777 crashes in San Fran

[Peanut]

Originally Posted by Acey

It didn't cartwheel, it spun around like a top. That witness isn't exactly sure what a cartwheel is.

Well, regardless, the tail fell off. That couldn't have happened quietly. I'd be freaking the f out, and exiting ASAP... not worrying about my iPad and make-up.

[Acey]

If a plane as big as a 777 cartwheels on landing, pretty much everyone is dead. That's why I freaked out when I first heard that description.

[Drake]

[drewboy12]

^^^ Incredible. Glad most people managed to get out before the fire. Pretty incredible the strength of the fuselage. Minus the burned interior and holes in the roof (from the fire, i'm guessing"

Wonder who is going to be at fault, pilot error or is it called "CAT"?

[Acey]

Originally Posted by drewboy12

Wonder who is going to be at fault, pilot error or is it called "CAT"?

Chances are slim it was clear air turbulence given the great weather at the time. We'll have to see if it was a mechanical failure... but a lot of smart people tonight think it might just be simple pilot error where he misjudged the approach and came up short.

[MarchHare]

Wonder who is going to be at fault, pilot error or is it called "CAT"?

Clear air turbulence tends to occur in the upper troposphere, not at sea level, so it's very unlikely it was a contributing factor to this incident. You're probably thinking of wind shear.

[puckluck2]

Honesty these guys are incredibly lucky after being stupid enough to take their bags with them. They should have left their bags behind. How long until it went up in flames?

[Acey]

Originally Posted by MarchHare

Clear air turbulence tends to occur in the upper troposphere, not at sea level, so it's very unlikely it was a contributing factor to this incident. You're probably thinking of wind shear.

Or the downdraft that brought down Delta 191 when they tried to land in a severe thunderstorm.

[stampsx2]

Originally Posted by Acey

Chances are slim it was clear air turbulence given the great weather at the time. We'll have to see if it was a mechanical failure... but a lot of smart people tonight think it might just be simple pilot error where he misjudged the approach and came up short.

I didn't think pilots landed planes anymore. I thought the ils system did it for them so how could it be pilot error. When they land in fog they don't see the runway at all.

[QuadCityImages]

Its crazy that people brought bags out with them. There's a pretty interesting book called The Survivor's Club that talks a lot about plane crashes, and surviving them. They found that most people think if someone survives a plane crash they have 30 minutes(!) to get out of the plane before being killed by smoke/heat/fire, when in reality its more like 90 seconds. So if you're not within 5 rows of an exit to start with, you're already in trouble; that extra 5 seconds to sling your bag over your shoulder is certainly not worth it.

Originally Posted by stampsx2

I didn't think pilots landed planes anymore. I thought the ils system did it for them so how could it be pilot error. When they land in fog they don't see the runway at all.

Now you've done it... aviation nerds: attack!

[browna]

I don't think it's that crazy that people have taken bags. Yes, you're not supposed to, and I am guessing those people that got out like that, totally unscathed, were nowhere near wherever and whenever the fire(s) started in the cabin.

As soon as it crashes and it seems like your upright and somewhat safely sliding to a stop, and they are trying to get people calm and prepare for emergency exit, you're getting up out of your chair, looking for the nearest exit, and getting ready to exit...when the plane comes to a halt, in the time you're waiting for the exit door to be pushed out, slide to inflate, you've been right beside your bag in the overhead compartment for that amount of time and it takes as little as two seconds to grab it as you go up the aisle. Who knows, some of those overhead doors may have popped open so its right there to grab. And, some of those bags may not even be those people's...they landed on them and they had nowhere to put them.

Bottom line, I don't think anyone knows how they'd react and how things actually went in there and likely some sections of the plane were less affected at exit time than others.

[Bertuzzied]

Originally Posted by stampsx2

I didn't think pilots landed planes anymore. I thought the ils system did it for them so how could it be pilot error. When they land in fog they don't see the runway at all.

Yeah thats what i thought too. Thats why there are no more new movies involving an everyday person landing a commercial jet.

[Rudee]

Originally Posted by QuadCityImages

Its crazy that people brought bags out with them.

The flight attendants should of been at the door by the emergency slides ensuring that that kind of thing didn't happen. They clearly screwed up allowing people to take carry on bags while exiting the aircraft.

[Rudee]

Originally Posted by stampsx2

I didn't think pilots landed planes anymore. I thought the ils system did it for them so how could it be pilot error. When they land in fog they don't see the runway at all.

ILS is not always functioning for all runways. Thus on clear days, runways are still used, but the landing is a visual landing.

[MrMastodonFarm]

Originally Posted by Rudee

The flight attendants should of been at the door by the emergency slides ensuring that that kind of thing didn't happen. They clearly screwed up allowing people to take carry on bags while exiting the aircraft.

How would that work exactly?

Once people (stupidly) grabbed their own bags you honestly expect the flight attendants to start arguing with people as they leave the plane to hand over their bags instead of just going down the slides?

Yeah, let's add more time and confusing to a crappy situation.

[4X4]

The flight attendants should have demanded that the passengers with bags leave them in a pile by the door to make exiting even more difficult.

[browna]

Originally Posted by 4X4

The flight attendants should have demanded that the passengers with bags leave them in a pile by the door to make exiting even more difficult.

Should also check them to make sure that they aren't taking any liquids out with them.

Agreed...any safety concerns for grabbing bags happen long before these people get to the exit door, and the flight attendants should be making sure the people jump off onto the slide properly and don't hold anyone up.

[burn_this_city]

CNN has a video of the crash, the plane did a 360 cartwheel after impact.

[Ducay]

Jesus thats brutal; how the plane did that move and remained so intact is beyond me. Looks like pilot took off his gear on the seawall and the rest is history.

[KelVarnsen]

Few things from Twitter just now.

NTSB ‏@NTSB 10m
The throttles were advanced a few seconds prior to impact and the engines appear to respond normally. #Asiana 214

NTSB ‏@NTSB 13m
The data indicate that the throttles were at idle and the airspeed slowed below target approach speed during the approach. #Asiana 214

https://twitter.com/NTSB