[Signing] Landeskog signed to 7 year extension 5.57AAV

[Meers]

That's a lot of money and a lot of years for 17 points.

[Macho0978]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

arguable.... Colorado had 3 of 4 last year.... sort of following the Edmonton example of looking good while sucking.

Kane and Toews joined Chicago and Chicago went from 71 pts to 88..as a team.. that was in year 1 ( Duchense and Landeskog and o'Reilly are entering year 3 as a group). Chicago has not had a high draft pick since.

Erik Johnson (or Shattenkirk/Chris Stewart) AND Paul Stasny were as good as Keith and Sharp who were the best players when Toews and kane showed up.

when do Duschene and O'Rielly and Landeskog actually turn the Av's into a winner? They are all getting paid like Kane and Toews were AFTER they carried the team to a Stanley cup win.


I sure hope we don't sign Baertschi to a 5.5M 7 year deal if he gets 40 pts this coming season.

When Kane and Toews resigned the cap was lower than it is now(59.3) and they make 6.3. If you turn the cap number into a percent you will see that Landeskog and Duchene are making much less. Then if you look at Toews and Kane as they played out their deal and the cap went up they eventually added depth back and won another cup. They both will be making 8 soon

[Wolven]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

I like Colorado's collection of young talent a lot more than Edmonton's.

But both teams are incomplete and several players away from being legitimate contenders.

Not only are both teams incomplete, they are incomplete in similar ways. Both teams seem to be stacked with good young forwards but are lacking high-end D and have question marks in net. Granted, I think the Avs goaltending situation is much better than the Oilers.

The difference is that the Avalanche are actually considered to have some very good prospects in both the D and G positions and the Avs are seeing some rookie Dmen break into the team in Elliot and Barrie.

By all accounts, the Avs should be a much better team than they showed last year and I think their offseason changes make them a much better team. They may still miss the playoffs but I would expect them to be closer to 15th overall than 30th.

Overall I like this signing. I do not believe that Landeskog will suddenly turn into a bust now that he has his contract signed. The worst case scenario I see is that they overpay him a bit now and underpay him in a few years.

[Major Major]

He's also the captain. If you're giving a guy that age the C, you will give him the term and lock him down. This is more about stable locker room culture than point production, where duchene has him beat.

[Parallex]

This is probably a fair deal for all parties. But man do the Aves ever stink outside of Forward. Not a fan of Varlamov and a very unimpressive D core past Johnson (who is good but does not live up to his 1/1 draft pedigree).

[$ven27]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

?????????

year 1 52 pts in 82 games 52 pt pace
Year 2 17 PTS in 36 games 40 pt pace

If he keeps growing at the pace he is going he might be a 30 pt guy in 82 games this coming season.

He had a few injuries this year, plus a bit of a sophomore slump. If you're going to call him a 30 point player because of a sub-par 2nd season then you really are out to lunch.

Av management is obviously blaming his poor season on the poor team overall and were ecstatic that he didn't play anywhere near the level he was supposed to as that would have cost them Mackinnon.

This is a joke right?

I always think it is the responsibility of the best players to carry the team.

And he did, Duchene carried them. Not to mention when your best players are still on their ELC, you can't expect them to carry the team.

He is no where close to where Phanuef was when he got his big contract and that didn't turn out well.

Also, they don't have to qualify ROR at 6M, they can take him to arbitration to lower it so that point is irrelevant.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by Macho0978

When Kane and Toews resigned the cap was lower than it is now(59.3) and they make 6.3. If you turn the cap number into a percent you will see that Landeskog and Duchene are making much less. Then if you look at Toews and Kane as they played out their deal and the cap went up they eventually added depth back and won another cup. They both will be making 8 soon

Kane and Toews had a Stanley Cup at that point so, you know, there's that

[Ozy_Flame]

Originally Posted by Parallex

This is probably a fair deal for all parties. But man do the Aves ever stink outside of Forward. Not a fan of Varlamov and a very unimpressive D core past Johnson (who is good but does not live up to his 1/1 draft pedigree).

Disagree. Corey Sarich is a BEAST.

