Calgarypuck Prospect Ranking 2016 - Round 4

[JiriHrdina]

Kylington or Hickey for me. Went Hickey but it was close. Rasmus is further down for me due to two years of conditioning issues

[Alberta_Beef]

Hunter Shinkaruk

[Lanny_McDonald]

The first top decision of the poll series. You have two really good young defenseman, and you have to decide which has the best potential to make the team and have a positive impact. Went with Hickey over Kyllington, but it's close. Both are effortless skaters, but one of them just appears to be superior in the defensive end. Kyllington might provide more offense, but I see his defensive game not achieving the same standard as Hickey. For that reason Hickey gets the nod.

[Cali Panthers Fan]

Just a thought, for those considering between Kylington or Andersson (drafted just a few spots from one another), think about which one progressed more in their areas of weakness last year.

To me, very few guys are fully developed or well rounded at the time of their draft. What matters most beyond having an NHL skill set is how the players progress once their weaknesses have been addressed.

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by flamesfan55

After seeing this list I feel we have a lot of low end talent.

That is typically the see when a team has 2 top line forwards 23 and under, another forward who is only 20 with top line upside and a multi time 40+or Dman already on the NHL roster. The organization still has 5 prospects picked in the first round in the pool and 2 of those players won the polls as our best 2 prospects. I was leaning towards Shinkaruk here but ultimately chose Kylington who has unreal upside

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by JiriHrdina

Most organizations have a very small set of true high end prospects and a long list of long shots and lower talent projects. If anything the Flames have more higher end talent in the system than they have had traditionally

Top ten picks are special.

They come in and they graduate. They are the perfect storm of high potential and high likelihood.

Ideally a team's next tier has a handful of guys that could play in the upper half of your team but don't have the can't miss tag on them. If a team has say 1 of those players then there's a problem as I'm sure you need four of them to get one to reach that pinnacle.

The Flames have the one can't miss guy in Tkachuk.

But then I think they have a good 7 or so guys that could be top 4 dmen, a starting goaltender or a top six forward.

Gillies, Jankowski, Anderssen, Kylington, Hickey, Shinkaruk, Parsons, Dube, Fox, Poirier to name a few.

I think that's what makes the Calgary list better now than almost at any point that I've ever looked at it.

It's not scratching the bottom of the barrel where you have to put a guy with third line projection into your top five.

[Parallex]

It's either Kylington or Shinkaruk... I'd be tempted to put Shinkaruk there since I think he's closest to making the NHL but Kylington's tools are just so loud I can't ignore them.

[N26]

Originally Posted by Cali Panthers Fan

Just a thought, for those considering between Kylington or Andersson (drafted just a few spots from one another), think about which one progressed more in their areas of weakness last year.

To me, very few guys are fully developed or well rounded at the time of their draft. What matters most beyond having an NHL skill set is how the players progress once their weaknesses have been addressed.

Ah more developmental progression talk. My favourite aspect of prospect discussion.

But what are Andersson's identified weaknesses other than too much time in the snack aisle at Superstore It is actually kind of difficult to see much difference between his first and second OHL seasons unless you saw him play a lot or have access to more than the basic stats on the OHL site. Which I did/do not. Perhaps someone else knows more? Do we actually know what else he most clearly has to work on? Kylington's areas of weakness seem more obvious and identifiable.

Can anybody suggest what Andersson needs to work on besides his fitness issues?

[Lanny_McDonald]

Originally Posted by flamesfan55

After seeing this list I feel we have a lot of low end talent.

That's a pretty poor assessment of our talent pool. The Flames are blessed with some very good depth at a lot of positions. You must be forgetting that these players are going to be cast in support roles to players already on the team? When you consider that our last four drafts recouped Monahan, Bennett, Hamilton, and Tkachuk, that is a ridiculous starting place. Having the number of quality prospects we have is a tip of the hat to the scouts. I don't know of a team that would trade their defensive prospect pool for ours. Our forwards undersized, but there is talent there. The goaltending situation is also one of the best in the league. I think you are really selling this pool short.

