If the season ended today, which free agents do you keep?

[Inferno]

Originally Posted by EldrickOnIce

100% unanimous in keeping 1-5 in his last 6 Chad Johnson?
OK, I'll be the first to say no then.

He played super-dee-duper teams so he gets a pass.

[EldrickOnIce]

Originally Posted by Inferno

He played super-dee-duper teams so he gets a pass.

Agreed. He gets a pass, right now.
What he doesn't get is a super-dee-duper contract, right now.

[Inferno]

Originally Posted by EldrickOnIce

Agreed. He gets a pass, right now.
What he doesn't get is a super-dee-duper contract, right now.

Oh, I agree. Just poking fun at the double standard around here for some with the goaltending.

[ClubFlames]

I'll re-sign the 14-9-1, 2.27GAA, .922SV%, 3SO Chad Johnson to a 2-3 year deal since he pretty much got us back in the playoff picture this year and will keep us in it as well in my opinion.

[Imported_Aussie]

All the NHL RFAs, Johnson, Gillies, Rittich and that's it.
I let Versteeg walk, as there will be other options out there, and I am not sure he is worth a longer contract. If he keeps going well/finds another gear, then sure, but I am hesitant to commit term to guys who are not clear cut top 6F/4D
I would rather give Chiasson 1 more year than Versteeg 3-4, to keep flexibility

[MarkGio]

Too early in the season. The Flames have 20 games until the trade deadline. If they go on a bad streak and find themselves 4 pts out of a WC spot, that's a different trade deadline that 4 pts comfortably in a playoff spot.

Right now, Nashville could have 46 pts in 43gp. Dallas could have the same record. Vancouver could have 45 pts. So the Flames aren't really secure in the WC spot. It's still a very tight race.

[SeanCharles]

Keep

UFA
Kris Versteeg
Deryk Engelland
Chad Johnson

RFA
Sam Bennett
Alex Chiasson
Micheal Ferland
Garnet Hathaway
Jyrki Jokipakka
Brett Kulak

AHL
Jon Gillies
David Rittich


Gaudreau - Monahan - ?????
Versteeg - Bennett - Brouwer
Tkachuk - Backlund - Frolik
Ferland - Stajan - Chiasson
Bouma/Hathaway

Giordano - Hamilton
Brodie - ?????
Jokipakka - Engelland
Kulak

Johnson
?????

Replace all holes internally (Jankowski/Mangiapane/Kylington/Andersson/Gillies/Rittch) or via free agency/trade.

There is also the possibility we loose a player to expansion so another hole will need to be filled.

[Goodlad]

I'm leery of re-signing Versteeg. He's had a decent "show me" season and will likely be looking for a multi year contract. What he hasn't shown is that he's more durable than in the past. I'd hate to sign him for 2-3 years to take up an LTIR spot

[shadowlord]

I thought Smid was coming off our cap at the end of this season.

[GreenLantern2814]

Originally Posted by Inferno

Oh, I agree. Just poking fun at the double standard around here for some with the goaltending.

Elliott's last five wins have come against Colorado, Arizona, Colorado, Vancouver, and Arizona.

In fact, in total, here are who each goalie has beaten this year:

Elliott:

Colorado x2
Arizona x2
Vancouver
Ottawa
St Louis
Chicago

When you remove the four wins against cupcake opponents, Elliott's numbers for the year are grim.

4-10-1, 3.26 GAA, .881 sv%. 0 Shutouts.

Chad:

Anaheim
Arizona x2
Boston
Columbus
Dallas
Detroit
Minnesota x2
San Jose
Toronto
Winnipeg

Subtract Johnson's Arizona starts.

12-9-1, 2.36 GAA, .919 sv%, 3 shutouts.

Elliott has given up 4+ goals on eight occasions this year; Johnson has given up 4+ in six contests.

Elliott has given up 2 or fewer goals ten times. Chad Johnson has done this 14 times including three shutouts.

