[CP Story] What Treliving Should Do

[Super-Rye]

I agree with a lot of what you said.

I like the Wideman for Howard trade idea for a couple reasons. It gives the Flames somewhat of a long term solution in goal while Gillies develops, it moves money from the Flames blueline (where they Flames have too much money tied up in going into next season) and moves it to the net. Also getting a player like Jurco would be very interesting as the Flames are not deep on the RW and will probably move 2 of their top 3 right wingers before the deadline.

However I feel like Detroit wouldn't do that deal until the draft unless the Flames added a goalie and ate some of salary. The Red Wings are in a playoff push and aren't a team that usually paints themselves into a corner. Moving Howard means Mrazek is their guy going forward, which is no surprise, but if he goes down to injury they don't have a whole lot there.

Wideman + Ramo (50% salart retained) + 6th for Howard + Jurco

Would be a decent trade for both teams I think. With that said, taking on Howard's contract is a little scary and he has struggled the last couple of seasons so there's risk there, and I can see why some people wouldn't like that trade.

I like your suggestion of splitting up Gaudreau and Monahan, and putting Bennett at center. Try Gaudreau + Bennett and see if Bennett can use his big man game to make more space for Gaudreau.

I'd like to see Colborne back on Monahan's wing. Their first season with the Flames they showed some chemistry but with Monahan attached to Gaudreau's hip and Colborne and Gaudreau's game not complimenting each other, they haven't played together much since. See if Colborne can be a playmaker for Monahan. (Also I would like to see Colborne shoot more. He's got a pretty good shot and getting him to shoot more will only keep defenses honest. With that said, Colborne will always be more of a playmaker.)

The only thing I don't agree with is trading Colborne if someone offers up a 3rd. As I said earlier the Flames are probably going to be dropping 2 of their top 3 RW's. Moving Colborne for a 3rd creates a bigger hole on the right side, for an asset that won't pay off for 4 or 5 years. I'm not saying Colborne is untouchable. I like his size and as you alluded too he likes to tease. Potential is a dangerous word these days, but the Flames are weak on the right side and he is an NHL player with some years of control, I would only move him for a player of similar ilk who management feels might be a better fit for whatever reason.

As you said, the rest of this season should be about development and getting a head start for next season. Last year they were able to carry their strong play from the previous season over, and it got them into the playoffs. Try to replicate that.

Find out what you have in guys like Grant, Nakladal, and Shore. See what holes in the roster you can fill internally and try to eliminate some of the question marks early. The team had a lot of question marks coming into this season, mostly in the crease, and it seemed to affect their play for the first month while they found their way.

Try putting Backlund and Granlund on the wing and run with Bennett Monahan Stajan and Grant as the 4 centers. Maybe try a Granlund - Monahan - Colborne line. I know the organization has been pretty steadfast in having Granlund developed as a center, and while he is showing an ability to play the game away from the puck, his offense is struggling. Maybe a move to the wing in the top 6 helps him find his offensive game at the NHL level. Plus Backlund and Granlund would able to step into the dot if injuries happen or someone is under performing.

[flambers]

I agree,

Flames need to finalize on the goalie strategy, 3 goalie situation at the beginning of the season was a disaster. Ideally Flames move Hiller for a late draft pick, recall Ortio and see what he can do for the remainder of the season. Decide at the draft on Ramo and Ortio.

Hudler & Russell,

I would think the decision is made on Hudler, they should trade him. As for Russell that is a tough choice

David Jones

Flames should trade him, and recall Grant.

Depth forwards,

Flames are lacking in scoring on the depth lines, this needs to be fixed.

[Bingo]

Thanks for all the comments ...

Super-Rye was closest to what I was thinking. I'm not in love with Howard but he has that Ken Wregget feel to him in my mind and the history of playing 60 plus games a season. You get rid of Wideman a year earlier, make your blueline make more sense dollar wise, and avoid the two headed snake (two goaltenders making 4M neither of which is a starter) that we've seen for two years.

The uncertainty gained for three years allows Gillies to develop with a known starter ahead of him.

[Sample00]

I'm not a Howard fan either. If you can get a Bishop or Raanta, that would make me more comfortable with our goalie situation.
And I agree with the other CP'er, move Backlund and keep Stajan. Have never felt that Backlund was the guy that everyone thinks he is.

[Alberta_Beef]

Originally Posted by Bingo

Thanks for all the comments ...

Super-Rye was closest to what I was thinking. I'm not in love with Howard but he has that Ken Wregget feel to him in my mind and the history of playing 60 plus games a season. You get rid of Wideman a year earlier, make your blueline make more sense dollar wise, and avoid the two headed snake (two goaltenders making 4M neither of which is a starter) that we've seen for two years.

The uncertainty gained for three years allows Gillies to develop with a known starter ahead of him.

Hasn't there been a few Cam Ward rumors out there the past couple summers? My money would be on that before Howard, since Treliving has had interest already and Ward should come cheaper. We just don't know if he wants to come here, fortunately with the week negotiating period before free agency Treliving will be able to get a feel if Ward wants to play here before picking up a goalie like Howard.

[DoubleK]

100% agree with Wideman for Howard.

If Wideman gets suspended for 10+ I would hope that the Flames would give Wotherspoon another shot. If he doesn't perform ship him out for a 5th or 6th round pick and give him a chance somewhere else.

[Poe969]

I hate that you had to put the thing in there about "tanking" because some people around here think that if you want to trade one of our "best players" or you don't think the team can go undefeated you must want to tank and you're no better than an oiler fan....

I don't like the idea of Wideman for Howard but I can see why the Flames would do it. I disagree with the thoughts on Russell. I think he should be traded away as I think his value is high right now, I still think the Flames have an outside shot at getting Hamonic for the top 4 and he'd be an improvement on Russell IMO.

