Darren Haynes interview with Baertschi ...

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by JiriHrdina

I think that's a poor way to interpret what Sven is saying. Confidence is big for athletes - and for a guy like Sven he has been an offensive player his entire career.
Look at this way.
There are things we all do well at our jobs. There are things we do less well.
Let's say I'm a guy at a construction site.
All my career I've been really great at hammering nails.
But I've not been as good as - say - using a saw.
So I work at the saw to improve - but I'm still always good with the hammer.
Suddenly we switch construction sites and all of a sudden not only am I still not that great with the saw - but now I also suck using the hammer.

That's basically what's happening with Sven. All his life he has been great at being an offensive hockey player. There are other parts to hockey that he was less good at but working on - but suddenly in the last 12 months he isn't even a good offensive player.

So he's probably thinking if I'm not a good offensive player then what the heck am I?

He's not saying goals are the only thing that matters. He's saying that it what feeds his confidence.

Which is perfectly understandable.

I'm just saying that it shouldn't be the only thing to feed his confidence. Playing well within a team and winning is what should ultimately feed his confidence. It seems like that is what Hartley is trying to instill in the team. It (confidence) really comes down to being useful and it sounds like Baertschi is pigeon-holing himself as someone that needs to use a hammer to be useful. It takes more than a hammer or saw to build a house.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by saillias

I don't agree, I think it's become a confirmation bias for the Flames world at this point. We decided Sven was fragile and now every time he speaks to the media you get a bunch of people jumping on his comments "yup super attitude/fragile."

Why would so many people invent it? Sven has said as much in a lot of quotes, not just this year. He obviously doesn't talk about fragility, but he consistently talks about needing to gain confidence, or that the lost it, or that a good night has given it to him. He obviously thinks about confidence a lot.

[GioforPM]

examples

http://www.calgaryherald.com/sports/...618/story.html

http://video.flames.nhl.com/videocen...sole?id=243549

[sa226]

If anything Sven needs media training from Sean Monahan, so that every spoken syllable doesn't get analyzed to death.

He's an uber talented kid who wears his heart on his sleeve. I think he'll figure things out.

[Fighting Banana Slug]

Sven needs to improve his game, but I do think he takes too much heat for presumed mental fragility. He finally gets a couple of points and looks quick out there (the whole team looked faster against the Yotes) and this is the reaction.

It may be that he brings it on himself somewhat. His answers to questions are too honest. If he just grunted out, "need to give 110%, hard work and the points will come", does that mean he has figured it out?

[Robo]

He played good last night even had a couple take aways in the offensive zone i hope he can build off it

[GioforPM]

I hope so. I don't think he's "uber talented", though. I think he's got fair skills. He was a good point producer in junior, but not a monster one.

Then again in his year Brendan Shinimin was the monster and where is he now?

[nik-]

2 PPG is a monster producer. But trust us, we get it, you're not big on Sven.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Fighting Banana Slug

Sven needs to improve his game, but I do think he takes too much heat for presumed mental fragility. He finally gets a couple of points and looks quick out there (the whole team looked faster against the Yotes) and this is the reaction.

It may be that he brings it on himself somewhat. His answers to questions are too honest. If he just grunted out, "need to give 110%, hard work and the points will come", does that mean he has figured it out?

If he actually gave 110% and worked hard the points would come.

It's not what he says (I don't think you actually listened to what he said). It's what he says and admits in his interviews which people can see are reflected on the ice.

He is young. But not as young as a Monahan, who's had slow stretches as well. At some point it's time to put on the big boy pants.

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by JiriHrdina

All his life he has been great at being an offensive hockey player. There are other parts to hockey that he was less good at but working on - but suddenly in the last 12 months he isn't even a good offensive player.

So he's probably thinking if I'm not a good offensive player then what the heck am I?

He's not saying goals are the only thing that matters. He's saying that it what feeds his confidence.

Which is perfectly understandable.

Isn't that the case for all skilled players drafted with high picks into the NHL? At some point a coach is going to pressure you put more emphasis on a defensive game. At some point you're not going to score as often or as easily as you did in junior. At some point you're going to have to find a different motivator besides scoring piles of points.

Then, after you've sorted that stuff out, you might find your scoring touch revives. For some players it does. For some it doesn't. And sometimes when it doesn't, it isn't because you were mishandled or even because of mental fragility; it's because maybe your offensive skills simply don't translate to the NHL level. At that point you can see if can change your game to become a useful all-around NHLer (ie Dan Cleary). Or you can go to Europe or Russia where your offensive skills are probably good enough to become productive offensive player again.

[DoubleF]

Originally Posted by Rick M.

Here's the guy who worked with Backlund. I wonder if Baertschi should consult him.
http://www.calgarysun.com/2014/02/01...ikael-backlund

Apparently, Colborne gets him (Belfry) to do the analysis too. Cool to know.

