Dougie Hamilton - Was there more to this trade than meets the eye?

[Bingo]

Great thing about a message board is the history, and the fact that you can look things up and see what you said before a deal went down.

My Post

This all comes down to what Treliving and his assistants think of Hamilton as a fit for the Flames going forward, in the dressing room, his overall play.

There is little debate about his offence, some suggestions about his try level in battling and his defensive play that they have to sort out.

I'm not against betting on a young player that they like because it's the best way to add an impact player without a silly contract into the mid 30s and has a chance if you're scouting is correct to get more than it looked like you are getting on the transaction day.

But don't move Hamilton for fun. It has to make sense.

So for many it's pretty easy to play down marketing or revisionist theory to back a trade or defend a team, or whatever.

As I've said many times the Loubardias comment after the season was big for me, especially after the guy disembowelled himself to save Russell on the radio two years earlier. He suggested a lack of battle. He suggested some jam issues.

If that's the case you sell high and you move on.

If that's not the case and they deemed this the hockey trade you want to make I still don't mind it as I said right after the deal was done ... any time you move one player in your core for two and they're younger it's a pretty good move.

[SuperMatt18]

I actually don’t think it’s about his personality off ice, in the end I don’t think his more care free attitude in regards to play on the ice didn’t mesh with the intensity of guys liken Gio.

Flames traded for him hoping he would become a force on the ice in all aspects of the game - physically, defensively, and offensively. And IMO I think they are a little disappointed he didn’t really develop as much as they liked.

They traded for him as a possession monster with 40-50 pts who wasn’t physical and didn’t always seem to be trying as hard as he could, and now they trade him away as a 40-50 points guy who wasn’t physical and didn’t always seem to be trying as hard as he could.

Sadly it’s one of those cases though where Dougie was never going to be they guy that people wanted him to be on the ice (:cough: Bouwmeester :cough) but was always going to be held to that standard and instead they miss out on all the things that already made him a top 20-30 dman in the league.

[RichKlit]

I know someone who’s had many interactions with Hamilton through their job and this person had a negative experience every time. I’ve known this person for years and years and trust them completely but still take it with a grain of salt.

[Aarongavey]

Having been involved in hockey for most of my life, I can see why a guy who has these credentials did not fit in. http://ontariohockeyleague.com/icedo...r-of-the-year/

I imagine half the guys he played with could not spell all the courses that Dougie got 90's in during high school. It can be quite intimidating having a smart guy on a sports team. Could have contributed to his not fitting in. I doubt Dougie has many mensa conversations in the locker room.

[Cecil Terwilliger]

Originally Posted by Aarongavey

Having been involved in hockey for most of my life, I can see why a guy who has these credentials did not fit in. http://ontariohockeyleague.com/icedo...r-of-the-year/

I imagine half the guys he played with could not spell all the courses that Dougie got 90's in during high school. It can be quite intimidating having a smart guy on a sports team. Could have contributed to his not fitting in. I doubt Dougie has many mensa conversations in the locker room.

There are plenty of intelligent guys in the nhl. He didn’t get traded because he’s smart, nor is it the reason he had problems in the locker room, if that’s true.

[sempuki]

I'm not going to sit and speculate on the character of a person I've never met, or assassinate his character because we traded him, but the bottom line is we went out and got his brother, made it happen that they could play together, and Dougie was expected to be a part of the solution on a team that lacked killer instinct.

I think if we weren't getting a player like Hanafin back (in addition to a right shooting forward), Dougie is on this team come September.

[AC]

The comments in all the clutter that stick out is Treliving saying "We take everything into consideration, both on and off the ice. I don't share a lot of things that players share with me."

Sure sounds like Dougie told Treliving he wanted a trade. If a player doesn't want to be on the team, I think it inherently will affect his compete level and desire to win with that team.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

It's obviously more than that. Bobby Holik was famously high-brow, always readings books when the team travelled and spending much of his leisure time at art galleries museums. He also wore a letter for a couple teams. The NHL isn't such a den of troglodytes that a team is going to run a player out of town just because he's bookish.

Flames management made several comments over the last year or two that they had problems with players who seemed okay with losing, who couldn't ratchet up the intensity. Pretty clear that one of those players was Hamilton.

The team was poorly coached. Really would you expect a team that's going to jump through walls to win for an nice guy coach that was in over his head? To me it seems like a lot of fans including yourself wanted to pin the "okay with losing" tag on guys like Gaudreau, Hamilton, Monahan, etc because of an uninformed Francis article. The coach got fired and the new coach wanted to bring a few players from his old team that he thought could help the Flames and the truth is that guys like Brodie and Hamonic were not going to get that deal done. If for whatever reason the Hurricanes decide they want to keep those players I don't think Hamilton was burning a hole in Treliving's pocket that he had to move him. It's simply a matter of teams having to give up a lot to get a lot.

