Have any of our off season acquisitions impressed?

[combustiblefuel]

Ya It's preseason. After 20 regular season games then people can make better judgments. Kinda silly how people are getting in a rage already.

Edit. Didn't even Iggy take almost a quarter of a season to get to form?

[gargamel]

Originally Posted by combustiblefuel

Ya It's preseason. After 20 regular season games then people can make better judgments. Kinda silly how people are getting in a rage already.

Who is getting in a rage?

[Cleveland Steam Whistle]

Originally Posted by Ashasx

I think it would send a good message to the team if Setoguchi was put on waivers.

But what if he's just struggling with self confidence. The Flames should likely just coddle him, give him ice time and tell him he can just play in whatever zones on the ice he's most comfortable with.

[combustiblefuel]

Nm

[Ashasx]

Originally Posted by Cleveland Steam Whistle

But what if he's just struggling with self confidence. The Flames should likely just coddle him, give him ice time and tell him he can just play in whatever zones on the ice he's most comfortable with.

I know what you're trying to do with this post, and considering that it never happened, it's why I'd like to see the same system used for every player on the roster, not just young players.

[btimbit]

Originally Posted by Ashasx

I think it would send a good message to the team if Setoguchi was put on waivers.

If he's playing the same at the end of October as he is now, I agree entirely. Seems silly to do it at this point of the pre-season, but really hoping they give him the SOB treatment if they need too (Except sooner than they did with SOB)

[KootenayFlamesFan]

You don't put a UFA you just signed on waivers after a couple of pre-season games.

He hasn't been great, but let's not get crazy here.

[gargamel]

Originally Posted by btimbit

If he's playing the same at the end of October as he is now, I agree entirely. Seems silly to do it at this point of the pre-season, but really hoping they give him the SOB treatment if they need too (Except sooner than they did with SOB)

The reason that it didn't happen sooner with SOB is that he was a Feaster acquisition, and Feaster wouldn't demote him (remember, Burke was the acting GM when SOB was sent down). Hopefully Treliving is more willing to cut/demote his own guys if and when it's warranted.

[Ashasx]

Originally Posted by KootenayFlamesFan

You don't put a UFA you just signed on waivers after a couple of pre-season games.

He hasn't been great, but let's not get crazy here.

And if other players outperform him in practice, he should be guaranteed a spot?

At what point can you waive a guy like Setoguchi then? You have to give him some regular season games, even if 4 or 5 players deserve the opportunity more?

Somebody like Setoguchi should have just as much to prove as somebody like Agostino.

[KootenayFlamesFan]

Originally Posted by Ashasx

And if other players outperform him in practice, he should be guaranteed a spot?

At what point can you waive a guy like Setoguchi then? You have to give him some regular season games, even if 4 or 5 players deserve the opportunity more?

Somebody like Setoguchi should have just as much to prove as somebody like Agostino.

Yes, you have to give him some regular season games.

Maybe you sit in the pressbox here and there, but to put a UFA you just signed on waivers before the season started would not help the Flames out at all. You have to at least give him a few meaningful games.

[JiriHrdina]

It's the early part of the pre-season - you can barely judge any player at this point, let alone a veteran. Let's wait and see how he looks in a week or so. I think some folks are looking for a sacrificial lamb as some sort of proof that this team is going to actually give young guys a chance.

[combustiblefuel]

Originally Posted by JiriHrdina

It's the early part of the pre-season - you can barely judge any player at this point, let alone a veteran. Let's wait and see how he looks in a week or so. I think some folks are looking for a sacrificial lamb as some sort of proof that this team is going to actually give young guys a chance.

Of course they are . Butler, Breen and O'brien gone . Need a new whipping boy.

[trublmaker]

Originally Posted by Ashasx

And if other players outperform him in practice, he should be guaranteed a spot?

At what point can you waive a guy like Setoguchi then? You have to give him some regular season games, even if 4 or 5 players deserve the opportunity more?

Somebody like Setoguchi should have just as much to prove as somebody like Agostino.

this

[Robbob]

blow it up

[Phanuthier]

Originally Posted by gargamel

It's not fair to jump to conclusions about Treliving or draft picks, but I'm not sure that it's unfair to note that none of the vets that Treliving has brought in have looked any better on the ice than they looked on paper/in previous seasons, and they all looked mediocre to poor on paper/in previous seasons.