[Greybeard]

^^^ Agree, we cannot expect to draft top 3 forwards or defence with everyone we draft in rounds 2-7. This is where we draft the support people for Monahan, Bennett, Hamilton, Tkachuk and Johnny. We may find a gem in the rough on occasion (Brodie, Gio, etc) that will actually fit into the elite positions but for the most part after our top 3 or 4 prospects you are looking for the Backlund's who will give your team depth at a reasonable cap hit.

[Displaced Flames fan]

Originally Posted by Bingo

can't wait to get informed how I voted incorrectly ... but Kylington.

Surprised I have him above Anderssen but the two seem to have flopped standing this summer.

I went Anderssen, but I think there are a few guys right there with each other.

[ricardodw]

What happened to Poirier?

He totally has dropped off from being on the cusp of NHL ready. He went from a .75 ppg +7 19 year old to a .48 ppg -14 20 year old.

Has his focus changed from being a top-6 to being a bottom-6 player?

What happened to his NHL level skills?

Has he been injured?



How did the Heat as a team become so overmatched?

What happened in Stockton last season. They were loaded with what we at CP considered great prospects and there did not seem to be any significant development.

The 2 best players Agostino and Grant are on 2-way contracts with other teams. The other top AHLer that CP was worried about loosing on waivers ... Drew Shore remains an unsigned UFA. The only top AHL players from last years roster still with the Flames organization are Freddie Hamilton and Shinkaruk.

32 year old Aaron Johnson was by far the most prolific scoring defenseman!!

If Kylington put up Aaron Johnson sort of numbers pretty sure there would be some CPers wondering if he was going to be 3/4 or 5/6 in the Flames lineup.

As it turns out our Erik Karlsson level prospect put up .26 ppg ....nominally beating out defense first d-man Sieloff (.21 ppg) 12 pts to 11 .... they were both in contention for the team/league worst Plus/minus at -16 and -17.

[Regorium]

I think I'm most disappointed with Poirier and Klimchuk.

2013 seemed to be a huge coup for us but it turns out to be just a complete bust after Monahan.

I guess I expected at least some glimpses of NHL-readiness from at least someone else from the 2013 draft by now, and I think that's where the main gap in our prospect pool lies. 2013 prospects that have developed well should be top 5 and ready to graduate this year. Instead, we don't have anyone.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by Red Menace

Shinkaruk is our best prospect forward after Tkachuk.
Should be higher than Jankowski in my opinion.
I have some D higher than him, but he is #5 on my list.

I don't get the attraction of Shinkaruk. Don't get me wrong, I think he is a good prospect, and easily in the top end of Calgary's system, but I don't see enough in his game that suggests he will project to be a top-six forward, or in the top-five of this list. Shinkaruk does not have anything like the tool set possessed by Jankowski, which I think sets him fairly entrenched in the top-three.

Shinkaruk is a wildcard. It's great to have a few of these players in the system.

[Vulcan]

I went with Andersson over Shinkaruk and Kylington. Andersson has the size and the tools to be a top four defenceman. I like the other two but size is still a limiting factor for both.

As for Hickey, I have him 13th. I like that he's grown and he has the tools but I haven't been impressed by his play in College or at the World Juniors this last season. They're all prospects though and by definition can make big moves up or down.

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

I don't get the attraction of Shinkaruk. Don't get me wrong, I think he is a good prospect, and easily in the top end of Calgary's system, but I don't see enough in his game that suggests he will project to be a top-six forward, or in the top-five of this list. Shinkaruk does not have anything like the tool set possessed by Jankowski, which I think sets him fairly entrenched in the top-three.

Shinkaruk is a wildcard. It's great to have a few of these players in the system.

