RCMP college in Fort MacLeod was a great idea until Wildrose won the riding

[Muta]

One thing I can now laugh at, is that you'd think the government would consult with the police forces in Edmonton and Calgary and the RCMP about the feasibility of such a facility BEFORE going to tender for this thing, and spending $2 million in the process. But, I digress.

[CarlW]

What's worse is that this seems to be pretty devastating for Fort MacLeod as I heard they spent millions on getting service lines to the set, and land was bought for expanding commercial/residential to accommodate the projected influx of people from the college.

[zuluking]

Originally Posted by Muta

One thing I can now laugh at, is that you'd think the government would consult with the police forces in Edmonton and Calgary and the RCMP about the feasibility of such a facility BEFORE going to tender for this thing, and spending $2 million in the process. But, I digress.

Actually, to me, this is the entire issue. It sounds to me like the police forces have always and consistently felt it was a bad idea, making this a political patronage type initiative (for that riding) at the onset. It totally sucks for Ft. Macleod, but it sounds like the right decision albeit far too late in the process.

I think it would be politically easy for a WRA-led gov't to turn this decision over as it was initiated by the PCs. Whether I agree with it or not, I have to be impressed that the PCs made the unpopular decision to overturn their own initiative especially in light of how far along it had gotten. Someone figured out what "sunk costs" means.

(Probably made the decision a bit easier with the riding having flipped to the WRA though...)

[Muta]

Originally Posted by CarlW

What's worse is that this seems to be pretty devastating for Fort MacLeod as I heard they spent millions on getting service lines to the set, and land was bought for expanding commercial/residential to accommodate the projected influx of people from the college.

I would imagine that they are devastated. From what I know, the whole area was relying on that project for a variety of reasons. I'd be hugely pissed if I were them. They were so excited for it, too.

[Resolute 14]

Originally Posted by Slava

Well all I know is that if the Wildrose would do the exact same thing in this situation then its a moot point. I like the attempt to trot out a "we would do the same thing but for a better reason" line, but at the end of the day it doesn't matter. The Wildrose would be doing the same, and no they wouldn't be any closer than the PCs to balancing the budget.

I can't tell you what Wildrose would hypothetically have done, but your attempt at deflection misses the mark. If Wildrose formed government, but the MacLeod riding was still held by the PCs, and they cancelled it, then you might have a comparable situation.

My point is that this college was announced six years ago. The PC's have been touting it ever since. Then suddenly, after an election in which they lost the seat in that riding, all of the police chiefs supposedly wrote in to say the facility would never be properly used? The timing of that is remarkably convenient.

We really are left with two options here. Either the PCs are incompetent to the point that they failed to assess the viability of such a school a half-decade ago, or the cancellation (and likely the initial announcement) was political. I asked above why the government didn't slash the school in the February budget if it wanted to save costs, but we both know that was a rhetorical question. If it had, the PCs were guaranteed to lose the riding. So they strung everyone along for political advantage, then pulled the plug when that advantage failed to materialize

And given many contracts were apparently signed, I wonder just what we will have to pay in cancellation penalties.

And now, of course, the government has come out and admitted that the deficit it called for before the election was a lie, and the truth is up to four times worse. It might well be a good thing that people were foolish enough to vote for Ric McIver. If they hadn't, Redford might have blown up the south hospital to save money.

[Traditional_Ale]

^ Ding ding ding! We have a winner!

I voted Wildrose not so much because I think they'd be better, but the complacency of a government in power for so long makes me think in the short-term at least the WR would do an honest job.

[bizaro86]

Originally Posted by Traditional_Ale

^ Ding ding ding! We have a winner!

I voted Wildrose not so much because I think they'd be better, but the complacency of a government in power for so long makes me think in the short-term at least the WR would do an honest job.

Yeah, it seems like we should switch every few decades at minimum. The new guys might not be any less corrupt or make decisions any more rationally, but at least it'd take them a few years to get really practiced up at screwing the populace.