[Flash Walken]

Originally Posted by Ozy_Flame

Disagree. Corey Sarich is a BEAST.

I forgot he was traded.

Wow, things are going to be different/great-because-they-are-different this year.

[ricardodw]

Originally Posted by $ven27

Also, they don't have to qualify ROR at 6M, they can take him to arbitration to lower it so that point is irrelevant.

Yep they could lower it to 85% of 6M or 5.1 M if they absolutely win the arbitration..... 18 months after some idiot GM offered a 1st 2nd and 3rd plus the 6M contract. They can also walk away and give up all rights to the player if the arbitrator goes nuts (gives Feaster a call) and gives ROR more.

Team taking a player to arbitration to lower their contract..... would this be the first.

I did not say that Landeskog was a 30 pts player.... He currently is coming off a 40 pts season ... after a 52 pt rookie year. There is no proof of a vast improvement as you implied in a previous post, in fact Landeskog and the Avs have to be disappointed in his performance last year.

Hard to think what kind of contract they would have given him had he actually improved last year and went a PPG like Eberle's 2nd year??

[jeffman]

Originally Posted by Wolven

Not only are both teams incomplete, they are incomplete in similar ways. Both teams seem to be stacked with good young forwards but are lacking high-end D and have question marks in net. Granted, I think the Avs goaltending situation is much better than the Oilers.

The difference is that the Avalanche are actually considered to have some very good prospects in both the D and G positions and the Avs are seeing some rookie Dmen break into the team in Elliot and Barrie.

By all accounts, the Avs should be a much better team than they showed last year and I think their offseason changes make them a much better team. They may still miss the playoffs but I would expect them to be closer to 15th overall than 30th.

Overall I like this signing. I do not believe that Landeskog will suddenly turn into a bust now that he has his contract signed. The worst case scenario I see is that they overpay him a bit now and underpay him in a few years.

I think the Oilers have better depth in defense. Nurse, Kleblom and Maricinin arent slumps. Colorado's top 6 has more variety of player types such as snipers, two way forwards and play makers

[Stampede2TheCup]

Originally Posted by Meers

That's a lot of money and a lot of years for 17 points.

[Vinny01]

I think Colorado will surprise a lot of people and make the playoffs next year. They have great young talent and just a horrible coach last year. Their forward group is down right scary. Duchene, MacKinnon, Stastny up the middle. Shifting RoR to the wing to play with other gritty forwards in Landeskog and Downie. Tangs and Parenteau are great veteran playmakers that can rack up points.

I also think Varlomov is a solid goalie but I do really question their blueline. It is bad....really bad

[Anduril]

Originally Posted by Vinny01

I think Colorado will surprise a lot of people and make the playoffs next year. They have great young talent and just a horrible coach last year. Their forward group is down right scary. Duchene, MacKinnon, Stastny up the middle. Shifting RoR to the wing to play with other gritty forwards in Landeskog and Downie. Tangs and Parenteau are great veteran playmakers that can rack up points.

I also think Varlomov is a solid goalie but I do really question their blueline. It is bad....really bad

Definitely can't forget this part of the equation. Now it's mostly the blueline as pointed out by most people to be the biggest question mark, not that we could say much about ours.

[Jake]

Some people are sure trying hard to criticize this signing. I'd trade any player on the Flames for Landeskog at this point and would sure be happy to have him on the team for the next 7 years at that cap hit. I bet he'll score 30 or more goals for most of those years, while playing in every situation, causing turnovers, and hitting everything that moves.

[Oling_Roachinen]

Originally Posted by Jake

Some people are sure trying hard to criticize this signing.

It's a 40M contract for a player with 100 games played coming off a 17 point season where he had a concussion. It's simply not a contract that is free from criticism.

I think it's a decent, if not risky, contract but I understand the criticism.

[Jake]

Originally Posted by Oling_Roachinen

It's a 40M contract for a player with 100 games played coming off a 17 point season where he had a concussion. It's simply not a contract that is free from criticism.

