle offensively on the Florida/Carolina trip only makes this sting further to me.

[GranteedEV]

"I think everyone in our room understands we're there to try and win a Stanley Cup and you need guys like that in order to win a Stanley Cup. "

Smh Tre

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

"I think everyone in our room understands we're there to try and win a Stanley Cup and you need guys like that in order to win a Stanley Cup. "

Smh Tre

Honestly I still think this was more Buffalo's fault than Tre's.

Rumors indicate that they saw Krebs as the same level as prospect as Drysdale or Zegras...which is just horrible talent assessment on Buffalo's part.

I'm not sure Krebs is even a tier higher than Zary or Pelletier.

[Scroopy Noopers]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

Honestly I still think this was more Buffalo's fault than Tre's.

Rumors indicate that they saw Krebs as the same level as prospect as Drysdale or Zegras...which is just horrible talent assessment on Buffalo's part.

I'm not sure Krebs is even a tier higher than Zary or Pelletier.

Well, I certainly disagree. He absolutely is.

[Sylvanfan]

The fact that Buffalo steadfastly denied this surgery for as long as they did...and now here we are with Eichel looking to be on the road to recovery might indicate how messed up the Sabres are.

[powderjunkie]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

This. They are going to have to dump something big - I suspect they’d love to move Smith, but they might have to include a real sweetener. I’d insist on getting Stephenson as part of a deal (and they might do it, because Eichel would be taking his lineup spot anyway).

Smith has 11G 28P in 38gp...60pt pace and 4th most TOI among their forwards.

Stephenson has 10G 35p in 37gp and most TOI for Fs.

They are 1 and 2 in points for the team right now...though both Stone and Patches are PPG+ with half as many games.


Marchessault is probably a more likely bet...March contract was front loaded so he'd be appealing to a lot of teams (3.5$ vs. 5M AAV for 2 more years). 18G 26P in 33gp...they could recover some decent assets with him.

They'd probably prefer to move Dadonov, but he's backloaded cashwise and half as productive.

[GhostCookie]

Originally Posted by powderjunkie

Smith has 11G 28P in 38gp...60pt pace and 4th most TOI among their forwards.

Stephenson has 10G 35p in 37gp and most TOI for Fs.

They are 1 and 2 in points for the team right now...though both Stone and Patches are PPG+ with half as many games.


Marchessault is probably a more likely bet...March contract was front loaded so he'd be appealing to a lot of teams (3.5$ vs. 5M AAV for 2 more years). 18G 26P in 33gp...they could recover some decent assets with him.

They'd probably prefer to move Dadonov, but he's backloaded cashwise and half as productive.

Still a decent chunk of cap to get a team to take on with little to no money going the other way. Plus both March and Dadonov have some trade protection will limit who there trade partners are. If they can't keep Pachy or Martinez on LTIR until playoffs, they will have even more money problems to sort out.

[BeltlineFan]

Originally Posted by Scroopy Noopers

Well, I certainly disagree. He absolutely is.

For what it's worth, Byron Bader has them all in a similar class.

He has Krebs at 9% chance to become a star, 78% to become an NHLer.

Pelletier is 7% and 76%. Zary is 27% and 68% but has 2 less years of data.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by powderjunkie

Smith has 11G 28P in 38gp...60pt pace and 4th most TOI among their forwards.

Stephenson has 10G 35p in 37gp and most TOI for Fs.

They are 1 and 2 in points for the team right now...though both Stone and Patches are PPG+ with half as many games.


Marchessault is probably a more likely bet...March contract was front loaded so he'd be appealing to a lot of teams (3.5$ vs. 5M AAV for 2 more years). 18G 26P in 33gp...they could recover some decent assets with him.

They'd probably prefer to move Dadonov, but he's backloaded cashwise and half as productive.

Smith is an expiring contract, so easier to diverts and for other teams to absorb. Stephenson is their 1C now. But Eichel is going to steal his spot, and Karlsson and Marchessault are a pairing. And IMO Stephenson is just the most attractive trade piece they have, much more than Marchessault.

[dissentowner]

So exactly what is the penalty if they can't get under cap?

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

So exactly what is the penalty if they can't get under cap?

The NHL can:

(i) Impose a fine of up to $5 million in the case of a Circumvention by a Club or Club Actor, but in no circumstances shall such fine be less than $1 million against any Club or Club Actor if such party is found to have violated Article 50 of this Agreement. If such a fine is assessed against a Club (except in the case of a financial reporting violation), that Club's Payroll Room shall also be reduced by such amount for the following League Year, and if such reduction of the Club's Payroll Room renders the Club out of compliance with the Payroll Range (i.e., the Club does not have sufficient Payroll Room to accommodate its Player commitments comprising Club Salary) for such following League Year, then the Club must take such steps as are necessary (e.g., Assignment, Buy-Out, Waivers, etc.) and as are permitted by this Agreement to ensure that the Club will be in compliance with Article 50 of this Agreement upon commencement of the following League Year;
(ii) Impose a fine against a Player of up to the lesser of $1 million or twentyfive (25%) percent of a Player's Paragraph 1 Salary in the case of a Circumvention by a Player or Player Actor, but in no circumstances shall such fine be below the lesser of $250,000 or twenty-five (25%) percent of the Player's Paragraph 1 Salary. Notwithstanding the $1 million limitation set forth above, any additional amounts by which the Player has been unjustly enriched due to the Circumvention shall be ordered to be disgorged;
(iii) Direct a Club to forfeit draft picks (the number, placement, and League Year of which shall be determined in the Commissioner's sole discretion);
(iv) Declare a forfeiture of any NHL Game(s) determined to have been affected by a Circumvention;
(v) Direct a Club to disclose and report to the Independent Accountants all information required by this Agreement, including, without limitation, by the provisions of Article 50;
(vi) Void any SPC, or any extension of an SPC, between any Player and any Club when both the Player or Player Actor and the Club or Club Actor are found to have committed such a violation with respect to such SPC or extension; and (vii) Suspend any Club employee, Player, or Certified Agent involved in such a violation for a period of time determined in the sole discretion of the Commissioner, the System Arbitrator, or the NHLPA, respectively.

But these are for cap circumvention attempts. I don’t know anyone that’s ever played a game over the cap - I think they just ice a short handed team.

[Jacks]

That whole Toronto - Clarkson thing seems to have confused people about how LTIR works. Seems that every other person now thinks that you can just acquire LTIR contracts to exceed the cap. It can be confusing as hell though, I still don't know how the Clarkson thing worked.

[powderjunkie]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Smith is an expiring contract, so easier to diverts and for other teams to absorb. Stephenson is their 1C now. But Eichel is going to steal his spot, and Karlsson and Marchessault are a pairing. And IMO Stephenson is just the most attractive trade piece they have, much more than Marchessault.

I don't disagree, but I don't think trading a guy who is playing at ppg at 2.75M for two more years after this is the best way to solve your cap problems.

[dissentowner]

I hope it costs Vegas a bunch of 1sts and top prospects to get teams to take players to get under cap. We all know some dumb GMs are going to let them off the hook lightly though.
.