[Signing] Ducks sign Silfverberg to 4 year contract ($3.75 mil AAV)

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by Fire of the Phoenix

not mine

you didn't use the word if, but you based it on him continuing to improve (same thing)

[Fire of the Phoenix]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

you didn't use the word if, but you based it on him continuing to improve (same thing)

That's pretty much how contracts are negotiated nowadays though. You're almost always paying for potential (to some extent) unless you're signing a guy in his late 20s or older. The thing with Silfverberg is that even if he doesn't get any better at all, he's only overpaid by maybe 500k. If he can improve even marginally, he's easily worth it IMO.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by Fire of the Phoenix

That's pretty much how contracts are negotiated nowadays though. You're almost always paying for potential (to some extent) unless you're signing a guy in his late 20s or older. The thing with Silfverberg is that even if he doesn't get any better at all, he's only overpaid by maybe 500k. If he can improve even marginally, he's easily worth it IMO.

check out the Bouma thread for a counterpoint

[Fire of the Phoenix]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

check out the Bouma thread for a counterpoint

I thought Bouma's contract was fair. I read/contributed to that thread but I don't want to slug through it again. What are you getting at if you don't mind me asking?

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by Fire of the Phoenix

I thought Bouma's contract was fair. I read/contributed to that thread but I don't want to slug through it again. What are you getting at if you don't mind me asking?

No one was willing to give any kind of credit for a 24 year old improving - in fact it was all about regressing.

$2.2M was fair to some and expensive to those that expect him to regress.

[Fire of the Phoenix]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

No one was willing to give any kind of credit for a 24 year old improving - in fact it was all about regressing.

$2.2M was fair to some and expensive to those that expect him to regress.

Well his absurd sh% played into that in a big way. I think Bouma is worth around $2m even if he only scores 8-10 goals per year over the deal. Prust gets $2.5m to be a half the player Bouma is. I'm really not that torn up about it. I think you can have a underskilled character/glue guy overpaid by 10%, you just have to pick the right guy. Bouma is a great guy to give that deal to, I really think he gets a letter at some point.

Can't remember your stance on his deal, I'm just typing what I'm thinking.

[Enoch Root]

I'm a big fan of what Bouma brings and I liked the deal.

But this thread is about Silfverberg. I only mentioned Bouma because he wasn't given an inch for improvement, but Silfverberg deserves to get paid for potential.

[boogerz]

Clearly the Backlund deal was a precedent for this one. Solid signing by the Ducks

[Hackey]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

every post saying it's a good deal has an 'if' caveat

Isn't that every deal though?

[Hackey]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

I'm a big fan of what Bouma brings and I liked the deal.

But this thread is about Silfverberg. I only mentioned Bouma because he wasn't given an inch for improvement, but Silfverberg deserves to get paid for potential.

I like Bouma. No issue with his deal. Defended him plenty in the thread. I think the difference though is people think Bouma really over achieved while Silfverberg is seen more as a guy who is improving and yet to reach his potential. He also has a lot more natural offensive ability. I'm sure the Ducks expect his numbers to improve next year. I think people are a lot more hesitant that Bouma's numbers will.

[ricardodw]

Originally Posted by Hackey

I like Bouma. No issue with his deal. Defended him plenty in the thread. I think the difference though is people think Bouma really over achieved while Silfverberg is seen more as a guy who is improving and yet to reach his potential. He also has a lot more natural offensive ability. I'm sure the Ducks expect his numbers to improve next year. I think people are a lot more hesitant that Bouma's numbers will.

why?

In Bouma's last 33 games.... post-all star 10 goal 17 pts .515 ppg +7... 15:44 min/game

Silfverberg last 34 games 7 goal 21 pts .618 +13 15:49 min/game


These were by far the best stretch of games for either player.


The Centre Bouma was playing with got 3.57 x 4 year ..... Silvferberg's centre 6.9x6..

Bouma is 7 months older than Silvferberg.


Bouma's 2.2 x3 is a great deal for The Flames.


Fate.... Bouma misses the playoffs with injury ... Silvferberg has his coming out party

[Hackey]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

why?

In Bouma's last 33 games.... post-all star 10 goal 17 pts .515 ppg +7... 15:44 min/game

Silfverberg last 34 games 7 goal 21 pts .618 +13 15:49 min/game


These were by far the best stretch of games for either player.


The Centre Bouma was playing with got 3.57 x 4 year ..... Silvferberg's centre 6.9x6..

Bouma is 7 months older than Silvferberg.


Bouma's 2.2 x3 is a great deal for The Flames.


Fate.... Bouma misses the playoffs with injury ... Silvferberg has his coming out party

Because you don't judge players based on 33 games. And as I said at the start of my post

Originally Posted by Hackey

I like Bouma. No issue with his deal. Defended him plenty in the thread.

I was explaining why some people might feel Silfverberg is a more likely player to improve on his numbers next year than Bouma is and that's likely the reason why people in the Bouma thread thought we overpaid for his potential, because he may regress, and why people thinking paying for potential with Silfverberg was okay because they expect him to improve on his numbers.

[ricardodw]

Originally Posted by Hackey

Because you don't judge players based on 33 games. And as I said at the start of my post



I was explaining why some people might feel Silfverberg is a more likely player to improve on his numbers next year than Bouma is and that's likely the reason why people in the Bouma thread thought we overpaid for his potential, because he may regress, and why people thinking paying for potential with Silfverberg was okay because they expect him to improve on his numbers.

I agree with what you have put forth , but I am asking why?

Same age same growth curve only establishing themselves as 2nd line wingers in the 2nd half of the 2014-15 season. Bouma actually missed a full year of development blowing out his knee.

Silvferberg had a great playoffs.... that apparently is the difference between a 3.75x 4 to a 2.2x3.

A lot of people do have Bouma slotted as a bottom 6... similarly to having him as the 21st prospect in the summer of 2013 when he was about to start his 78 game season with the Flames. Bouma is the Rodney Dangerfield of the Flames.

[Hackey]

Probably because Bouma has never been an offensive guy and Silfverberg has.

[calumniate]

Like the player, good signing. Don't think they could have kept both him and beleskey

[ricardodw]

Originally Posted by Hackey

Probably because Bouma has never been an offensive guy and Silfverberg has.

You would be referring to Silfverberg's 20 year old year in the SEL... the lower Swedish league where he had 24 goals and 54 pts in 49 games.

Bouma as a 19 year old had 17 pt in 16 game playoff run.... As a 20 year old Bouma had 20 pts in 61 games in the AHL AND 16 NHL games.

Up until the 2nd half of last year Silfverbeg was slotted a bottom 6 checker.

[Hackey]

Ya well its relative. Silfverberg led his team in scoring and was 2nd in league scoring.