How is Baertschi doing in the AHL?

[Henry Fool]

Originally Posted by dino7c

agreed, he shouldn't have been counted on to be the teams #1 center and that isn't his fault

Well, strictly speaking he shouldn't have been counted on to be a center at all.

Cervenka is about what I expected him to be. Still might end up going back to Europe. The team was dumb to expect that he'd do anything more and the fact that he wasn't even a center is beyond hilarious.

[Street Pharmacist]

Originally Posted by Henry Fool

Well, strictly speaking he shouldn't have been counted on to be a center at all.

Cervenka is about what I expected him to be. Still might end up going back to Europe. The team was dumb to expect that he'd do anything more and the fact that he wasn't even a center is beyond hilarious.

Dumb? Hilarious? He was a good player in another league. Why can't he be good here?

[spuzzum]

Originally Posted by vilzeh

I'd say Brunner was the "Best player not in the NHL", not Cervenka.

Brunner also has the luxury to say: "I am playing with Mr. Zetterberg." No real comparison for Cervenka

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

Which is a cautionary tale of just how much better the NHL is than other leagues and being a star in the KHL doesn't mean you will even be a regular in the NHL. That said I wouldn't pass off Cervenka as a failure as I feel with an offseason to move his family over and full training camp we may see a lot more from him next year. If he returns of course.

agreed.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by vilzeh

I'd say Brunner was the "Best player not in the NHL", not Cervenka.

No he wasn't. But he has been given a great opportunity in Detroit and he has made the most of it.

Whereas Cervenka got off to a bad start with the blood clot and no training camp, and also hasn't been put in such a great position. So far, he hasn't been able to overcome all that, but he still might,

I would like to see more games and more situations for both of them before making a decision on who's 'better'

Like EE said, let's see what he can do next year when things are more settled.

[Henry Fool]

Originally Posted by Street Pharmacist

Dumb? Hilarious? He was a good player in another league. Why can't he be good here?

He can, any good player can, I don't dispute that, but the issue is what you can realistically expect, especially in the first season. You can't count on such players to transition. So it was dumb to pencil him in the top-6 when he hadn't played a single game in NA.

Hilarious was the fact that he was thought to be a center but then it turns out he's not comfortable in the position. Again, not his fault, but it's still funny how even high profile European players can be so poorly scouted. Sometimes I think that certain teams would be better off consulting Hfboards - at least there are people who watch these leagues there.

[Phanuthier]

Originally Posted by Henry Fool

He can, any good player can, I don't dispute that, but the issue is what you can realistically expect, especially in the first season. You can't count on such players to transition. So it was dumb to pencil him in the top-6 when he hadn't played a single game in NA.

Hilarious was the fact that he was thought to be a center but then it turns out he's not comfortable in the position. Again, not his fault, but it's still funny how even high profile European players can be so poorly scouted. Sometimes I think that certain teams would be better off consulting Hfboards - at least there are people who watch these leagues there.

I would be very scared if consulting HFBoards gives us better expertise then our paid scouts in the best league outside of the NHL.

[Henry Fool]

Originally Posted by Phanuthier

I would be very scared if consulting HFBoards gives us better expertise then our paid scouts in the best league outside of the NHL.

It's hyperbole, obviously, but I'm not really talking about expertise here. All you needed is a regular fan who knows what position the player prefers.

[Street Pharmacist]

Originally Posted by spuzzum

Brunner also has the luxury to say: "I am playing with Mr. Zetterberg." No real comparison for Cervenka

Oh come on , Comeau is no slouch

[CaramonLS]

Originally Posted by Phanuthier

In fairness, we were all told he was the "best player not in the NHL" ....

Top Centre

[BurningSteel]

Originally Posted by Phanuthier

In fairness, we were all told he was the "best player not in the NHL" ....

Uhm.......i thought that was Lando immediatly followed by Shanko??

[Stay Golden]

Originally Posted by Itse

I'm not sure I'd say Cervenka has performed well, but considering everything I'm okay with where he's at right now. Next season is the real measuring stick.

that is the truth right there and what will he want for a contract. 3.7m is what he was paid but $925 is the NHL salary. He has shown spots of potential he has also been a liability in other games.They would be foolish to offer more than 2.5m JMO.

[Henry Fool]

At this point the "best player not in the NHL" meme is so strong that we basically just tell it to ourselves - and usually it's only evoked to ridicule the notion. It's bizarre.

"I assume there is someone somewhere who called him the best player not in the NHL - ha! What an idiot!"

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by Stay Golden

that is the truth right there and what will he want for a contract. 3.7m is what he was paid but $925 is the NHL salary. He has shown spots of potential he has also been a liability in other games.They would be foolish to offer more than 2.5m JMO.

$2.5m sounds a bit high to me (though I would love to see him get it going in the second half and force the Flames to pay him that much).

If it were negotiated right now (which it won't be), I would think $1.25 - $1.5m would be the number.

[Ezio]

Best player not in the NHL is still Radulov.

[MrMastodonFarm]

Originally Posted by Change of Heart

they also expected too much out of Cervenka

Originally Posted by burnitdown

Are you saying we should temper our expectations when we keep hearing that Karri Ramo is the best goalie not in the NHL?!