[Fighting Banana Slug]

The goalie situation is clearly the trickiest, and I don't see it getting cleared up before the trade deadline. Howard seems like a Band-Aid solution, which is what we have been doing for the last few years.

I know I will be in the minority, but I would rather have Colbourne than a 3rd rounder.

[D as in David]

Originally Posted by Huntingwhale

Good write up. Only question I have is regarding point #3 (Hudler).

Other then an 'insider' post that showed up on CP a couple months back, I haven't heard any ramblings about Hudler's supposed attitude problems. I thought he's been a fine leader for the club since the day he signed. Obviously we don't know what goes on behind closed doors. But I'm curious as to when it was said he supposedly had an attitude issue?

In Elliotte Friedman's latest 30 thoughts, he had this to say about Hudler

He hasn’t been himself this year, and some of that undoubtedly is seeing Dougie Hamilton and Michael Frolik get paid while he hasn’t. The writing is on the wall.

I take this to mean that he might be less than thrilled because either the Flames have not had any talks with him about a new contract or they have and offered something less than he believes he's worth based on last year.

[Demetric]

On the Howard for Wideman, sure the cap hit is extended by 2 years but you save money on not signing a 3 mil backup (ramo) or a 5 mil 3rd pairing D man. This is why this is done.

[saillias]

I would probably rather keep Hiller or take Berra back before Ward, and that's not a compliment to either. He has been the worst starter in the league for nearly a decade. His entire career is living off of one good playoff run.

[Hackey]

I think if were patient we can find a better option than Howard. If we just need a stop gap I think we can find someone who doesn't have three years left at a high cap hit. Makes him tougher to deal if need be and might just create a similar problem to what we have now.

[PeteMoss]

I want Russell gone. I think it will be addition by subtraction for the team.

[ricardodw]

Howard at 5.3 x 3 is basically a UFA signing. Is he better than Cam Ward? Same age with Ward having a higher top end and playing better this year.

Do you think Ward will get more than 5.3x3 this summer?

Howard has some sort of limited no movement.... would he want to play in Calgary? A lot more travel than he currently has out of Detroit? He already has agreed to money and term. Calgary can't offer more than any other place that he might end up.

[Poe969]

I think the main reason the Wideman for Howard deal was suggested was to get out of Wideman's deal. When you think about it more, I don't think it's a good deal. I think Wideman can be traded in the off season and if he can't then you keep him and hope he plays well next year and can be a good deadline trade chip. Howard would be more of a boat anchor moving forward. I'd take Ward over Howard straight up and I'll bet you could get Ward for a better amount and term.

[nieuwy-89]

Agree with you on defence and forwards. Time to put the young core guys (Bennett, Hamilton, Monahan) in positions to grow and develop. Let the prospects and grow and make room to bring some guys up from the farm. Look what happened with Jooris last year.

On goaltending, I know I will be in the minority here, but I say re-sign Ramo to a 2 or 3 year extension and tell him its his team until either Gillies, Ortio, or McDonald is ready to take the reigns. Pour resources into developing those 3 guys and let Ramo handle the day-to-day starting job until one of them emerges. I just don't think the solution is to give up roster assets to get either a career backup or a post-apex player (Howard, Ward) who are on their way out. Ramo has proven he is an NHL goalie, definitely not top-tier, but I would like to see what he could do if given the starting job and the vote of confidence from the team. Set him up as a mentor/leader for the younger goalies - a role similar to what Stajan has played with the forwards.

[ricardodw]

" If the team moves assets they are not tanking unless its truly obvious they are heading to the playoffs. "

I think that you have the definition exactly wrong. Were the Flames taking when the traded Glencross away at the deadline last year?

Tanking is where a team that is not going to make the playoffs tries to finish as low in the standings as they can to improve their draft pick.

The Flames are within 2 pts of being the worst team in the league. If you take away their dominance in the 3 on 3 side-show (8-1) they have the worst record in the league.


If they dump Wideman, Hudler, Russell and Jones who are all regular players for prospects/draft picks they would obviously be tanking.

[hummdeedoo]

Originally Posted by nieuwy-89

On goaltending, I know I will be in the minority here, but I say re-sign Ramo to a 2 or 3 year extension and tell him its his team until...

I'm with you. I don't see Ramo as a horrible option especially after reading United's post on Howard. That contract is scary and Ramo could be had for much less. I certainly wouldn't say our Goaltending issues would be solved but I don't see us being a legit contender that soon anyway.

[Flames Draft Watcher]

Originally Posted by Alberta_Beef

Moving Wideman out and bringing Howard in doesn't free up money for Russell in the slightest. If anything it makes our cap situation worse and with the term he has remaining that is a terrible idea. I would rather go after almost anyone else.

Yes it does.

OUT
Ramo (3.8 million), Hiller (4.5 million), Wideman (5.25 million)

IN
Howard (5.292), Backup (750k-1.5 million), 7th d-man (600k-1 million)

Assuming they can find a reasonably cheap backup it would save about 8 million. How on earth does that not give us space to re-sign Russell?

Bingo's idea is interesting and getting an overpaid forward or goalie is likely how we could move Wideman.

[Tinordi]

What are you expecting to get back for Wideman? Another overpaid player. May as well have one at a position where it's more helpful. I think the trade for Howard is a good idea. He's much better than Cam Ward who's terrible. You basically need a number 1 guy who can carry the games played mail playing behind Calgary's good D. Howard is the 18th highest paid goalie in the league. He's also probably the 18th best goalie in the league. The only issue is his remaining term.

There's enough examples in the league that having a serviceable goalie with a good team is enough to win.