Darren Haynes top 25 prospects

[Robbob]

Fair enough. I think he is giving Poirier a bit more leeway because of age. Poirer won't be turning 21 until mid December.

[ricardodw]

We are not talking about showing up and playing at an NHL level..... being a bit better than David Jones, Colborne, Stajan or Backlund

In the 6 game playoff series against the Canucks Ferland was dominate.... a game and series changer.

He was at least as good as Monahan, Hudler or Gaudreau.

Maybe Brodie or Wideman or Russell would be the MVP of that series, but it could have easily been Ferland.

He forced the Canucks to get rid of Bieksa and trade for Prust and Sutter.


Flames have won 4 playoff series in 20 years.

Can't have much of bigger impact at the NHL level and not very likely that there is anyone in our prospect list that is a MVP of a playoff series.

[Calgary4LIfe]

It seems that I had a very similar methodology in ranking the prospects as Darren Haynes, but come out with very different rankings. Everyone sees something different in prospects, and it is always nice to see what other people think.

I am a little surprised with the low ranking on Klimchuk more than anything. For me, his biggest question mark will be his durability. That is the only thing that keeps me a bit lower on Klimchuk personally, but other than that I see a very nice prospect with him.

Jankowski I still see as a really good piece. Still have him quite high on my list - much higher than this one - but there are going to be people who just don't see what I see - and vice versa.

MacDonald could very well be the Flames' #1 goalie prospect. Gillies could be #1. Ortio could be #1. I think they all play different styles, sizes and strengths. For me, MacDonald has really grown on me in the last year. I rank both him and Ortio ahead of Gillies, but don't confuse this with me not thinking Gillies is a wonderful prospect. I really like Ortio's style and composure more. MacDonald is a guy that just seems to make that great save. Gillies is huge and composed - but he has slipped a little bit for me due to his allowing a bad goal here and there (WJC, even in the NCAA Final Four - though praise must still be given for him winning a major championship).

The hardest guy for me to ever rank on the prospect list is Ferland. This has been the case the last 3 years, actually. Sometimes I have him ranked 2nd, sometimes closer to 10th. I always said that if he makes it, he will be a game changer and a crowd favorite, and he will be a decent scorer at the NHL level. I just have a tough time trying to figure out where that ranks with players who I think will score more than him. All I know is that I absolutely love this kid, and if someone ranks him on par with Bennett (not that anyone has) I can understand why. I think we all started seeing how much of an impact player he can be. I really do believe that if all things go well, and you put him on a scoring line, this kid can pot 30 goals (yes, thirty) in a season, and be an extremely tough SOB to play against while doing so. I do think if you put him on a 4th line, he will pot in 10-15 in a season, and still be a crowd favorite and an SOB to play against. The kid just has smarts, hands and toughness. I just keep moving him up and down so much in my own rankings more than any other player - which is funny, since (once again) I absolutely love this kid.

[Freeway]

Biggest knock on Klimchuk is he's not huge. Beyond that, if he can "get" the game at the pro level, he'll be a useful player.

[RyZ]

I'm surprised Haynes, Pinder and some others are on board with Klimchuck possibly going back to junior.

How many 1st rounders have stayed in junior up to and including an overage season? And still been a real prospect and went to play a significant career in the NHL? To me sending Klimchuck back to junior is a way of saying "sorry, you are not really in our plans going forward so we will just park you here until we dont have to offer you a contract anymore". Thats the first step on the road to being a non-prospect.

Guys like Austin Carroll play their overage seasons, not 1st rounders that have been putting up point per game + numbers since they were 17 yrs old.

[thymebalm]

Originally Posted by RyZ

I'm surprised Haynes, Pinder and some others are on board with Klimchuck possibly going back to junior.

How many 1st rounders have stayed in junior up to and including an overage season? And still been a real prospect and went to play a significant career in the NHL? To me sending Klimchuck back to junior is a way of saying "sorry, you are not really in our plans going forward so we will just park you here until we dont have to offer you a contract anymore". Thats the first step on the road to being a non-prospect.

