Are Canadians High?

[Cowboy]

I am all for taxing the snot out of it...that way we can put more money into social programs that help people who abuse these sorts of drugs, including liquor, creating more money for things like military,, and other areas that we have not been giving enough in the last years. I think overall it would decrease our problems if people had ways to fight them (less on the streets, less drug related crimes).

[RogerWilco]

Originally posted by Cowboy@Aug 30 2004, 01:32 AM
Do be perfectly honest, I don't mind the weed thing because I don't think weed is all that bad for you. If they think everyone does all the other drugs then I have a problem with it and I think something should be done.

I think if you said weed isn't that bad in relation to legal drugs like alcohol and tobacco I would agree with you. But yes weed is bad for you. But going back to the original post, no there isn't rampant use here compared to other places, unless there is some underworld I have not found the joys of. I lived in Colorado for 4 years and to my knowledge the use there was not any less then the use here. Now my personal experience is not a great scale of drug use in North America. All that I know is I don't walk down the streets and see people baked all over the place. I think they may be reading to much into one snow boarder at the winter Olympics 6 years ago.

[RogerWilco]

Originally posted by Mean Mr. Mustard+Aug 30 2004, 01:36 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Mean Mr. Mustard @ Aug 30 2004, 01:36 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-Cowboy@Aug 30 2004, 01:32 AM
Do be perfectly honest, I don't mind the weed thing because I don't think weed is all that bad for you. If they think everyone does all the other drugs then I have a problem with it and I think something should be done.

Tell that to my friend, he lost an arm due to weed.

By the way I have never used drugs and I don't really see why someone would want to use them to be honest with you. [/b][/quote]
This is a searious question, how can someone lose an arm due to weed?

[Thunderball]

Originally posted by Cowboy+Aug 29 2004, 08:20 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Cowboy @ Aug 29 2004, 08:20 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>

Well, I do go to the U of C... maybe the University of 9-5 doesn't have it as noticably as U of A.

Take a walk down to the bottom Social Sciences, the stairs of the library. People smoke pot there all the time. I have smelled it in Mac Hall for God Sakes, its everywhere, and I mean every where. [/b][/quote]
Thats very true... I've smelled it rather prominently in the basements of Craigie Hall and Social Sciences too, but I guess I figured it was a lot more prominent in other places, aside from people occasionally smoking it on campus.

[RougeUnderoos]

Originally posted by CaptainCrunch+Aug 29 2004, 10:05 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (CaptainCrunch @ Aug 29 2004, 10:05 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>

Define terrorist groups Cap'n, if you would. I've heard this argument before but it just doesn't wash for me. No doubt some drugs line the pockets of terrorists, but I can't see how a suburban grow-house in Surrey funds terrorism.

I don't think we really know what goes into cigarettes either. They don't print the ingredients on the side of the box. But they are (hopefully) regulated so I get your point.

Some of the Mexican rebel groups have been linked to the dope trade in the past, just like Hash financed the Afghan rebels.

the truth is when you buy dope from a drug dealer you don't know where tje money is going, what else he sells, and who his partners are.

Are you willing to take the chance that the harmless guy that you buy grass off of isn't buying it from some guy who uses that money to buy hash or cocaine that is provided by terrorist groups in south America, or eastern europe, or the middle east.

The IRA used to stay clear of drugs and actually used to go after drug dealers in Ireland, but when thier funding from the soviet block dried up they got into the cocaine business which led to the arrest of three IRA members in Columbia as they tried to create a drug tunnel into Europe back in 2001.

Your right about the cigarette thing tho, we don't know what goes into smokes, but they do have to hit a certain standard to keep in business. Dope growers don't


.

Sorry I thought about this some more after having a beer, and the other concern with the current situation is you can't tell me that all of the dope sold in Canada comes from and inncocent grow house in Surrey, B.C. [/b][/quote]
Funny thing -- I agree with your solution (legalize, tax) but I'm me, so I'm still going to argue.

the truth is when you buy dope from a drug dealer you don't know where tje money is going, what else he sells, and who his partners are.

Are you willing to take the chance that the harmless guy that you buy grass off of isn't buying it from some guy who uses that money to buy hash or cocaine that is provided by terrorist groups in south America, or eastern europe, or the middle east

I don't know where my money is going regardless of the product I am buying. The fertilizer (for the grass, err, lawn I bought today) might be funding and alien invasion for all I know.

If I buy a tank of gas from Gas Station X, I don't know where the money is going either. Actually I've heard things about that particular product and where the profits go, but I don't want to swing off-topic on the OT board.

I don't know that all the dope in Canada comes from a grow-op in Surrey. In fact, I'm certain it doesn't, unless it's one hell of a big house :P . Most of the weed smoked by weed-smokers likely comes from that place called NotTooFar.

Smuggling reefer into western Canada makes as much sense as smuggling chocolate into Belgium.

Anyhoo... tell me more abou this "drug tunnel". I've never heard of it.

[RogerWilco]

Originally posted by CaptainCrunch+Aug 30 2004, 04:05 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (CaptainCrunch @ Aug 30 2004, 04:05 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>

Define terrorist groups Cap'n, if you would. I've heard this argument before but it just doesn't wash for me. No doubt some drugs line the pockets of terrorists, but I can't see how a suburban grow-house in Surrey funds terrorism.