As long as their status as new acquisitions doesn't protect them from getting cut, benched or demoted to the AHL though, it doesn't really matter at this point.

Lots of players don't perform well in preseason or early in the season, see iginla when he was with the Flames.

[SuperMatt18]

Raymond and Engelland have looked good IMO.

Don't think Setoguchi has been as bad as some on here would have you believe.

Really still too early in pre-season to determine anything.

[djsFlames]

We haven't played a single game that matters yet. Can we wait to see how they do when that happens before making sound yes/no judgements?

Not even going to comment on performances yet. I learned last year how stupid it is to jump to conclusions in preseason about the vets.

[Freeway]

Sample size!

I would be shocked at this point if Setoguchi made the team. Then again, four games left.

[Cali Panthers Fan]

Originally Posted by Ashasx

And if other players outperform him in practice, he should be guaranteed a spot?

At what point can you waive a guy like Setoguchi then? You have to give him some regular season games, even if 4 or 5 players deserve the opportunity more?

Somebody like Setoguchi should have just as much to prove as somebody like Agostino.

Holy jumpin'! Practice?! Forget the more sensible thing you said earlier about young players outplaying Setoguchi in pre-season games, which was already shouted down because he should be given some regular season games to show what he can bring (rightly so for his situation), but now you're condemning a veteran NHL player to be waived, who we literally just signed a few weeks ago as a UFA, because of the way he looks in practice???!!!

Some people just have no patience for a rebuild.

This is the way to do it folks. You fill the lineup with established, low-level, NHL veterans who eat up cap space and play some minutes until the kids are ready. If a rookie can't outplay any of the guys listed above for a spot then they don't deserve to be in the NHL. Even if they're slightly better in a small sample size, you have to let them mature in a lesser league (as we've seen with Sven and other countless examples throughout the league) and let the veterans take the lumps most nights. In my mind, there are only 2 guys who have made a case to be NHL players right now, and that's Gaudreau and Bennett. You could argue that guys like Granlund, Baertschi, Ferland and others deserve to be in the NHL over some guys like Jones and Setoguchi, but you have to consider this: If they're marginally better than an NHLer right now, but could be much better with more seasoning in the minors, shouldn't you let them get better rather than stunt their growth by forcing them into the NHL before they're done baking?

When guys start plateauing in the minors, that's when you need to have a serious conversation about whether they can make your lineup better in the NHL or not. Reinhart is getting close to plateauing, so hopefully he builds on his breakout season last year. So many guys are getting closer, but still need some time in the minors. Heck, even Gaudreau needs some more time to develop his game at the pro level, but like Monahan, he can help the Flames win right now more so than almost anyone else in the system, which is why you have to consider him in the NHL. I mean Byron finally looks like a legit NHLer now, but it took him quite a while to finish his development in the AHL.

To sum up, we'd better be ok with a lot of these low level guys playing some minutes for this year and next, otherwise it's going to be a long season around here. To me, it's about effort, which is why you'll rarely hear me rag on David Jones. If you go out there and give it your best, and your best just isn't very good, well so be it. If you start dogging it and you don't help the team win, well then buh-bye. That's when you'll hear me get upset at management keeping a veteran around.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by Cali Flames Fan

...This is the way to do it folks. You fill the lineup with established, low-level, NHL veterans who eat up cap space and play some minutes until the kids are ready. If a rookie can't outplay any of the guys listed above for a spot then they don't deserve to be in the NHL. Even if they're slightly better in a small sample size, you have to let them mature in a lesser league (as we've seen with Sven and other countless examples throughout the league) and let the veterans take the lumps most nights.

I think a number of posters would argue that a handful of rookies have outplayed vets, and thus should make the team on opening night. The problem with this opinion is that it presumes to see, know, and understand precisely what it is that management and coaches are looking for in the development of Flames prospects. I would maintain that while certain prospects appear from our vantage point to be ahead of some of the vets, or similarly, that a number of vets look as though they do not belong on the team ahead of a few impressive prospects, we cannot just assume that coaches and management are seeing or even looking for the same things.

Originally Posted by Cali Flames Fan

When guys start plateauing in the minors, that's when you need to have a serious conversation about whether they can make your lineup better in the NHL or not. Reinhart is getting close to plateauing, so hopefully he builds on his breakout season last year...

Why would you say that Reinhart is plateauing after only his second full season of professional hockey? He showed a tremendous offensive improvement last year from his rookie year; in what sense has he plateaued?