Federal Budget 2016: $29B Deficit

[heep223]

Originally Posted by Slava

Well I'm sure that someone else will take up the cause, but crediting the past CPC government with being fiscal conservatives is just revisionist history. Half of the things you're giving them credit for here aren't even their doing, or at best they had to be forced to do or face the consequences of a coalition government.

Ok.

The Federal Conservative government was leading our country, and navigated us through the worst financial collapse since the great depression and then subsequently balanced our budget. You can rationalize all you want but that is a fact.

Listen I voted Liberal because Harper and the boys were getting way too socially conservative for our country and I disagreed with almost all of their social policy. But you can't argue that they didn't do a good job with the economy from 2006-2015 during a very difficult macro environment.

[Looch City]

As long as they don't use the budget to put up ten million "Action Plan" signs across the country.

[Frequitude]

Holy ****! I don't even need to mock the Liberals. That number does it for itself, especially when compared to the $10B election promise. What a bunch of buffoons.

Any info on what the infrastructure money will be spent on?

[polak]

As a young middle class single white dude, I couldn't care less about your tax credits.

[Looch City]

Originally Posted by Frequitude

Holy ****! I don't even need to mock the Liberals. That number does it for itself, especially when compared to the $10B election promise. What a bunch of buffoons.

Any info on what the infrastructure money will be spent on?

"The 2016 budget begins fulfilling the Liberal pledge to spend $120 billion on new and existing infrastructure over 10 years.

Phase one will focus immediately on public transit, water and wastewater systems, and affordable housing "

http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/fede...main-1.3501802

[Coach]

Originally Posted by heep223

Ok.

The Federal Conservative government was leading our country, and navigated us through the worst financial collapse since the great depression and then subsequently balanced our budget. You can rationalize all you want but that is a fact.

Listen I voted Liberal because Harper and the boys were getting way too socially conservative for our country and I disagreed with almost all of their social policy. But you can't argue that they didn't do a good job with the economy from 2006-2015 during a very difficult macro environment.

And what do we have now?

It's a big deficit, no doubt. Personally I don't think it can be judged until we're through this energy crisis.

Originally Posted by Jacks

Well we all know that the Cons are horrible debt mongers, we need the Liberals to come in and clean up the mess and get us back to surpluses. That was the narritave a year ago right?
Then the narrative became that we need to run small deficits.
Now the narritive is that we need to run huge deficits.

It's almost like during that time period our highest value export was trending down hard. Should their plans not have adjusted based on what is happening?

[Fuzz]

Just posting this because people have very short memories. $30 Billion sounds big, but looking at history...we were basically there from 1977-1996, and yes, a few time since the Harper years too. Heck, even 2012 we were there. Not so long ago.

[OMG!WTF!]

Originally Posted by MattyC

And what do we have now?

It's a big deficit, no doubt. Personally I don't think it can be judged until we're through this energy crisis.?

What if we don't get through the energy crisis? Seems like crossing fingers might not be the vest strategy.

[Street Pharmacist]

Originally Posted by heep223

Ok.

The Federal Conservative government was leading our country, and navigated us through the worst financial collapse since the great depression and then subsequently balanced our budget. You can rationalize all you want but that is a fact.

Listen I voted Liberal because Harper and the boys were getting way too socially conservative for our country and I disagreed with almost all of their social policy. But you can't argue that they didn't do a good job with the economy from 2006-2015 during a very difficult macro environment.

Successfully navigating the financial crisis has waaaaaaaaaayyyyy more to legislative and fiscal policies that Harper's CPC simply cannot take credit for

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by heep223

Ok.

The Federal Conservative government was leading our country, and navigated us through the worst financial collapse since the great depression and then subsequently balanced our budget. You can rationalize all you want but that is a fact.

.

By navigating, you mean reaping the rewards of the Martin/Chretien Liberal policies enacted before they came to power and then enacting stimulus after the opposition parties forced them too?


This deficit spending is what has to happen after years of neglect. It's like claiming that you saved money over a decade by not paying for regular maintenance on your car, but then complain about the cost when you need to do major repairs.

[Jacks]

Originally Posted by MattyC

It's almost like during that time period our highest value export was trending down hard. Should their plans not have adjusted based on what is happening?

Please explain what has changed, since the election, to cause the additional 20B in debt?
Oil was in the crapper then also, pretty sure oil prices are actually better today.

[Coach]

Originally Posted by OMG!WTF!

What if we don't get through the energy crisis? Seems like crossing fingers might not be the vest strategy.

Well it's pretty much what everyone is doing, government or private business. What else is their to do? We've tied our economy almost solely to a volatile resource that we have no control over the price of and can only produce a profit at twice the price of other nations. We've all been collectively crossing our fingers and betting on oil for a long time.

[Codes]

A lot of money being spent to re-open facilities closed under Conservative rule. Also seems like a lot of money being pledged towards science, technology and innovation. There is even money to support Canada's role on the International Space Station.

[Johnny199r]

Our cities and Provinces keep borrowing and going further into debt, why not the Canadian government?

It's not like we'll ever pay it off. Some future generation will be screwed by our love of borrowing, but we'll be long dead.mwhy does anyone act like this is important?

It would be nice if he had no debt because no government borrowed in the first place, but hey, we demand lots of things we can't afford.

[llwhiteoutll]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

Just posting this because people have very short memories. $30 Billion sounds big, but looking at history...we were basically there from 1977-1996, and yes, a few time since the Harper years too. Heck, even 2012 we were there. Not so long ago.

You left out that the huge dip in 2009/2010 was pretty much the direct fault of the Liberals and NDP.

[Fuzz]

You're right. The surpluses are all Harper's, and every deficit is the result of Liberals.

[heep223]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

Just posting this because people have very short memories. $30 Billion sounds big, but looking at history...we were basically there from 1977-1996, and yes, a few time since the Harper years too. Heck, even 2012 we were there. Not so long ago.

Weird, in the 2016 budget itself it shows the deficit in 2011 as being around $25B:

Spoiler!

Also the chart you posted I think is a bit simplistic because it doesn't take GDP into account. But your point stands regardless. I think the $30B deficit would take us to around -2%.



That doesn't come close to the deficits Trudeau's dad ran.

[heep223]

Originally Posted by Street Pharmacist

Successfully navigating the financial crisis has waaaaaaaaaayyyyy more to legislative and fiscal policies that Harper's CPC simply cannot take credit for

Care to elaborate? The ruling party tables legislative and fiscal policy no? (I am not that educated in this)

[Enoch Root]

partisan pissing matches are the best!

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by llwhiteoutll

You left out that the huge dip in 2009/2010 was pretty much the direct fault of the Liberals and NDP.

As Heep said, this doesn't take into account the size of the economy.

The one big, indisputable fact that it does illustrate, is that the deficit blew up in the 70s and 80s.

And it did so for one simple reason: Pierre Elliot Trudeau believed that spending on infrastructure was a good thing, and leaving the bill for future generations, with inflation shrinking the actual impact, was the way to pay for it.

Then one day, with interest rates in the double digits, and 40% of government spending was going to interest to service the debt, people woke up to the fact that having a giant debt load was actually a bad thing.

As someone mentioned, Martin cut the deficit, to his credit, but he did it largely by transferring the problem to the provinces.

I fear that history has begun to repeat itself once again.