I don't think we really know what goes into cigarettes either. They don't print the ingredients on the side of the box. But they are (hopefully) regulated so I get your point.

Some of the Mexican rebel groups have been linked to the dope trade in the past, just like Hash financed the Afghan rebels.

the truth is when you buy dope from a drug dealer you don't know where tje money is going, what else he sells, and who his partners are.

Are you willing to take the chance that the harmless guy that you buy grass off of isn't buying it from some guy who uses that money to buy hash or cocaine that is provided by terrorist groups in south America, or eastern europe, or the middle east.

The IRA used to stay clear of drugs and actually used to go after drug dealers in Ireland, but when thier funding from the soviet block dried up they got into the cocaine business which led to the arrest of three IRA members in Columbia as they tried to create a drug tunnel into Europe back in 2001.

Your right about the cigarette thing tho, we don't know what goes into smokes, but they do have to hit a certain standard to keep in business. Dope growers don't


.

Sorry I thought about this some more after having a beer, and the other concern with the current situation is you can't tell me that all of the dope sold in Canada comes from and inncocent grow house in Surrey, B.C. [/b][/quote]
To be fair, you don't know where the money goes from any product you buy. Illegal drugs just get more of a reputation because...well they are illegal.

[CaptainCrunch]

conversely with tabacco, liquor and gun companies you can at least trace the money and its auditable, with a underground business like drugs you don't get an accounting for the funds.

Personally one of the reasons that I'm all for getting big business involved in something like the grass business is cause you can be sure that the money won't be used to by guns and explosives etc.

Drug dealers in my mind no matter what the drugs are death dealers and I do like what the chinese do to them.

[calculoso]

Does it matter where the money from other products goes?

We know that a lot of drug money goes to support terrorism. We know it goes to support mobs, etc.

Why try to minimize it?

[calf]

Originally posted by calculoso@Aug 29 2004, 11:05 PM
Does it matter where the money from other products goes?

We know that a lot of drug money goes to support terrorism. We know it goes to support mobs, etc.

Why try to minimize it?

I hope you typed this out wrong. The way I read it, it says why bother minimizing the amount of money going towards mobs, terrorists etc.

[RougeUnderoos]

Originally posted by CaptainCrunch@Aug 29 2004, 11:02 PM
conversely with tabacco, liquor and gun companies you can at least trace the money and its auditable, with a underground business like drugs you don't get an accounting for the funds.

Personally one of the reasons that I'm all for getting big business involved in something like the grass business is cause you can be sure that the money won't be used to by guns and explosives etc.

Drug dealers in my mind no matter what the drugs are death dealers and I do like what the chinese do to them.

I hear you, but I think you are giving a little too much credit to cigarette companies. Isn't one of them (RJR Macdonald maybe) in hot water now for shifty business practices/smuggling/tax evasion?

Multinational tobacco companies and booze merchants and gun manufacturers are no more ethical than the dude who sells reefer. They are all to make a buck. The pedlars of weed, smokes, guns and hooch are all in the same boat. They want money, and the less taxes and control on it, the happier they are going to be.

[Displaced Flames fan]

Can anyone who uses marijuana on a daily basis for enjoyment make an argument for it's 'unharmfulness' withouth bringing up other vices?

Just curious.

It's the only answer I've ever seen from regular smokers. It's weak.

I've watched marijuana destroy the lives of 2 people I cared about. It's not harmless.

[MrMastodonFarm]

Originally posted by Displaced Flames fan@Aug 29 2004, 11:48 PM
Can anyone who uses marijuana on a daily basis for enjoyment make an argument for it's 'unharmfulness' withouth bringing up other vices?

My brother did pot very regularly a couple years back, we don't live together or anything, nor at the time but I would say he did it maybe once a day.

He functioned very well in everyday life, but he used it at the end of the day to relax, much like having a good stiff drink or a cigar at the end of the day. I honestly didn't see the big deal. He has now quit.

I don't know if that helps with your question Dis, but hope so.

By the way, did you get my PM?

[Thunderball]

I can say I know a couple people who will definitely not reach their intellectual potential because of pot... a little here and there probably won't hurt you, but every day for years will more than likely damage your brain permanently.

Comparing it to Alcohol and Tobacco is a laughably weak excuse, good point DFF. I laugh every time I hear that one. Drinking a glass of wine a day (which IS alcohol) will actually keep you healthy and prolong your life. Marijuana dulls the senses and has a growing effect over time... thats why it takes less to get high the more you smoke it.

But hey, part of living in a free society is letting people make stupid decisions and face the consequences on taxpayer coin. We all try it, we all experiment, and those who rely on it get what's coming, and sadly, with public medicare, we all pay.

[Cowboy]

I don't think it is harmless...but I think there are other things more important...Obesity is a bigger problem in our country than weed, so is drinking, so is tobacco smoke. So I think if we want to solve the problem of weed it is only fair if we address the problem of Booze and Tobacco, or Fast Food for that matter.