Neither are going win Stanley Cups as starters, but I don't see where there's a double standard. One guy is clearly better.

[belsarius]

Originally Posted by New Era

Premature thread is premature.

Can't believe there wasn't a Johnson joke....


Well as good as he has been, I hate all the premature Johnson talk.


The only thing worse than a premature Elliott, is a premature Johnson.


He's been good early, but I'd hate to end up with Johnson blowing it before the end of the season.


That's it.. I'm done.

[Inferno]

Originally Posted by GreenLantern2814

Elliott's last five wins have come against Colorado, Arizona, Colorado, Vancouver, and Arizona.

The thing you're forgetting is yes they were bad teams but he did what was asked of him to get the win. He could have very well been as horrible as he's made out be and lost all five but he didn't. There were numerous times throughout those games where he came up big when needed (ie. 5 on 3 in the third against Arizona) but the people who scapegoat him choose to forget them and focus on just the goals he let in.

Neither are going win Stanley Cups as starters; there's no double standard. One guy is clearly better.

No, they aren't but I've seen them both let in similar goals this year where it's been considered a bad goal for Elliott but for Johnson he had no chance. I'm pretty confident that if it was Elliott playing last night he would have been blamed for the first goal and would have been criticized for "not coming up big" on the second goal and atleast getting the game to OT despite the team playing like ass.

That's what I mean by double standard. Yes, Johnson is having a better season but if it's a bad goal on Elliott it's a bad goal on Johnson. And if a win against a bad team is no big deal for Elliott then it's no big deal for Johnson either.

[GioforPM]

I agree too much is made of the quality of opponent. Elliott has also beaten Chicago, St. Louis, Ottawa, and lost to St. Louis, NYR, LA, NYI, etc.

And you could equally say Johnson got a break playing the Jets that night they crushed them early. Or got off easy in the Anaheim laugher. Or that Elliott had some dismal defensive performances in front of him - the first two games, the Philly game (43 shots), the St. Louis game (40 shots), for example.

I think Johnson has been better, no question. But I agree - the first goal last night was a good play by Buf, and a tough shot, but if Elliott was in he'd be criticized for going down too soon, or "doing a Hiller".

[drewtastic]

Thinking about Wideman lately...

Aside from the incident from last year (or maybe in addition to), Wideman's the guy that frustrates me a tonne. Some games, he's super steady and well-positioned, and others, he's miles away from the play. He also hasn't been able to recapture any part of his magical offence from a couple years ago.

Arguably (and likely with more certainly than that) the Flames must part ways with him at the end of this season--hopefully beforehand (i.e. at the trade deadline). But who replaces him? For all his many frustrations, he's still a pretty skilled D-Man who can move the puck.

There was good discussion on The Fan this morning about the top 4 D. Ideally, one of our young guys on the farm steps up (cough cough Kulak). But even those guys may not be able to play Top 4 minutes next year.

During the Fan discussion, they suggested that the Flames go after a guy like Karl Alzner. I like that idea a lot--adds a lot more ruggedness to the top 4. However, if we aren't able to get someone like this in the offseason, do with bring Wideman back on a one-year deal, hoping that some of the younger guys can develop in time for the 2018-19 season?

[GreenLantern2814]

Originally Posted by Inferno

The thing you're forgetting is yes they were bad teams but he did what was asked of him to get the win. He could have very well been as horrible as he's made out be and lost all five but he didn't. There were numerous times throughout those games where he came up big when needed (ie. 5 on 3 in the third against Arizona) but the people who scapegoat him choose to forget them and focus on just the goals he let in.


No, they aren't but I've seen them both let in similar goals this year where it's been considered a bad goal for Elliott but for Johnson he had no chance. I'm pretty confident that if it was Elliott playing last night he would have been blamed for the first goal and would have been criticized for "not coming up big" on the second goal and atleast getting the game to OT despite the team playing like ass.

