Samoa Air to start charging passengers according to their weight

[DuffMan]

That's a great idea, I've been saying for years this is how people should be charged.

[neo45]

This will create so many problems. It's pretty much destined to fail.

It'll take just one death from cutting weight to try and save 20 bucks

[Burninator]

Question for you airplane buffs. Is charging extra for luggage (or in this case passenger weight) really make a difference on your average plane? Don't lots of planes carry cargo negating much of the difference between luggage and fatties?

[Hemi-Cuda]

Originally Posted by Burninator

Question for you airplane buffs. Is charging extra for luggage (or in this case passenger weight) really make a difference on your average plane? Don't lots of planes carry cargo negating much of the difference between luggage and fatties?

it does when you're flying in one of these

[Envitro]

^ yes and yes.

And this opens them up to wholesale discrimination lawsuits for people who are naturally a lot bigger (i.e. 6'4" 225lbs vs 5'5" 140 lbs), let alone people who are visibly obese or morbidly obese.

[valo403]

Originally Posted by Envitro

^ yes and yes.

And this opens them up to wholesale discrimination lawsuits for people who are naturally a lot bigger (i.e. 6'4" 225lbs vs 5'5" 140 lbs), let alone people who are visibly obese or morbidly obese.

How? It's a blanket policy, obesity has nothing to do with it. It's no different than charging freight fees when shipping an item. For something to be discriminatory you have to actually be treating someone different, this policy treats everyone the same.

[GP_Matt]

It only works if it is a fixed cost plus $/kg.
Weight is a factor in the cost but not the only factor. Everyone who occupies a seat has a fixed cost whether they are a 20 pound infant or a 300 pound giant.

[Leondros]

Originally Posted by GP_Matt

It only works if it is a fixed cost plus $/kg.
Weight is a factor in the cost but not the only factor. Everyone who occupies a seat has a fixed cost whether they are a 20 pound infant or a 300 pound giant.

Thats making the assumption that you arnt putting overhead, direct labor and direct materials into the cost per kg - which you can do.

[Sr. Mints]

As someone who's 6'6 and 270 pounds, I'm all for this. But I want a seat with ample leg room, a wider seat, more head space, a taller seat, etc. Otherwise I'll be grumpy and do nothing about it and suffer in silence.

[GP_Matt]

Originally Posted by Leondros

Thats making the assumption that you arnt putting overhead, direct labor and direct materials into the cost per kg - which you can do.

To make the pricing fair though they need a cost for the physical space that you are occupying.

Some of those costs are fixed though for the flight. ie. no matter the weight, the airplane still needs to cover the distance and they need to pay a pilot and crew. Why should the overweight man pay a greater share of the pilot's salary? He should only pay a greater share of the fuel burned and possibly a greater share to account for the fact that he gets a bigger seat or more legroom.

[SeeGeeWhy]

http://business.financialpost.com/20...-by-the-pound/

http://brage.bibsys.no/hsf/retrieve/...hatta_PAYW.pdf

"Under the current charging policy of airlines, fares are set regardless of weight and size of passengers. Marginal cost theory implies that the average fare seldom reflects the actual cost of flying a passenger because it does not take into account a passenger’s weight or the space taken up. Fares based on PAYW principles may be more efficient because passengers pay according to the fuel they use and the space they take up in a plane. Charging according to weight and space is a widely accepted principle in many other industries, but has met with public opposition in the context of air travel."

It would be interesting if health care worked this way as well, wouldn't it?

[valo403]

Originally Posted by SeeGeeWhy

http://business.financialpost.com/20...-by-the-pound/

http://brage.bibsys.no/hsf/retrieve/...hatta_PAYW.pdf

"Under the current charging policy of airlines, fares are set regardless of weight and size of passengers. Marginal cost theory implies that the average fare seldom reflects the actual cost of flying a passenger because it does not take into account a passenger’s weight or the space taken up. Fares based on PAYW principles may be more efficient because passengers pay according to the fuel they use and the space they take up in a plane. Charging according to weight and space is a widely accepted principle in many other industries, but has met with public opposition in the context of air travel."

It would be interesting if health care worked this way as well, wouldn't it?

Isn't that exactly how health care works in countries without socialized systems? Use 20 morphine, pay for 20 morphine. Require an operating room, pay for an operating room.