[Traditional_Ale]

Originally Posted by bizaro86

Yeah, it seems like we should switch every few decades at minimum. The new guys might not be any less corrupt or make decisions any more rationally, but at least it'd take them a few years to get really practiced up at screwing the populace.

Well I thought the CPC was doing an outstanding job as a minority federal government. I thought it was the other parties getting in the way of actually running the country. Come to think of it, an economist in charge of a minority government through a major recession really was a blessing for the country. But the tyranny of a majority is showing its fangs now.

As for Alberta, I think the WR is smart enough to know that if they ever got into power their leash would be so short. Like I alluded to earlier in the thread, Alberta has a real hard-on for sucking the teat of the status quo, even though Albertans seem to not realize that status quo is far from where it started and bears little resemblance to reality.

Redford and her posse are so laughable they appear less like a government, and more like a bunch of rich people playing high school student council with our tax dollars. Somebody didn't get to be the prom queen, so she cancelled the prom as the caterers were setting up.

[Mean Mr. Mustard]

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

You would think they would have made that cut in February with the budget instead of allocating nearly $20 million towards the project, eh?

While it is possible the government made the right decision for the wrong reason, it is still that wrong reason that is concerning.

While it is possible that it is the right decision made for reasons that were not punishing a riding. The decision is one that was supported by all of the parties who would be potentially using the facilities to the best of my knowledge (CPS, EPS, RCMP). I don't see how you can say with any certainty that it was made for the wrong reason, could it be that a new government examined the issue - looked at the potential costs and decided that it would be a poor decision to go forth with spending 120 million + on a police college that no one saw the need for. That is the other option and as it stands right now that seems like a pretty reasonable one at that.

Regarding the twenty million, I don't know, that being said I think it would be stupid for the government to start throwing good money after bad, which this undoubtably will.

[Jacks]

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

And given many contracts were apparently signed, I wonder just what we will have to pay in cancellation penalties.

By the time the penalties and lawyers are paid it will no doubt be a substantial amount. Then Redford will promise to hold a "review to find out what went wrong so it never happens again" and we can all go back to our regulary scheduled programming.

[Traditional_Ale]

Originally Posted by Jacks

By the time the penalties and lawyers are paid it will no doubt be a substantial amount. Then Redford will promise to hold a "review to find out what went wrong so it never happens again" and we can all go back to our regulary scheduled programming.

Edit: MMM's right. Too far.

[First Lady]

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

Then suddenly, after an election in which they lost the seat in that riding, all of the police chiefs supposedly wrote in to say the facility would never be properly used? The timing of that is remarkably convenient.

As I understand it, it was 3 chiefs (out of how many?) and their comments can bring a 122 M project to a screeching halt just as it is starting; yet 100's (ordinary residents) write and contact government about the detrimental effects of closing a senior care center (Carmangay) and they get no reaction.

Things that make you go hmmmm.

[Senator Clay Davis]

Expect more to come...

The Redford government says this year’s deficit will balloon to up to $3 billion and the province will have to cap spending and review capital projects due to lower-than-predicted bitumen royalties, conventional oil revenues and Crown lease sales.

But in the province’s first-quarter update released Thursday morning, the government insisted it’s still on track to deliver a balanced budget by next year - despite $400-million less in energy revenues during the first three months of this fiscal year, which the government blames on volatile prices for Alberta crude.

“It’s a bit of a rollercoaster,” Alberta Finance Minister Doug Horner said at a press conference.

In the February budget, the government predicted a more manageable $886-million deficit for 2012-13. It now forecasts a deficit of between $2.3 billion to $3 billion this fiscal year.

To get spending in hand, Horner said all government departments have been asked to review capital projects to see what can be delayed or cancelled. He pointed to Wednesday’s controversial cancellation of a long-planned police training college in Fort Macleod as an example of government action.

http://www.calgaryherald.com/busines...#ixzz253gpQXbq

[Mean Mr. Mustard]

...

[Traditional_Ale]

^ Fair enough. I withdrew the post.