Thats actually what I am talking about. Saying "17 point season" just to support your point seems a bit misleading. His "17 point season" was actually 17 points in 36 games, which prorates to 20 goals and 39 points over a full season. Not to mention he was one of the most physical players on the team. He did this on the worst team in the league, as a 19 year old, while missing his usual centreman for most of the season (O'Reilly) and after a head injury.

He missed 11 games at the beginning of the season due to a concussion and didn't miss another game because of it for the rest of the season. Doesn't seem like a big deal.

Keep in mind he just came off a season in which he played all 82 games, nearly led the team in points, and won rookie of the year... and to top it all off he was selected as team captain the following off season. He was also the only Aves forward that played regularly that was a plus... and +20 at that.

Seems like a keeper.

[ricardodw]

Originally Posted by Jake

Thats actually what I am talking about. Saying "17 point season" just to support your point seems a bit misleading. His "17 point season" was actually 17 points in 36 games, which prorates to 20 goals and 39 points over a full season. Not to mention he was one of the most physical players on the team. He did this on the worst team in the league, as a 19 year old, while missing his usual centreman for most of the season (O'Reilly) and after a head injury.

He missed 11 games at the beginning of the season due to a concussion and didn't miss another game because of it for the rest of the season. Doesn't seem like a big deal.

Keep in mind he just came off a season in which he played all 82 games, nearly led the team in points, and won rookie of the year... and to top it all off he was selected as team captain the following off season. He was also the only Aves forward that played regularly that was a plus... and +20 at that.

Seems like a keeper.

great rookie season.....

Would have Eric Lindros been the best player of all time? His first concussion was in 1998 , two years later Stevens finished him as an elite player. Scott Stevens was 6-0 205 ....

But the NHL has cut down head shot concussions


Landeskog did not have a great second season no matter how anyone tries to spin it.

His first concussion is not something to be disregarded.... He did not perform at anywhere near his rookie level after he got it. His +25 preconcussion changed to a -7 after.

[Jake]

Nowhere near his rookie level? He was on pace for the same number of goals and about 10 fewer assists.

And perhaps his +/- can be explained by the fact that Colorado scored only 12 fewer goals than they allowed in Landeskogs rookie season, whereas last season, in only 48 games, their goal differential was already -36... and probably would have been closer to -60 over a full season. But no... probably the concussion right?

You are reaching here. Comparing Landeskog to Lindros, claiming his falling +/- is due to his concussion, and then saying he wasn't performing "anywhere near his rookie level" when he actually was.

[ricardodw]

Originally Posted by Jake

Nowhere near his rookie level? He was on pace for the same number of goals and about 10 fewer assists.

And perhaps his +/- can be explained by the fact that Colorado scored only 12 fewer goals than they allowed in Landeskogs rookie season, whereas last season, in only 48 games, their goal differential was already -36... and probably would have been closer to -60 over a full season. But no... probably the concussion right?

You are reaching here. Comparing Landeskog to Lindros, claiming his falling +/- is due to his concussion, and then saying he wasn't performing "anywhere near his rookie level" when he actually was.

No just adding the worry of a concussion to the contract.

After Lindros's first concussion he was never the same.

52 point pace as a Rookie and a 40 pt pace as a second year player.

A lot of posters want to trade/bench Glencross when he falls to a 40 pt season.


Will Glecross be getting 6M a year for his steady 20 goals 40-50 pts?

Glencross was coming off a 24 goal 43 point season when he signed the 4 year 2.55M deal. He gave up 4 UFA years.


The Avs could have done what the Jets did with Bogosian and Wheeler and Little .... first RFA deal around 2.5 M per 2/3 years and in the last RFA contract give him the 5-6M long term deal. The only guy they gave a Langskog deal was to was E. Kane....and he went from 14 goals to 19 goals to 30 goals to actually earn it.


The Av's are paying Duchene and Landeskog and soon to be RoR like Kane and Toews when they have not come close to the level of play that these guys reached when they got their big Long term deals.


Not many examples of these unearned (well unproven and repeated) long term deals working out good for the team..... Myers, Luke Schenn come to mind of guys who the long term deal after the ELC may have hurt.