Late Summer Reverse Standings Poll - 29th - Page 2 - Calgarypuck Forums - The Unofficial Calgary Flames Fan Community

Enoch Root · 08-20-2014, 09:51 AM

I am going to avoid voting Calgary for as long as I can justify it.

Randomly chose Ottawa from the Ottawa, Carolina, Edmonton trio of suckage

I think Nashville will be considerably improved. And as much as they have lost a good chunk of their scoring, Arizona still has two important things: a good coach, and a good goalie.

ForeverFlameFan · 08-20-2014, 09:57 AM

^ We are in the same boat with Arizona. Not so great looking forwards, decent defense, good goaltending and good coaching. What I bolded is what both teams have to get them out of the bottom 3.

Lanny_McDonald · 08-20-2014, 10:19 AM

Arizona is pretty freaking horrible too. They have some ugly centers and their wings are filled with role player types. Erat and Boedker are going to have to score a bunch. The saving grace for Phoenix is their defense and goaltending. Great blue line and the trap will make them competitive.

CliffFletcher · 08-20-2014, 10:23 AM

Carolina. The Staals are going to pull the chute and ask to be traded, and management will tear the whole thing down. They're going to go full Sabres.

CliffFletcher · 08-20-2014, 10:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cali Flames Fan

I wholeheartedly agree. Their centers are still better than ours. Their goaltenders are definitely better than ours. Their defense is a little suspect, but still better than ours. Their RWers are definitely better than ours, Bobby Ryan's overrating aside. Chiasson is very underrated and will slide into the 2nd line spot without much trouble. Their LWers are still better than ours, especially if Michalek can find his scoring touch again. They lost Spezza and some others, but this has been a younger building team for awhile now and will still be competitive. Won't finish bottom 5 for sure this year, but also probably won't make the playoffs.

Agreed. The Turris-MacArthur line carried Ottawa last year. They won't miss Spezza as much as people think. The real issue was coaching, which went from great two seasons ago, to real bad last season.

DOOM · 08-20-2014, 10:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

Agreed. The Turris-MacArthur line carried Ottawa last year. They won't miss Spezza as much as people think. The real issue was coaching, which went from great two seasons ago, to real bad last season.

How was coaching an issue last year?

Spezza was also their highest scoring forward, so id say they are going to miss him.

dustygoon · 08-20-2014, 10:34 AM

i was afraid we wouldn't get a crack at one of one eichel or mcdavid, but i can't see how we are any better than those teams. picking flameouts

#-3 · 08-20-2014, 10:38 AM

I voted for Arizona yesterday, I'll keep voting for them.

They certainly seem like a team that has finally started to stumble after over preforming for years.

They lost 2 top 6 forwards, and replaced them with Sam Gagner.

Smith took a step back after finally getting the contract.

Lots of good young Dmen, but do they have any great Dmen or a bunch of Brad Stuarts.

Hackey · 08-20-2014, 10:41 AM

Flames.

Yanda · 08-20-2014, 10:41 AM

Florida, Carolina and Edmonton will be worse than the Flames.

Robbob · 08-20-2014, 10:44 AM

Prove me wrong Edmonton. Prove me wrong.

nik- · 08-20-2014, 11:08 AM

Went Coyotes, but it looks like Calgary is going to take this one. I feel we'll be third last, but the bottom end of the league is so jacked up this year we could go as high as sixth last.

mikephoen · 08-20-2014, 11:24 AM

One thing to consider in the voting is not just which teams look bad on paper, but which teams have management that will be willing to purposely tank. I think it's incredibly naive to think teams won't do this.

No-one will go so far as to throw games, or tell players to lose the game, but I think there are teams that will let a lame duck coach go through the motions with the players ignoring him, or continue to start a cold goalie to 'let him play though it' etc. Or just call up players that aren't really ready to replace key injured guys and just let the loses pile up.

I could see both Carolina and Ottawa going this way. Both cities have fans that support a winner, but fade away when the team is bad. I could see both wanting to hit a homerun through the draft and have a huge name prospect to fuel a rebuild. No doubt ownership in Buffalo would support this approach as well.

Let's not forget Edmonton in this. First, they've already addicted the fanbase to the belief that losing is the new winning. Then, they have a lame duck coach that the players don't listen to. And they've done nothing to shore up the 2nd line center position and are either going with a career AHLer or an 18 year old rookie in that key position. It would not surprise me at all to see them wait until a couple games in to the season to sign Schultz. What's the surest way to retain this asset at a low cost? A bridge contract where he misses training camp and preseason. He should be an even bigger defensive disaster and few players improve in any area when they miss preseason. This will 'help' in two ways: it keeps his next contract lower, and it helps propel them to last in the west. Seems like a mudcrunchy way of thinking to me.

Arizona is interesting... that lineup looks terrible, but Tippett always gets the most out his players. A little like us, the lineup is weak, but they'll play all out and management won't willingly let the team rack up loses. I think that will keep them (and the Flames as well) above the bottom 5 or so teams that will not try to prevent the losing.

dissentowner · 08-20-2014, 11:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by New Era

How is Ottawa getting votes over us here?