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

Which is a cautionary tale of just how much better the NHL is than other leagues and being a star in the KHL doesn't mean you will even be a regular in the NHL. That said I wouldn't pass off Cervenka as a failure as I feel with an offseason to move his family over and full training camp we may see a lot more from him next year. If he returns of course.

Originally Posted by Stay Golden

We were also told he was a center, foolish for us to assume Feaster meant a KHL center

Originally Posted by you got PHANUEFED

Ramo is also a Feaster draft pick so that should also set off a light bulb or two right there.

Originally Posted by vilzeh

I'd say Brunner was the "Best player not in the NHL", not Cervenka.

Originally Posted by StrykerSteve

Cervenka has been fine, IMO. Considering the factors, he's performed well.

Originally Posted by dino7c

agreed, he shouldn't have been counted on to be the teams #1 center and that isn't his fault

Originally Posted by Itse

I'm not sure I'd say Cervenka has performed well, but considering everything I'm okay with where he's at right now. Next season is the real measuring stick.

Originally Posted by Henry Fool

Well, strictly speaking he shouldn't have been counted on to be a center at all.

Cervenka is about what I expected him to be. Still might end up going back to Europe. The team was dumb to expect that he'd do anything more and the fact that he wasn't even a center is beyond hilarious.

Originally Posted by Street Pharmacist

Dumb? Hilarious? He was a good player in another league. Why can't he be good here?

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

agreed.

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

No he wasn't. But he has been given a great opportunity in Detroit and he has made the most of it.

Whereas Cervenka got off to a bad start with the blood clot and no training camp, and also hasn't been put in such a great position. So far, he hasn't been able to overcome all that, but he still might,

I would like to see more games and more situations for both of them before making a decision on who's 'better'

Like EE said, let's see what he can do next year when things are more settled.

Originally Posted by Henry Fool

He can, any good player can, I don't dispute that, but the issue is what you can realistically expect, especially in the first season. You can't count on such players to transition. So it was dumb to pencil him in the top-6 when he hadn't played a single game in NA.

Hilarious was the fact that he was thought to be a center but then it turns out he's not comfortable in the position. Again, not his fault, but it's still funny how even high profile European players can be so poorly scouted. Sometimes I think that certain teams would be better off consulting Hfboards - at least there are people who watch these leagues there.

Originally Posted by Phanuthier

I would be very scared if consulting HFBoards gives us better expertise then our paid scouts in the best league outside of the NHL.

Originally Posted by Henry Fool

It's hyperbole, obviously, but I'm not really talking about expertise here. All you needed is a regular fan who knows what position the player prefers.

Originally Posted by Street Pharmacist

Oh come on , Comeau is no slouch

Originally Posted by CaramonLS

Top Centre

Originally Posted by BurningSteel

Uhm.......i thought that was Lando immediatly followed by Shanko??

Originally Posted by Stay Golden

that is the truth right there and what will he want for a contract. 3.7m is what he was paid but $925 is the NHL salary. He has shown spots of potential he has also been a liability in other games.They would be foolish to offer more than 2.5m JMO.

Originally Posted by Henry Fool

At this point the "best player not in the NHL" meme is so strong that we basically just tell it to ourselves - and usually it's only evoked to ridicule the notion. It's bizarre.

"I assume there is someone somewhere who called him the best player not in the NHL - ha! What an idiot!"

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

$2.5m sounds a bit high to me (though I would love to see him get it going in the second half and force the Flames to pay him that much).

If it were negotiated right now (which it won't be), I would think $1.25 - $1.5m would be the number.

So, Sven Baerschi?

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by MrMastodonFarm

So, Sven Baerschi?

Who is Sven Baerschi?

[Badgers Nose]

Sven will be fine. Backlund and Brodie are proof that youngsters can survive being 'developed' by the Flames.

[djsFlames]

I've actually had no issues with Cervenka all things considered.

I think he's only getting better, and he's shown that when he's not physically against it he can make some pretty amazing and skilled plays and read the ice very well even in this league.

The problem with both Cervenka and Hudler is the opposition. Teams that aren't as big as others that offer a bit more open ice the two can be very effective against, but teams like the Ducks and Kings that are bigger, can out muscle them and take away time and space effectively in the offensive zone will shut them down pretty handily. It's unfortunate, and they're great players skill-wise, but they definitely have to be up against the right opposition.

I would absolutely take on Cervenka beyond this year if he so desires to stay in the city and wants to continue playing here. He's got the tools and he's at the age where he should just be entering his prime. So he's still on the upswing (unlike a lot of others on the team) and I think with more experience can develop into a legitimate top 6 scorer.

[Phanuthier]

^ Agreed

While its nice to finally have some slick skills, I think Feaster went overboard in dumping the majority of our size/grit for skill fwd's and puck moving dman (side note: remember when we used to get all crazy over puck moving D? now its #1C)

Hudler/Cerv are very useful in some situations. Othertimes, we need someone to go up against LA/Anahaim and not get tossed around like a rag doll.