Give Barts a few games. He will be fine.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by nik-

2 PPG is a monster producer. But trust us, we get it, you're not big on Sven.

2 PPG is very good in junior. But a few guys do it per year, and a lot who don't fall into the category of "uber talented". Maybe you have a different definition.

I actually like Sven, and I thought he'd be a good player for the Flames. Based on his actual play, though, I don't see him as a top line guy. Maybe not even a second line scorer. But that's OK.

[GioforPM]

Cliff Ronning had a lot of points, more per game than Sven. Not "uber talented". decent NHLer.

And sometimes, like was said above, it just doesn't translate (see Brendl, Pavel).

[Lanny_McDonald]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Wow. Guy answers honestly and a bunch of internet psychiatrists call him neurotic.

When it comes to playing well offensively, confidence is everything. Baertschi says that scoring would help his confidence. Shocking!!!

This is hardly news, nor is it a reason to criticize him. However, no surprise that people do anyway.

No one called him neurotic, just stated that his lack of confidence borders on a neurosis. The difference is substantial. See Karen Horney's body of work for a complete review of confidence and the psychology of confidence and personal development. Based on Sven's own comments he is battling a confidence issue and it is affecting his performance. Dealing with an issue like this for that long, based on his obvious talents, means there is something going on above the shoulders and he needs a little help. A lot of high performance athletes need help from time to time and consult psychologists. It's all about finding their edge and using it. But Sven obviously doesn't need much help. He's excelling as a pro.

[Street Pharmacist]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

2 PPG is very good in junior. But a few guys do it per year, and a lot who don't fall into the category of "uber talented". Maybe you have a different definition.

I actually like Sven, and I thought he'd be a good player for the Flames. Based on his actual play, though, I don't see him as a top line guy. Maybe not even a second line scorer. But that's OK.

So I went and checked up on your claim.
First, not all CHL leagues are the same. The WHL is much, much harder to score in.
Second, Baertschi is the only player to hit 2 PPG in the 12 years I sent back and checked. Could be longer.
Third, Baertschi was the only rookie in the top 20 in points in the last 6 years.

Let's not pretend a junior with those accolades not become an NHL regular is a normal thing. It would be quite remarkable and not common at all

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Street Pharmacist

So I went and checked up on your claim.
First, not all CHL leagues are the same. The WHL is much, much harder to score in.
Second, Baertschi is the only player to hit 2 PPG in the 12 years I sent back and checked. Could be longer.
Third, Baertschi was the only rookie in the top 20 in points in the last 6 years.

Let's not pretend a junior with those accolades not become an NHL regular is a normal thing. It would be quite remarkable and not common at all

I'm guilty of rounding. There were 3 other players right around 2 PPG in Sven's big year alone. None of them were exceptional players in the NHL scheme of things.

I am much older than you it seems. Because I know about the Ronnings, Browns and Brendls of the WHL. Which I do agree is a tougher scoring league in general.

[GioforPM]

When you say "uber talented" I read that as being above everyone else. A magician with the puck. I just don't see it, in his NHL game for sure.

Would you have called Pavel Brendl "uber talented" in the NHL?

[Fighting Banana Slug]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

If he actually gave 110% and worked hard the points would come.

It's not what he says (I don't think you actually listened to what he said). It's what he says and admits in his interviews which people can see are reflected on the ice.

He is young. But not as young as a Monahan, who's had slow stretches as well. At some point it's time to put on the big boy pants.

My point is, you can't actually give 110%. Those are the sound bites that everyone expects, but are totally meaningless.
I agree there are confidence issues, but I think they are the same as those that most young players deal with. Hopefully the Yotes game is one he can build off. The big difference in the game last night was his speed. Whether that is confidence related, illness related or effort related (I don't think so), let's hope he can keep it up.

[GioforPM]

One last post on this, then I'll try to quit.

I really want to be wrong and see this kid turn it all around.

But if he is in fact "uber talenetd", then what's the issue? Obviously it has to be upstairs. Is it temporary or something that's going to happen all the time? I'm just saying if it's the latter, it's not something Treliving will want to deal with.

If it's a made up issue, why does he talk about confidence in all his interviews? Posters say "he's just being honest". Great, then it's not made up.

So then, if confidence is the issue, what's the solution? Giving him unearned top line minutes? Sports psychology? Drugs? Change of scenery (AHL/KHL/other NHL team)?

If this team was less deep, he'd get more minutes. But it's hard to bump Granlund and Gaudreau off the top line. It's going to get harder when Backlund, Raymond and Colborne return. Ferland could make a bid. Jooris has made his bid.

[Phil Russell]

I feel sorry for Sven and I understand why some players prefer playing in non-hockey markets where reporters and fans don't question the interpretation of a player's every word or action. We have no idea what's in Sven's head. We don't know him personally so we should stop pretending we know what he's thinking or what type of person he is. He may or may not work out but patience is still needed, from media and fans alike. He remains a top-notch prospect. Just let the kid play for God's sake.