Guys like Austin Carroll play their overage seasons, not 1st rounders that have been putting up point per game + numbers since they were 17 yrs old.

I think a lot of 1st rounders are rushed into action to fill a need for an organization. You could look it as Calgary having the depth the support a longer development curve for their players.

We don't need Kilmchuk in the AHL or NHL this coming season. Is the best thing for him to have 20 minutes a night and a chance at a championship.... it might be. I don't think we can jump to the conclusion that it's a bad thing to keep a good prospect at the junior level.

I look at it as the Flames having the opportunity to take their time as they work from a position of strength and not weakness.

[Fire]

Another year in the WHL for Klimchuk would be pretty much a waste for him and stall his development. I would rather him play in the ECHL if he wasn't ready for the AHL.

[MrMastodonFarm]

Another season in the WHL for Klimchuk would be a total and complete waste. He's maxed out what he can do there and would suffer. A 5th year in the WHL? Gross.

He's ready for the AHL, no question.

[RobbieT]

Originally Posted by icarus

McDonald ahead of Gillies is a big call.

McDonald drafted as the highest goalie of his year, I believe he will start for Canada at WJC and will change a lot of minds about his prospective future. He was the best goalie in the QMJHL last year, and was outstanding for the World U18. I think he will be our future number 1. And that being said, I REALLY like Ortio and Gillies, and think that they will get to the NHL faster, but I think that McDonald has the highest ceiling.

All that being said, we have some pretty awesome goaltending prospects!!

[ricardodw]

Klimchuck was the #28 pick overall. He is 6 months YOUNGER than a Flames #21 pick overall, but there is no hue and cry that he is not playing in the AHL this year.

On the other hand a lot of almost-a-bust talk about Shinkaruk a #24 pick who has his first AHL season under his belt... and is month younger than Jankowski

As well Sieloff (a d-man who takes longer to develop and had a freak year off) has a AHL year under his belt and is 3 months older than Jankowski and this, to many, is his last chance make or break year.... he needs to dominate at the AHL level.


I would like to see Klimchuck in the AHL but if he goes back to Brandon it would not mean that his chances at the NHL are over any more than Jankowski being a 3rd line Centre in the NCAA in his 3rd year after being drafted means that he will not play in the NHL.


Why is patience and slow but steady development OK for some but others it is either either in the NHL or Busts by the time they are 22?


Maybe Brandon keeping Klimchuck as a 20 year old would be related to Brandon giving Kylington a place to play?

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by Vulcan

IMO there is no way in hell Klimchuk goes back to junior. His only problem is that we've got too many young forwards vying for a job.

Not on LW. After Agostino there's no one in Stockton to keep Klimchuk out of a spot. His best competition is Elson, which is good but not someone who'd keep him from playing.

Originally Posted by ricardodw

We are not talking about showing up and playing at an NHL level..... being a bit better than David Jones, Colborne, Stajan or Backlund

...Except for how Jones and Stajan and Backlund were just as good or better, past the commotion of "big hits".

In the 6 game playoff series against the Canucks Ferland was dominate.... a game and series changer.

The adjective you're looking for is "dominant", dominate is a verb.

Originally Posted by ricardodw

Klimchuck was the #28 pick overall. He is 6 months YOUNGER than a Flames #21 pick overall, but there is no hue and cry that he is not playing in the AHL this year.

Because he is playing in the AHL?

As well Sieloff (a d-man who takes longer to develop and had a freak year off) has a AHL year under his belt and is 3 months older than Jankowski and this, to many, is his last chance make or break year.... he needs to dominate at the AHL level.

He needs to show progress. Three year's after his draft he's essentially where he was in his draft year.

I would like to see Klimchuck in the AHL but if he goes back to Brandoit would not mean that his chances at the NHL are over

No one said his chances at the NHL are over if he goes back to Brandon. But he's not going back to Brandon.

