[Signing] Canes have re-signed Andrei Svechnikov (8 yrs, $7.75 mil AAV)

[BagoPucks]

NHL GMs also operate in a closed loop club of 32 GMs. You can't just go around upsetting your competition. I used to like Carolina but signing of Deangelo shows they are prioritizing on ice vs the people who are in the organisation. Not sure I care for them anymore.

[Beatle17]

Originally Posted by Monahammer

He's already almost PPG, only 21... I think he could easily be outplaying this contract in the last 5-6 years of it, and pretty much fair value now if he continues his current level of play. I would love this deal for Tkachuk, for example.

No he's not. This gets thrown out a lot but so far, and it doesn't mean he can't get this up, but he has a lower PPG than Monahan.

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

That's just a safe way of looking at it though.

NHL GMs are just too scared to ruffle some feathers and actually make moves that could be a bit risky.

Did the Aho offer sheet drive up the price for Montreal's UFAs?

It's been 16 years since the lockout and there have been 9 offer sheets in that time. NHL GMs just refuse to use a tool that's available to them because they seem to be too afraid to do it.

Didn't say anything about UFAs but RFA contracts are used by agents and set comparable marks.

You are assuming they aren't using them out of fear
I'm suggesting they aren't using them because they've proven to be pretty ineffective.
Players don't sign them
Teams match.

[Swayze11]

I bet there is a bunch of offer sheets that get offered but very rarely do they get signed.

People always forget that it is a two way street, not a one way street. These players are 1-3 years into their NHL dream. It is very easy to suggest that there is a honeymoon phase just like a new job. Most of the time they really enjoy where they currently are. It is typically the team that drafted you, developed you, etc. so 9 times out of 10 you want to stay.

[Icantwhisper]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

That's just a safe way of looking at it though.

NHL GMs are just too scared to ruffle some feathers and actually make moves that could be a bit risky.

Did the Aho offer sheet drive up the price for Montreal's UFAs?

It's been 16 years since the lockout and there have been 9 offer sheets in that time. NHL GMs just refuse to use a tool that's available to them because they seem to be too afraid to do it.

You also have to build a relationship with your fellow GM's that make them want to do business with you in the future.

[simmer2]

nm.

[Jiri Hrdina]

So the last successful offer sheet (meaning it was unmatched) was in 2007 - Dustin Penner.
Prior to that the previous one was 1997 - Chris Gratton.

So why would GMs focus on doing something that works that poorly?

[GordonBlue]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

So the last successful offer sheet (meaning it was unmatched) was in 2007 - Dustin Penner.
Prior to that the previous one was 1997 - Chris Gratton.

So why would GMs focus on doing something that works that poorly?

I would say the Penner one was unsuccessful.

Only because we never did get that fight behind the barn.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

So the last successful offer sheet (meaning it was unmatched) was in 2007 - Dustin Penner.
Prior to that the previous one was 1997 - Chris Gratton.

So why would GMs focus on doing something that works that poorly?

Yep. Seems you would have to overpay so wildly for a player in order for it not to be matched that you do yourself no favors.

If a team is susceptible an offer sheet, I’d think you could do a lot better for yourself by targeting a trade. You avoid some crazy contract.

[getbak]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

Didn't say anything about UFAs but RFA contracts are used by agents and set comparable marks.

You are assuming they aren't using them out of fear
I'm suggesting they aren't using them because they've proven to be pretty ineffective.
Players don't sign them
Teams match.

I wonder how many times a team has made an offer and the player rejected it? I doubt it happens very often, assuming the team is making a legitimate offer that they're hoping the other team won't match.

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

So the last successful offer sheet (meaning it was unmatched) was in 2007 - Dustin Penner.
Prior to that the previous one was 1997 - Chris Gratton.

So why would GMs focus on doing something that works that poorly?

Exactly, if the offer sheet is reasonable, the other team will match it, so you're just basically doing the other GM's job for him. Even a slightly unreasonable offer is likely to be matched, so your only hope of being successful is to make a wildly unreasonable offer. When you add the draft pick compensation that comes with a successful offer sheet, it's just not a logical formula for building a team.

[Enoch Root]

Exactly. The whole point of overpaying for a UFA is that you get the player without giving up anything, so it is worth overpaying to gain another asset.

With an offer sheet, you have to pay full compensation, in the form of picks, and you have to overpay, usually by a LOT, because the other team will match anything remotely tolerable.

It is a terrible way to acquire assets, except in the rarest of circumstances.

And the frequency of its use reflects that.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Exactly. The whole point of overpaying for a UFA is that you get the player without giving up anything, so it is worth overpaying to gain another asset.

With an offer sheet, you have to pay full compensation, in the form of picks, and you have to overpay, usually by a LOT, because the other team will match anything remotely tolerable.

It is a terrible way to acquire assets, except in the rarest of circumstances.

And the frequency of its use reflects that.

Pretty much agree. Unless it is a really rare talent or the team is a guaranteed contender and the picks will be low, it is almost never worth it. Having said that, I don't like the reasoning that the team will match anyway, so don't bother. I say call their bluff and make them pay. I was pining for the Flames to offersheet Stamkos back when he was an RFA, but most people were saying not to bother because Tampa would match anything. So make them!

I do wonder how many offersheets do not get accepted by players though. I suspect it happens sometimes and we just never hear about it. The player's agent probably just tells the team that holds his rights, and they work something out before it gets that far.

As far as I know, the Flames have ever only offersheeted (offershat?) RFAs twice (Selanne and O'Reilly), both were accepted but then matched. Have any Flames players ever accepted offersheets?

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

Originally Posted by tvp2003

Floor for Pettersson's extension?

Pettersson is probably going to get a chunk more, but this should really hurt his negotiating position if he was hoping to get 10 mil... But it's even worse for Kaprizov. Why should the Wild pay him a penny more than this?

[Enoch Root]

Pettersson has shown a fair bit more than Svechnikov IMO. Career PPG:

Pettersson: .927
Svechnikov: .683

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Pettersson has shown a fair bit more than Svechnikov IMO. Career PPG:

Pettersson: .927
Svechnikov: .683

Well, Svechnikov just didn't hit the ground running as fast. Over years 2 and 3 of their ELCs it's a lot closer, including in the playoffs where they're both roughly PPG... and Svechnikov obviously had the better contract year and has spent less time out of the lineup with injury, which matters a lot for an 8 year deal.

I wouldn't quite go so far as to suggest that going forward the only reason to want Pettersson on your team more than Svechnikov is that one is a center... but it's not that far from the truth.

[bax]

Svechnikov jumped straight to the NHL after his draft too didn’t hey? Whereas Petersen spent an extra year in Sweden

[1qqaaz]

Pettersson technically peaked in his rookie year and took a year to play in the NHL.
Svechnikov played right away tended upwards after his rookie season.

[dino7c]

people forget that the player actually has to sign the offer sheet and agree to go to whatever team is offering it

He is probably happy in Carolina

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

If someone offer sheeted him for 8x9 the Canes would definitely match, so he could have had best of both worlds. But no one offer sheets anyone anyway for exactly that reason, it's always going to be matched.

[Kipper_3434]

The calculation for offer sheet compensation is why I believe it's still so rare to see offer sheets expected. A team can only logically offer a 5 year contract while the team owning rfa rights can offer 8 years. For example if a team offers a 10m x 7 contract the compensation would be calculated at 14m aav. If team offers 10m x 5 years the rfa team can easily offer higher total value and obtain a lower aav on a 8byear contract. If the NHL were to ever eliminate the 5 year rule I think we would see a lot more offer sheets accepted.