[NuclearPizzaMan]

Originally Posted by First Lady

As I understand it, it was 3 chiefs (out of how many?) and their comments can bring a 122 M project to a screeching halt just as it is starting; yet 100's (ordinary residents) write and contact government about the detrimental effects of closing a senior care center (Carmangay) and they get no reaction.

Things that make you go hmmmm.

The Police Chiefs for Calgary and Edmonton, and the Commissioner of the RCMP aren't just "3 chiefs out of many", they are the big fish in a small pond.

[Slava]

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

I can't tell you what Wildrose would hypothetically have done, but your attempt at deflection misses the mark. If Wildrose formed government, but the MacLeod riding was still held by the PCs, and they cancelled it, then you might have a comparable situation.

My point is that this college was announced six years ago. The PC's have been touting it ever since. Then suddenly, after an election in which they lost the seat in that riding, all of the police chiefs supposedly wrote in to say the facility would never be properly used? The timing of that is remarkably convenient.

We really are left with two options here. Either the PCs are incompetent to the point that they failed to assess the viability of such a school a half-decade ago, or the cancellation (and likely the initial announcement) was political. I asked above why the government didn't slash the school in the February budget if it wanted to save costs, but we both know that was a rhetorical question. If it had, the PCs were guaranteed to lose the riding. So they strung everyone along for political advantage, then pulled the plug when that advantage failed to materialize

And given many contracts were apparently signed, I wonder just what we will have to pay in cancellation penalties.

And now, of course, the government has come out and admitted that the deficit it called for before the election was a lie, and the truth is up to four times worse. It might well be a good thing that people were foolish enough to vote for Ric McIver. If they hadn't, Redford might have blown up the south hospital to save money.

So the PC's can only cancel projects in ridings where they have seats otherwise there subject to the Wildrose saying its political? Just asking, because that's sure what it looks like to me. If the police chiefs don't want the thing then why are we going to spend $122M on it? Even you with your obvious bias can admit that makes no sense.

As for the deficit, I can only say that the Liberals have been pointing out the need for other sources of income and did so throughout the campaign. Every time the most rational of these is brought up though (a consumption tax) the Wildrose and friends complains about that idea saying its terrible for business. I have no idea where they would magically put us in a better fiscal position but its something about "creating synergies", "finding efficiencies" and other buzzwords that mean neither do they.

[Muta]

Originally Posted by First Lady

As I understand it, it was 3 chiefs (out of how many?) and their comments can bring a 122 M project to a screeching halt just as it is starting; yet 100's (ordinary residents) write and contact government about the detrimental effects of closing a senior care center (Carmangay) and they get no reaction.

Things that make you go hmmmm.

... what good is a facility if you don't need it? I agree the PC's should have done their research better on this project, but what are you going to do - build an expensive campus that won't be used? Probably shouldn't do that.

[Resolute 14]

Originally Posted by Slava

So the PC's can only cancel projects in ridings where they have seats otherwise there subject to the Wildrose saying its political? Just asking, because that's sure what it looks like to me. If the police chiefs don't want the thing then why are we going to spend $122M on it? Even you with your obvious bias can admit that makes no sense.

Sure... but why weren't the chiefs saying this in February? Last year? Two years ago? Three years ago? Four years ago? Five years ago? Six years ago? And if they were, why wasn't the government listening?

C'mon Slava, even you have to admit the timing stinks to high hell.

As for the deficit, I can only say that the Liberals have been pointing out the need for other sources of income and did so throughout the campaign. Every time the most rational of these is brought up though (a consumption tax) the Wildrose and friends complains about that idea saying its terrible for business. I have no idea where they would magically put us in a better fiscal position but its something about "creating synergies", "finding efficiencies" and other buzzwords that mean neither do they.

Adding sources of income does not solve the root issue, which is how the government spends money like an 18-year-old who just got back from working three months in Fort McMurray.

But then, I might be too harsh. It seems the government is showing signs of learning how to control its runaway spending. But only in ridings that aren't blue.

[Coys1882]

It's funny how often and blatant this stuff happens in politics. I can't help but laugh every time we go to my wife's hometown in Vegreville and see the Immigration Centre there.