[Ozy_Flame]

Book smarts doesn't always translate to social smarts. And I think you need those on a team sport.

[Diemenz]

I heard he punched puppies and supported building a wall around forest lawn.

Seriously guys, who bloody cares he’s gone and now we are just being ridiculous. Boston tried re-signing him for months before they traded him. They didn’t want him gone but had to make the move. After that they tried justifying it. Now this board is doing the same.

One thing I can tell you is that the sign of a good hockey trade is when there is this many people with polar opposite thought of it. A large amount hate it a large amount love it and same with the Carolina fan base on twitter and hf. This means this was a good hockey trade and I think we should just move on and talk about what we have not what we lost.

[sempuki]

Originally Posted by RichKlit

I know someone who’s had many interactions with Hamilton through their job and this person had a negative experience every time. I’ve known this person for years and years and trust them completely but still take it with a grain of salt.

Famous people are famously dicks. And the Flames have had plenty of them on their team over time.

[sketchyt]

Originally Posted by RichKlit

I know someone who’s had many interactions with Hamilton through their job and this person had a negative experience every time. I’ve known this person for years and years and trust them completely but still take it with a grain of salt.

I’ve had pretty much the exact opposite experience.

There’s obviously more than meets the eye here... more than I’ll ever know I guess, but quite frankly I’m baffled by any notion of there being any off ice issues.

He was always polite, thoughtful in any of my dealings with him.

[Aarongavey]

Originally Posted by Cecil Terwilliger

There are plenty of intelligent guys in the nhl. He didn’t get traded because he’s smart, nor is it the reason he had problems in the locker room, if that’s true.

There have already been stories on CP about how Dougie wanted to go to museums on the road and guys wanted to go to Moxies. If Dougie always wanted to do smart things and nobody wanted to do smart things with him, it probably lead to some friction in the locker room.

In any event, one would think professional athletes should be able to get along with each other, it is pretty disappointing if the reason we traded a true stud dman was because the dressing room was divided.

[Stay Golden]

The knocking of Hamilton surrounding anything but hockey is pure speculation & gossip.

[RichKlit]

[QUOTE=sempuki;6720612]Famous people are famously dicks. And the Flames have had plenty of them on their team over time.[/QUOTE

So? I posted something that seemed relevant to the discussion?

[TopChed]

Originally Posted by Aarongavey

There have already been stories on CP about how Dougie wanted to go to museums on the road and guys wanted to go to Moxies. If Dougie always wanted to do smart things and nobody wanted to do smart things with him, it probably lead to some friction in the locker room.

In any event, one would think professional athletes should be able to get along with each other, it is pretty disappointing if the reason we traded a true stud dman was because the dressing room was divided.

lol

[Enoch Root]

Can we please not throw him under the bus now that he's been traded?

The team had problems last year. Treliving is trying to change the room. If the team is better this year - great! End of story. If it isn't, then the problem hasn't been fixed.

Can't we just keep it at that level?

[Red]

Has it been established why he was going to the museum? Maybe the team didn't invite him after an "incident"?


I don't know the guy off the ice, but on the ice he looks like someone that's there to cash a paycheck. Has he ever blocked a shot? All the lazy penalties etc must have come up in the dressing room so maybe he reacted the wrong way? Was his brother's presence called out and he reacted to that the wrong way? No idea. But on the ice the guy didn't play like he cared much.
Too bad because he is very skilled and he got the gift of being huge as well.



I hope he isn't seen as outcast because he isn't a party animal or because he likes to be alone. These aren't faults.

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by Stay Golden

The knocking of Hamilton surrounding anything but hockey is pure speculation & gossip.

Well ya.....thats what all rumours and why players are traded becomes on a discussion forum.

Though I will ask you this...in regards to being asked if Hamilton wanted out, what do you think BT meant when he stated this (as AC already posted)?

"We take everything into consideration, both on and off the ice. I don't share a lot of things that players share with me."

[Stay Golden]

Originally Posted by SportsJunky

Francis’ article this morning says flat out that Dougie wasn’t bothered by losses. Francis also says he was still upset about Freddie being waived. He just didn’t fit in with the other guys in the dressing room. We’ve been hearing these whispers for a long time now.

Eric Francis has made a career out of trashing several Flames and Stampeders while they are playing here and shortly after they have been traded. He should work for TMZ he would fit in perfectly.