I don't smoke weed, I drink, so I am defending from a fair point of view.

Legal doesn't make it o.k.

[MrMastodonFarm]

Originally posted by Thunderball@Aug 29 2004, 11:56 PM
Comparing it to Alcohol and Tobacco is a laughably weak excuse, good point DFF. I laugh every time I hear that one. Drinking a glass of wine a day (which IS alcohol)

I noticed you didn't do the comparision for Tabacco? Why is that?

Pot is like anything, too much of it is stupid. I don't do it myself, but in moderation I really don't mind if others do it, just like I don't mind if someone winds the day down with a stiff drink or a cigar etc.

[Displaced Flames fan]

Got your PM AP...I will reply soon.

I assume your brother was fairly young and free of responsibilites at the time?

Did his job employ random drug testing?

One of my very best friends in the world decided smoking pot everyday was more important to him than anything in his life. As a result, a heavy equipment operator with 5 years of military experience makes $6 an hour, has forgotten all the dreams he used to tell me about and uses most of the 'money' he makes to pay his restitution for an arrest he had for possession of methamphetamine. (nice how the two offset each other isn't it?)

My cousin committed suicide because he couldn't quit.

Not saying marijuana made him kill himself, I'm not that shallow, but it's something that he couldn't overcome.

Millions of similar stories with alchohol as well. Not denying that. Doesn't change a thing though.

[Cowboy]

Originally posted by Thunderball@Aug 29 2004, 11:56 PM
I can say I know a couple people who will definitely not reach their intellectual potential because of pot... a little here and there probably won't hurt you, but every day for years will more than likely damage your brain permanently.

Comparing it to Alcohol and Tobacco is a laughably weak excuse, good point DFF. I laugh every time I hear that one. Drinking a glass of wine a day (which IS alcohol) will actually keep you healthy and prolong your life. Marijuana dulls the senses and has a growing effect over time... thats why it takes less to get high the more you smoke it.

But hey, part of living in a free society is letting people make stupid decisions and face the consequences on taxpayer coin. We all try it, we all experiment, and those who rely on it get what's coming, and sadly, with public medicare, we all pay.

Nothing p*sses me off more than a Holier than thou attitude...I garuntee you that you do things that cost the taxpayers money. So don't pretend that you are paying for all the poor saps in the world that have made bad decisions when you haven't. It is not laughable to compare it to Alcohol, or Tobacco. Tobacco cost the taxpayers more dollars. We are not talking about the one glass of wine a day, we are talking about the people who get p*ssed on Friday, Saturday, and maybe a few times during the week. Eating healthy is good for the heart to, why don't you just do that instead of drinking the wine!!!.

[MrMastodonFarm]

Originally posted by Displaced Flames fan@Aug 30 2004, 12:04 AM
I assume your brother was fairly young and free of responsibilites at the time?

Nope, the opposite actually. Was a month into a brand new career, had done it before -- like most people in their youth -- but enjoyed some pot every now and then. Not sure about the random drug tests, I will try to find out though. He quit.. just like that. Guess certain things just effect certain people different ways.

I suppose some people just get addicted to certain things however. In North America we are seeing way too many people with real serious food addictions, and I wouldn't label food bad, but I am probably being too vauge.

Sorry to hear about your losses, Scott.

[calculoso]

Originally posted by calf@Aug 29 2004, 11:08 PM
I hope you typed this out wrong. The way I read it, it says why bother minimizing the amount of money going towards mobs, terrorists etc.

Yeah, I did type that out wrong.

I meant, why minimize the fact that drug money does go to terrorists, etc by making the parallel that someone doesn't know where the money for other products goes either?

Hope that's more clear. Thanks for catching that.

[Kobasew7]

As someone in the states I can say I do tell some of my pot smoking friends they should go to BC or Amsterdam because it would be heaven for them. So I guess the stereo-type is starting to stick..but I don't think it's a bad one.

As far as the weed thing goes.. I don't see the problem in legalizing it. The problem with the entire drug war in america and else where is it costs more money and lives than if it was just legalized, taxed and sold in stores by the government. Drug dealers will kill someone for not paying up, because they will sell it to junkies who promise to pay them later. Ever try this tactic in a grocery store or else where? Don't think so..and if you did, would they give it to you? I'd say 100% no. Not to mention drug dealers are normally sketchy characters at best.. selling it in the store would put them out of business or would force them to drop prices substantially enough to make it not worth thier time or efforts growing it and distributing it.

I've always been a fan of just letting the junkies kill thier brain cells if they want too as long as I'm not getting mugged while they support thier own habit. If the government sold it taxed but fairly cheap (say a pack of joints cost the same $4 bucks as cigerettes) than there would be no need for a junkie to go steal. This goes for all the other drugs as well..

and another problem you run into buying off the streets is the risk of getting laced stuff. Drug dealers will lace somethings to get you really stoned and addicted to make you come back over and over. I am not a pothead by anymeans and have only smoked a few times..what ruined it for me was getting some laced pot and spending about 20 minutes sitting in my car thinking I was going to die because I couldn't breath.

All this could be controlled by legalization by the government. I guess a whole different topic all together, but really just 1 in the same.