Ottawa's centers: Turris, Legwand, Zibanejad, Smith
Calgary's centers: Stajan, Backlund, Monahan, Bouma

Ottawa's RW: Ryan, Chaisson, Neil, Stone
Calgary's RW: Hudler, Colborne, Jones, McGrattan

Ottawa's LW: Michalek, MacArthur, Greening, Hoffman
Calgary's LW: Glencross, Gaudreau, Raymond, Bollig

Ottawa's G: Anderson, Lehner
Calgary's G: Hiller, Ramo

Ottawa's blue line: Karlsson, Phillips, Cecil, Methot, Cowan, Wiercioch
Calgary's blue line: Giordano, Brodie, Russell, Smid, Wideman, Engelland

The only position where we have an edge is on LW. We are somewhat competitive on the blue line and only marginally behind in goal. We get crushed in the middle and on the right side. I can't see Ottawa finishing bottom five in the league.

Sometimes I question your knowledge of hockey. The only thing Ottawa has over us is Bobby Ryan and Karlsson.

DOOM · 08-20-2014, 11:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dissentowner

Sometimes I question your knowledge of hockey. The only thing Ottawa has over us is Bobby Ryan and Karlsson.

Yea, agreed, I don't see a ton of differences.

puckedoff · 08-20-2014, 11:40 AM

I think that Winnipeg is really going to be 29th place bad

GGG · 08-20-2014, 11:50 AM

Arizona and Calgary are better coached than the others. Burke won't intentionally ice an inferior line up to get a better pick and Hartley won't allow vets to slack off and we have too many young players fighting for ice time to lose down the stretch. We aren't bottom two material.

Carolina, -- an older team with veterans to trade away or keep and not try will be next.
Ottawa -- Depends on Anderson, if they get a healthy year of good Anderson then they will be better
Florida -- I don;'t know much about Florida, will Luongo play well and drive them toward the playoffs or take the year off. I think Luongo is good enough and the East bad enough that they will be better than us.
Edmonton -- Don't they have to accidently be better sometime?

For now I think Edmonton and Carolina finish below us, Florida passes us We finish 4th last again. Generally though I think that their are enough bad teams that it is pretty likely that at least two of them finish below us. Which two is hard to pick but I am fairly confident that we won't finish bottom 2 in the league. 3/4 worst is where I see us headed to.

GGG · 08-20-2014, 11:53 AM

Also can we have a run off as I think a lot of the votes not being made for Calgary votes are Calgary won't finish second last rather than this specific team will be worse. As it stands right now 70% of people don't think Calgary will finish 2nd last. So maybe keep the bottom 3 and do another round.

Fire in the disco · 08-20-2014, 11:56 AM

Went with Edmonton, unless they pull an actual bold move I don't see them gaining on anyone from last season. I think some will be disappointed but the Flames only chance at Mcdavid/Eichel is if they win the draft lottery. I think Calgarys 25th at worst, 20th at best

Enoch Root · 08-20-2014, 12:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mikephoen

One thing to consider in the voting is not just which teams look bad on paper, but which teams have management that will be willing to purposely tank. I think it's incredibly naive to think teams won't do this.

No-one will go so far as to throw games, or tell players to lose the game, but I think there are teams that will let a lame duck coach go through the motions with the players ignoring him, or continue to start a cold goalie to 'let him play though it' etc. Or just call up players that aren't really ready to replace key injured guys and just let the loses pile up.

I could see both Carolina and Ottawa going this way. Both cities have fans that support a winner, but fade away when the team is bad. I could see both wanting to hit a homerun through the draft and have a huge name prospect to fuel a rebuild. No doubt ownership in Buffalo would support this approach as well.

Let's not forget Edmonton in this. First, they've already addicted the fanbase to the belief that losing is the new winning. Then, they have a lame duck coach that the players don't listen to. And they've done nothing to shore up the 2nd line center position and are either going with a career AHLer or an 18 year old rookie in that key position. It would not surprise me at all to see them wait until a couple games in to the season to sign Schultz. What's the surest way to retain this asset at a low cost? A bridge contract where he misses training camp and preseason. He should be an even bigger defensive disaster and few players improve in any area when they miss preseason. This will 'help' in two ways: it keeps his next contract lower, and it helps propel them to last in the west. Seems like a mudcrunchy way of thinking to me.

Arizona is interesting... that lineup looks terrible, but Tippett always gets the most out his players. A little like us, the lineup is weak, but they'll play all out and management won't willingly let the team rack up loses. I think that will keep them (and the Flames as well) above the bottom 5 or so teams that will not try to prevent the losing.

I agree. Carolina (especially) and Ottawa both seem like candidates to let things go really bad if they don't start well.

I can't see Arizona or Nashville throwing in the towel, but I can see Carolina, Ottawa, Buffalo, and Edmonton all 'focusing on the draft' if things aren't going well by US Thanksgiving.