Justin Trudeau dosen't help the Liberal cause

[Lt.Spears]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

How many people here would rather have Alberta separation than a Trudeau Canada?

I understand that being a politician, he should be careful about expressing those ideas, but I am sure a lot of people can relate to the sentiment.

I imagine that Trudeau was using some hyperbole.

Canada would turn into Greece, Alberta into economic super power

[Rerun]

Justin Trudeau is an idiot.. just like his old man. Its obvious the apple doesn't fall far from the tree.

Harper is doing a great job as PM. Best PM this country has had in decades.

oh... and Liberals can kiss my ass, which is actually what they are pretty good at.

[crazy_eoj]

Originally Posted by Devils'Advocate

Oh my! Captain Cruch doesn't like something Justin Trudeau said! Call me shocked!

Actually, if my choice was Harper or separating ONTARIO (or any other province), I'd choose separation. While not reopening either issue, we get a pretty good understanding of the VALUES held by conservatives. We have Stephen Woodworth wanting a parliamentary committee to look into when life begins.

And this:


I do *NOT* like Conservative values. Social or fiscal. And I find it utterly hypocritical that people that support separating Alberta when the Liberals are in power are slamming someone for suggesting that a different province do the same when there is a party and leader in power that does not share THEIR values.

Ah yes, you have to love the hyper-righteousness poured on by members of the left.

Ignoring the fact the J.T.'s concerns are largely figments of his imagination made up to conjur some sort of political support, and the fact that Alberta seperation was clearly stoked by a made in Quebec policy to rape and pillage Alberta's economy for the benefit of eastern canada, you may have a point.

Then again, those darn facts are so hard to ignore sometimes!

Originally Posted by Jean Chretien

"When you talk about marriage contracts between homosexual couples, I’m not personally very comfortable with that, because I don’t know how that works in a society, and secondly, marriage is not federal responsibility. It’s a contract between two individuals according to the Canadian tradition of different sexes sharing a family life together. And you know, the marriage question is not our responsibility."

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by Devils'Advocate

Oh my! Captain Cruch doesn't like something Justin Trudeau said! Call me shocked!

Actually, if my choice was Harper or separating ONTARIO (or any other province), I'd choose separation. While not reopening either issue, we get a pretty good understanding of the VALUES held by conservatives. We have Stephen Woodworth wanting a parliamentary committee to look into when life begins.

And this:


I do *NOT* like Conservative values. Social or fiscal. And I find it utterly hypocritical that people that support separating Alberta when the Liberals are in power are slamming someone for suggesting that a different province do the same when there is a party and leader in power that does not share THEIR values.

Who gives a crap about a quote from 7 years ago, the bottom line is its the law of the land and Harper even though he has a major majority has declared the issue closed

The Harper government has served notice that thousands of same-sex couples who flocked to Canada from abroad since 2004 to get married are not legally wed.
But speaking in Halifax Thursday, the Prime Minister said the issue was not on the agenda for his majority Conservatives. “We have no intention of further re-opening or opening this issue,” Stephen Harper told reporters when asked about The Globe and Mail’s report.

I guess he's a better person then Trueeau because he's willing to put the interests of the country over his personal beliefs. But of course the Liberals and their supporters continue to bring up the same booga booga hidden agenda garbage in the hopes that it would stick.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/...rticle2299574/

I could say the same thing about the Liberal's I haven't liked them since it became clear that it was a party that didn't believe in Canada as a whole and decided to play parts of Canada against each other.

Trudeau Senior placed Ottawa and Quebec above all other regions. Chretien was the same. Martin was the only real moderate and a guy I could respect until he turned out to be a complete whimp.

I like how you blanket Conservative with Alberta seperating. I don't ever want to see Alberta Seperate,

And yes its no surprise, I thought that Trudeau was over rated as a Prime Minister and as a human being, and after JT got his seat and they started succession planning for him as the next great one and they were publishing articles about his lavish weddings and his wealth it made me barf

[FanIn80]

So many reasons for NDPs and Liberals to hate this guy, it's hard to know where to start.