[SeeGeeWhy]

Originally Posted by valo403

Isn't that exactly how health care works in countries without socialized systems? Use 20 morphine, pay for 20 morphine. Require an operating room, pay for an operating room.

I was referring to Canada.

[CaramonLS]

Being 6'4 myself, I'm fine with this...

...As long as to compensate they reduce the size of the seats for the smaller people, and give the bigger people slightly more room.

[mrkajz44]

Is anyone wondering how this policy is enforced? Most tickets would be bought online I would think, so why wouldn't you just fudge your weight and pick up a cheaper ticket? Are they going to have a scale at the gate to ensure you didn't lie?

So many questions!

[Cowperson]

Originally Posted by mrkajz44

Is anyone wondering how this policy is enforced? Most tickets would be bought online I would think, so why wouldn't you just fudge your weight and pick up a cheaper ticket? Are they going to have a scale at the gate to ensure you didn't lie?

So many questions!

I was just thinking the same thing.

Really, you can only do this by having a service where people show up at the counter, stand on a scale and buy a ticket.

OR, alternatively, the client buys the ticket online, stating a weight, and then shows up at the airport, reconciles on a scale, and pays a difference or is refunded a difference versus what they had stated on-line.

Cowperson

[Devils'Advocate]

Originally Posted by SeeGeeWhy

It would be interesting if health care worked this way as well, wouldn't it?

Just so I am clear, before going off half-cocked... are you suggesting that people that weigh more should pay more for health care?

[Stormchaser]

Originally Posted by Devils'Advocate

Just so I am clear, before going off half-cocked... are you suggesting that people that weigh more should pay more for health care?

People that smoke cigarettes and are obese should pay a higher rate because they are the ones who will need more care in the future or are at the highest risk of needing care. There are so many more unhealthy habits that we could add to the list as well......drugs, excessive drinking.......

I'm sure there is a huge grey area in that last statement but it is frustrating to see people being a drain on our healthcare when they could proactively do something to better themselves and live a healthier life.

I'd also be in favor of lowering someones rate if they went to the gym or led a physically active life. Overall I think it would be fair to impose higher health care rates on those people who don't take care of their health.

[Bring_Back_Shantz]

Originally Posted by stormchaser

People that smoke cigarettes and are obese should pay a higher rate because they are the ones who will need more care in the future or are at the highest risk of needing care. There are so many more unhealthy habits that we could add to the list as well......drugs, excessive drinking.......

I'm sure there is a huge grey area in that last statement but it is frustrating to see people being a drain on our healthcare when they could proactively do something to better themselves and live a healthier life.

I'd also be in favor of lowering someones rate if they went to the gym or led a physically active life. Overall I think it would be fair to impose higher health care rates on those people who don't take care of their health.

That's now how things work man.
If we start doing that then we have to start charging active people for a larger share of bike/running paths.

People who drive more have to pay more for roads.
People on welfare, have to pay more UI.....wait how does that one work
People who have a house fire have to pay to have the FD come put it out

We decide as a society what services we want to have/offer, and we all pay what we pay for taxes, and we use the services as we want/need them. That's how it works, and that's how it should work.

[Thor]

Originally Posted by stormchaser

People that smoke cigarettes and are obese should pay a higher rate because they are the ones who will need more care in the future or are at the highest risk of needing care. There are so many more unhealthy habits that we could add to the list as well......drugs, excessive drinking.......

I'm sure there is a huge grey area in that last statement but it is frustrating to see people being a drain on our healthcare when they could proactively do something to better themselves and live a healthier life.

I'd also be in favor of lowering someones rate if they went to the gym or led a physically active life. Overall I think it would be fair to impose higher health care rates on those people who don't take care of their health.

This is really fascinating stuff. Ideally these things make sense, but when you dig deeper you are addressing the wrong side.

Its often people in poverty and low income who are obese because we subsidize crops used to make high calorie, low nutrient foods that is helping lead an epidemic of obesity in the western world.

So you would punish those obese and poor by telling them to pay more, instead of going after the food supply which has become a very high tech way of making food that's unhealthy, low in nutrients, and engineered to be as desirable and addictive as possible by manipulation of the big 3, salt, sugar and fats.

People often just look at fat people and blame them, yeah its easy but there is a much deeper problem and if we are to be serious about doing anything about it you should stop vilifying the obese and looking at what we as a society have become with our food supply being such a toxic supply of unhealthy, high calorie and low nutrient food supply where buying fruits and veg is expensive and fast food is cheap.