Why is patience and slow but steady development OK for some but others it is either either in the NHL or Busts by the time they are 22?

Some (Klimchuk) play in Junior leagues against 16 year olds with Junior systems and Junior lifestyles. Junior leagues are not optimal for development. As soon as players are eligible players are turned pro to develop in the AHL. It's fine for 17/18 year olds but once players turn 19, 20 they have little to gain from returning and playing against competition they've pretty much outdeveloped and outgrown.

Others (Jankowski, Arnold, Hickey, Agostino, Gaudreau) Play(ed) in mens leagues against grown men with pro systems and more strict nutrition/exercise regimines. It's not uncommon for good prospects to spend a full four years getting their degree. Nashville's Jimmy Vesey, a very high-end prospect, will be returning for his senior year. This is not a problem because the level of play is reasonably high.

The NCAA as a developmental league not far behind the AHL, though it does depend greatly on which program a player goes to (Denver vs BC for example).

[Vulcan]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

Not on LW. After Agostino there's no one in Stockton to keep Klimchuk out of a spot. His best competition is Elson, which is good but not someone who'd keep him from playing.

Yeah, thanks for that and I suppose as usual I wasn't very clear as we were talking about the AHL. I was more meaning his future opportunity with the Flames as the LW spots seem to be spoken for but it is surprising we are pretty lean on LW in Stockton which makes talk of him returning to Brandon even more stupid.

[T-Rich]

Surprised Shore is an honourable mention. Not saying he deserves top 10 but to not even make the list...

[saillias]

I find it hard to consider Drew Shore a prospect. He burned his calder eligibility when he played 43 games in the lockout season. He's been in that Granlund stage of too good for AHL, not good enough for a coach to tell him to get a place to stay, for several years.

[druetetective]

I thought we had Ortio and Ferland way overated but he's doing the same with the two Swedes IMO.

Also correct e if i'm wrong Sureloss, wasn't the last 1st rounder to play a OA season in the CHL Bryan Marchment almost 30 years ago? Klimchuk will NOT be in juniors next year. ECHL perhaps, not WHL!

[druetetective]

Kulak is very undervalued IMO.

-Had 60 points his final WHL season and didn't need an OA year. (unlike Culkin who wasn't ready for pro yet)

-Tore up the ECHL (Eagles fans gave rave reviews on HF. One said he was the most talented player he's seen during his many years with season tickets.)

-Had a better PPG than Wotherspoon and Culkin in AHL while being younger. (1/3 of the season isn't that small of a sample size BTW)

-Tremendous skating ability and wicked slapshot. (103 was mentioned at a Giants skills competition. Can anyone confirm?)

Iv'e got hi as our 2nd best D prospect behind only Hickey. hate using absolutes but i can see 4-6 Dman with 500+ GP outta this kid.

[Fire of the Phoenix]

If I'm Klimchuk and the Flames want to force me back to the WHL, I'm looking at opportunities overseas to be honest. Poirier plays 2 years in the AHL before Klimchuk plays at all? They were drafted 6 spots apart in the same draft and Klimchuk has played well to this point and clearly ready for the next step. I could see the argument had Morgan struggled the last 2 years but that hasn't been the case. This isn't even worth discussing honestly and I'm surprised a guy like Haynes even thinks this is a possibility.

[Riles]

From what I've seen, the knock I have for Klimchuk is the need to "grab it" with his game.
He's a "little things" player, does a lot of things well, but doesn't do something REALLY well. When I've watched him, he's been "just there" but never made me think, 'That's something to translate to the next level."
Just my two cents.

[Rick M.]

Klimchuk gets praise for his quick release and the deadly accuracy of his shot. He looks like one of those players who will need to play with a good set up guy.

[StrykerSteve]

Klimchuk has never really impressed me in all the dev camps I've watched him in. He simply hasn't stood out amongst the crowd, for the most part. Doesn't mean he's a bad hockey player, just needs to really step things up and show that he deserves to be there more than the other guys.