[Hemi-Cuda]

i don't agree with Harper's personal stance on a lot of things, but i highly respect that he will not try to force his views on anyone and accepts that Canadians have more liberal views on many issues. he's held a majority government for several months now, but i have yet to see any of the "hidden agenda" stuff pop up like the NDP and Liberals railed on about. in fact the only policy of his i staunchly disagree with is his US-style war on drugs stance, but for all the other good he's managed to do as PM i can forgive that

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by Hemi-Cuda

i don't agree with Harper's personal stance on a lot of things, but i highly respect that he will not try to force his views on anyone and accepts that Canadians have more liberal views on many issues. he's held a majority government for several months now, but i have yet to see any of the "hidden agenda" stuff pop up like the NDP and Liberals railed on about. in fact the only policy of his i staunchly disagree with is his US-style war on drugs stance, but for all the other good he's managed to do as PM i can forgive that

Yeah, I have some trouble with the crime bill and I'm a hard on crime person.

I'm interested to see what comes out of the F-35 meetings this month and next as well.

But other then that, I'd rank him fairly high on the Prime Minister scale.

[karl262]

Specifically, what is it about Harper that some of the posters here don't like?

[mikey_the_redneck]

I like to ridicule Quebec as much as any red blooded Albertan, ....but anyone who seriously proposes breaking up Canada is a low grade moron.

Hopefully Trudeau crashes and burns....

To karl262 - I have mostly conservative values, but a few things that have bothered me about Harper are his big money crime bill and the continuation of the Canada/U.S.(NAU) standardization process we are going through.

[Yeah_Baby]

Originally Posted by Rerun

Justin Trudeau is an idiot.. just like his old man. Its obvious the apple doesn't fall far from the tree.

Yeah, Pierre Trudeau was an idiot. That whole combating separatism thing, repatriating the Constitution. God forbid someone have a vision of a strong centralized government to combat the petty regionalism that has divided this country pretty much since Confederation.

[MarchHare]

Originally Posted by karl262

Specifically, what is it about Harper that some of the posters here don't like?

Are you talking about Stephen Harper the individual or The Harper Government (TM) collectively?

If the latter, the crime bill is by far the biggest negative for me. I'm also completely against the cyber-snooping bill and Vic Toews labelling anyone who cares about their online privacy as "standing with child pornographers." Toews also recently argued that it should be acceptable for gun-owning property owners to fire warning shots at trespassers, a position I strongly disagree with (and no, Mr. Toews, that doesn't mean I'm taking the side of criminal home intruders).

Beyond that, I don't like the way The Harper Government has closed debate in parliament so often. Regardless of whether you're personally for or against any of those bills, it's not healthy at all for our democracy to stifle opposition in the House of Commons and prevent debate on these issues.

Finally, there was the whole long-form census fiasco, but enough has already been said about that in other threads. Ditto for the ill-advised GST cut that was criticized by just about every economist in the country.

But kudos where it's due: the CPC have done a relatively decent job with their budgets (GST cut excepted) so far considering the recession. I'll be very interested to see what direction they take now that they have their long-sought majority. At first glance, I also like the idea of pooled pension plans for small businesses and self-employed Canadians, but I want to look into it further. I'm also a huge fan of the TFSA legislation.

[Edit] It was Justice Minister Rob Nicholson, not Vic Toews, who made the comments about warning shots.
http://www.vancouversun.com/news/hea...139/story.html

[karl262]

Some form of union has been discussed or proposed in academic, business and political circles for decades and according to leaked diplomatic cables there has been official discussion of incremental moves towards a single market possibly followed by a monetary union.[1][2][3][4] However, government officials from all three nations say there are no plans to create a North American Union and that no agreement to do so has been signed.[5][6][7] The formation of a North American Union has been the subject of various conspiracy theories.[8][9][10][11]

I think with all the trouble the EU is going through right now its probably off the table for at least the time being. That said, an NAU would be quite simpler that the EU because we wouldn't have the irresponsible children they have over there (Greece, Italy, Spain...)