Really? Shinkaruk has gorgeous edgework in his skating, an elite compete level to battle and win in corners and then make strong plays, and great goal-scoring sense and skill to tip point shots. Showed excellent hands in tight and has a backhand that resembles Crosby himself. In fact his whole game oozes of Crosby, you can see the influence - not a bad player to emulate for someone his size.

I still have Kylington and Andersson ahead of him on my list (but my top 5 doesn't have Gillies) but this young man impressed me a lot. Could end up a 55-65 point forward. Two-way play seemed to be his weakness which ought to improve with experience.

[Torture]

Tough choice between Kylington and Hickey. Could easily flip a coin. I chose Kylington because you can't teach that type of offensive instinct.

Quite the embarrassment of riches at this point. You can't expect them all to turn out in this range but even if only one or two of the names people are debating (Kylington, Hickey, Andersson, Shinkaruk) turn into a player the Flames will be laughing.

Amazing how high Jankowski jumped in the poll. Guess we're no longer calling that pick a bust eh?

[Lanny_McDonald]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

Shinkaruk is a wildcard. It's great to have a few of these players in the system.

I think people are missing the fact that you are developing support players on the farm for the most part. You may have two or three guys that have potential to jump in and contribute in the top six, but the reality is that if these guys were that good they would have made the jump directly from their developmental league to the NHL, or after a season in the minors at worst. The guys that hit the AHL have some warts to their game and they need to be developed. Like I said, there could be two or three guys that could possibly break that mold and find a top end role, but those are few and far between. Opportunity plays a very big role in these guys getting the chance to make the jump.

With Shinkaruk I see a guy that is a complimentary player who will have a role until someone bigger/better comes along. The second he stops producing is the second an opportunity opens up for another player, simply because of his size and inability to contribute in other areas. I see him as a good fit (for now) on the top two lines. But that time is likely fleeting if he doesn't become a consistent 25-30 goal guy.

A guy like Jankowski is one of those players that is an exception. Poirier might be as well. They both have great skill sets and character, and they can play up and down the lineup. Flexibility is a big thing when you're trying to break in from the farm, so guys that can play various roles have a chance of taking a full time position and then working their way into a bigger role. I expect both Jankowski and Poirier to do that. I think Jankowski becomes an elite level third line center, kind of like Staal was in Pittsburgh. Poirier likely finds his way to the NHL as a third liner then works his way up the lineup as injuries hit. I think a guy like Brouwer will be key to the development of Poirier once he arrives.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

What happened to Poirier?

Has his focus changed from being a top-6 to being a bottom-6 player?

What happened to his NHL level skills?

Has he been injured?

First off I've never cared about the on ice success of an AHL team. Don't get me wrong, we have lots of guys that cover the team for us, and they care and with that so do I.

But prospect success and AHL standings almost never line up.

The Flames won the championship with Saint John led by Marty Murray, Dave Roche, Rico Fata and Daniel Tkaczuk. Saint John Flames 2001

Specific players can concern me though ... your questions on Poirier are good ... what happened? I think I took it from Huska that he may have thought he had that level beat and either didn't do enough in the last off season or showed up thinking it would be easy. That's an interesting cross roads for a player, so it will be interesting to see what he does this year.

Kylington? No concerns at all.

18 in a new league, in a new country ... plus he was drafted at 60 when once at 5 and needed to learn defense.

He had a great year from my standpoint.

I think the Grants and Agostino's are gone because they don't want the team lead by players that they don't project, but that's just me guessing.

[Red Menace]

I think a lot of fans have spent years convincing themselves that Jankowksi and Poirier are going to be good, and also spent years thinking Canuck prospect Shinkaruk must be bad.
I think there is some bias there for sure, whether conscious or not.
I like all 3, but I don't think any one of them is clearly ahead of the other 2...
I have them in order as Shinkaruk, Jankowski, Poirier, numbers 5,6,8 on my list.
I think there's a decent chance Shinkaruk will be a top 6 forward for us next season.