Intent (at least in a criminal context) can include being wilfuly blind to the consequences of your actions. When you swing your stick around full speed at 180 degrees head-height to someone who is right beside you after the play has moved on, it is ridiculous to claim that the resulting injury was "accidental".
Hacking at a guy's shin pad or skate may demand discipline but it's not in the same ballpark. Is anyone really worried Scott was injured by Kessel?
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I'm sure this has been said 1 million times in this forum but I just have to chime in how much I hate the Canucks. Which is a lot. I can't really express it properly.
I'm new to the forum, and I haven't expressed that yet, and damn did it feel good.
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There was definitely some intent. Kassian appeared to be agitated that Gagner had stopped short leaving him out of position to finish the check so he reacted in frustration. Although he did not intend to hit his jaw, he knew where Gagner was on the ice and the swing was directly towards him. It was a "heat of the moment" reaction that had severe consequences. I think 5 games in warranted.
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Intent (at least in a criminal context) can include being wilfuly blind to the consequences of your actions. When you swing your stick around full speed at 180 degrees head-height to someone who is right beside you after the play has moved on, it is ridiculous to claim that the resulting injury was "accidental".
Stop trying to be a lawyer. You're obviously not one and you sound ridiculous.
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Originally Posted by Oling_Roachinen
5 games for an errant high-stick? Not a huge proponent of judging based on the outcome. If Kassian gets 5 for accidentally hurting someone with his stick while Kessel gets nothing for intending to injure Scott with his I'll be disappointed.
On the other hand it is an idiot Canuck, so I don't care too much.
This is exactly what's going to happen. At most, Kessel will miss some preseason games that don't matter and that he likely wouldn't have played anyway.
This is a clear example of why supplemental discipline in this league is an absolute joke. Those suspensions should've been reversed. Weise clearly goes for a high hit, intentionally, and misses, making contact with the opposing player's head. That's a dangerous play, precisely the sort of play that needs to stop happening, and there's no issue giving him eight games for it. Kassian's is a fluke. There is no intent to injure. Meanwhile, Kessel's play is a blatant attempt to injure, not once but twice, and the second time it's premeditated: having had a few seconds to think about what he just did he takes aim and does it again. Intent to injure is always, ALWAYS worse than an accidental play.
Players should have control of their stick and not doing so is suspendable - this was shown pretty clearly by the Bouchard suspension, which was widely criticized at the time because it was accidental. This one is four times longer. Better yet, it's eight times longer than this:
That is absolutely unjustifiable. If you ever needed proof of a sliding scale of justice, there it is.
Shanahan has become every bit as big a joke as his predecessors, and arguably even more political which I didn't think was even possible. It seemed to me like he started out with a new rigid standard, faced a bunch of media and organizational backlash, and cowed under the pressure until now he's become actually worthless as an arbiter. It's gotten to the point where I agree with about 20% of what comes out of the NHL's supplemental discipline office.
The fact that this may actually help the Canucks because they don't have to have Kassian playing on their top line is beside the point. Having to watch these videos makes me sick.
Reminds me of the Duncan Keith retaliatory high stick and suspension...
...except for a few small differences - Keith was consciously retaliating for a tap on his glove, he only received one game (Western Conference playoff, so regular season equivalent is probably 3), and was repeat offender. Oh well.
You're wrong about me being a lawyer. Also wrong that the injury was "a fluke". You do not have to intend to break someone's jaw in order to intend to injure. When you swing a stick at someone's face, you can't plead that you didn't mean to hurt the person, even if you aren't looking. I understand that it looks worse to face someone and swing your stick at their foot (and Kessel's second slash may deserve discipline)
Otherwise, I hear you on Shanahan's inconsistency and contrasting this incident with the Duncan Keith highsticking incident is a good example of that. The only thing I would point out is the consequences of misconduct are applicable in suspensions just as they are applicable in criminal sentencing.
Finally, while I'm a fan of neither team, my sympathies here lie with the Oilers. Imagine if it was Backlund getting injured on a careless gutless nothing play away from the play in a preseason game. Why does the game need that?
Kassian's is a fluke. There is no intent to injure.
I agree with many points of your post, but not this. What exactly was Kassian's intent? He realized he was going to miss a hit and spun to deliver a slash instead. Having seen the replays and given that the contact was hard enough to break another player's jaw I have a hard time believing he just lost control of his stick.
In my opinion, Kassian intended to deliver a slash which was made worse by the amount of power he put into the swing and the fact that it was high. He may not have intended to break Gagner's jaw, but when you send a slash that high with power, none of the consequences other than a complete miss are going to be good. I'm actually happy that he got "8" games, but the fact that 3 of them are pre-season is junk (ditto for Weise).
Will definately make the Kessel ruling interesting as I do think his were worse (deliberate vs stupid).
Weise's punishment is basically nothing at all. No forfeited salary and a couple games off mean nothing to a guy making the team.
Hopefully Macintyre gets an opportunity to provide supplemental discipline in game two of the season.
When he logs a -7 in the game and flounders around like a amputee seal with deflated water wings, and the Oilers lose 10-0 because they're fixated on payback.
The Canucks might not be as good of a team this year, but their powerplay is usually pretty stellar.
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5 games seems a little harsh for something most people believe was an honest mistake, but that's just me... But hey, it's the Canucks, so anything to hurt that team is a good thing in my books.
I'm ok with the 5 games. I do think it was accidental, but it was a reckless play and he just has to have better control of his stick. Weise should have got a game. Don't see the point in suspending him for the preseason. Not really a punishment.
What garbage. He even says it was a hit to the head, an illegal hit.
Weise has no prior history...........well, how about starting with a game or two or three right now? Suspending him for 3 pre-season games is basically a nice little break for him to rest before the season starts. Shanahan dropped the ball on this one.