That's what I mean by double standard. Yes, Johnson is having a better season but if it's a bad goal on Elliott it's a bad goal on Johnson. And if a win against a bad team is no big deal for Elliott then it's no big deal for Johnson either.

Removing Johnson's cupcake wins doesn't change his numbers in any perceptible way.

Take away Elliott's easy starts and he's Jonas Hiller.

To put it another way, a bad goal for McElhinney might well be a bad goal for Kipper, but one goalie has earned a few mulligans and the other hasn't.

[Inferno]

Originally Posted by GreenLantern2814

Removing Johnson's cupcake wins doesn't change his numbers in any perceptible way.

Take away Elliott's easy starts and he's Jonas Hiller.

You're not getting it. My point isn't about stats. It's about being biased and holding two different standards for both.

[The Fonz]

My guesses/wishlist:

UFA
Kris Versteeg - 2yrs @ 2.4M
Dennis Wideman
Deryk Engelland
Brian Elliott
Chad Johnson - 3yrs @ 3.2M

RFA
Sam Bennett - 2yrs @ 3.0M
Alex Chiasson
Micheal Ferland - 3yrs @ 1.3M
Garnet Hathaway - 2yrs @ 850k
Jyrki Jokipakka - 3yrs @ 950k
Brett Kulak - 2yrs @ 750k

AHL
Brandon Bollig
Linden Vey
Ryan Culkin
Tyler Wotherspoon - 2yrs @ 750k
Kenney Morrison
Jon Gillies - ? No clue on contract
David Rittich - ? Same as above

[GreenLantern2814]

Originally Posted by Inferno

You're not getting it. My point isn't about stats. It's about being biased and holding two different standards for both.

But what's wrong with that? One player has been objectively bad for most of the year. One player has been objectively good for most of the year.

When you're good, you get the benefit of the doubt. Johnny Gaudreau has 45 giveaways and nobody really cares. If Alex Chiasson had 45 giveaways, he'd be in Stockton.

Fans feel more comfortable with Johnson in net. The team feels more comfortable with Johnson in net. That has less to do with bias and more to do with reality. Right now, one is vastly better than the other, so much that it hardly merits discussing.

[Inferno]

Originally Posted by GreenLantern2814

But what's wrong with that? One player has been objectively bad for most of the year. One player has been objectively good for most of the year.

When you're good, you get the benefit of the doubt. Johnny Gaudreau has 45 giveaways and nobody really cares. If Alex Chiasson had 45 giveaways, he'd be in Stockton.

Fans feel more comfortable with Johnson in net. The team feels more comfortable with Johnson in net. That has less to do with bias and more to do with reality. Right now, one is vastly better than the other, so much that it hardly merits discussing.

They might not hold it against him for the season but they still call him out for bad plays. They also can give Chiasson props for good plays rather than think of excuses as to why he was lucky they happened.

I'm not saying fans should flip out when Johnson lets in a softie and want to run him out of town because overall he's played well this season. But if he lets in a goal that Elliott was crucified for say it was a bad goal too and move on rather than try and make excuses for him. That IS being biased.

[TheScorpion]

I guess I have yet to contribute to my own thread. Here goes nothing. All numbers AAV.

UFA
Kris Versteeg - 2 years, 2.35 million
Dennis Wideman - gone
Deryk Engelland - 1 year, 2 million
Brian Elliott - gone
Chad Johnson - 2 years, 3.35 million

RFA
Sam Bennett - 3 years, 3.25 million
Alex Chiasson - 2 years, 1.1 million
Micheal Ferland - 2 years, 1.4 million
Garnet Hathaway - 3 years, 1 million
Jyrki Jokipakka - 3 years, $975k
Brett Kulak - 3 years, $880k

AHL
Brandon Bollig - gone
Linden Vey - gone
Ryan Culkin - gone
Tyler Wotherspoon - gone
Kenney Morrison - 1 year, $650k
Jon Gillies - 2 years, $1 million
David Rittich - 2 years, $845k