Our economies are pretty much integrated as it is, but I didn't know that our government was still headed down this road.

[karl262]

Originally Posted by MarchHare

Are you talking about Stephen Harper the individual or The Harper Government (TM) collectively?

If the latter, the crime bill is by far the biggest negative for me. I'm also completely against the cyber-snooping bill and Vic Toews labelling anyone who cares about their online privacy as "standing with child pornographers." Toews also recently argued that it should be acceptable for gun-owning property owners to fire warning shots at trespassers, a position I strongly disagree with (and no, Mr. Toews, that doesn't mean I'm taking the side of criminal home intruders).

Beyond that, I don't like the way The Harper Government has closed debate in parliament so often. Regardless of whether you're personally for or against any of those bills, it's not healthy at all for our democracy to stifle opposition in the House of Commons and prevent debate on these issues.

Finally, there was the whole long-form census fiasco, but enough has already been said about that in other threads. Ditto for the ill-advised GST cut that was criticized by just about every economist in the country.

But kudos where it's due: the CPC have done a relatively decent job with their budgets (GST cut excepted) so far considering the recession. I'll be very interested to see what direction they take now that they have their long-sought majority. At first glance, I also like the idea of pooled pension plans for small businesses and self-employed Canadians, but I want to look into it further. I'm also a huge fan of the TFSA legislation.

[Edit] It was Justice Minister Rob Nicholson, not Vic Toews, who made the comments about warning shots.
http://www.vancouversun.com/news/hea...139/story.html

I guess every party is going to have its crack pots. Toews is for sure that guy for the Conservatives.

[karl262]

As for the time allocation for debate thing, I actually don't think its that bad for a majority government to evoke for reasons of efficiency. Any MP's who disagree with a bill will have more success debating in the public forum that is the media anyways.

[CaptainCrunch]

Every government in a majority situation cuts off debate on the bill. Even in a minority government the governing party cuts things off like opposition day etc.

[MarchHare]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

Every government in a majority situation cuts off debate on the bill. Even in a minority government the governing party cuts things off like opposition day etc.

Yes, it's not specific to just this government, but the link I posted noted that the CPC has invoked debate closure at a rate far higher than the Martin, Chretien, or Mulroney majorities. Even on measures I support (like the pooled pension bill), I still strongly disagree with this practice. Having a majority doesn't mean you can govern like a dictator and stifle all debate in parliament; we have opposition parties for a reason.

Harper himself even complained about this very issue when the Liberals were in power, yet now his own government is poised to be the worst offender in Canadian history at closing debate in the House of Commons.

[Mike F]

I'm no Trudeau fan boy, and the Harper Government hasn't been horrible, but this is all much ado about nothing based on my reading of the quote.

Trudeau seems to be saying (I'm guessing in response to a question along the lines of "Would you ever support Quebec separating?") that if, at some point, Canada became the country Stephen Harper would personally like to see, with no gay marriage and no abortion, he might support separation as that Canada would no longer represent his values.

I don't have a problem with that.

He's not saying Harper is going to do those things, but that they are the kind of things that might tip the scales toward separation.

[CaptainCrunch]

Well he is a Sith Lord soooo

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by Mike F

I'm no Trudeau fan boy, and the Harper Government hasn't been horrible, but this is all much ado about nothing based on my reading of the quote.

Trudeau seems to be saying (I'm guessing in response to a question along the lines of "Would you ever support Quebec separating?") that if, at some point, Canada became the country Stephen Harper would personally like to see, with no gay marriage and no abortion, he might support separation as that Canada would no longer represent his values.

I don't have a problem with that.

He's not saying Harper is going to do those things, but that they are the kind of things that might tip the scales toward separation.

I agree with pretty much all that. I have no major complaints about the Harper government and I actually don't really like Trudeau, or at least the idea that he is the Liberal leader in waiting because of some kind of birth right. In fact, I despise it.

What he said isn't really a big deal though.

[Cowperson]

Originally Posted by Mike F

I'm no Trudeau fan boy, and the Harper Government hasn't been horrible, but this is all much ado about nothing based on my reading of the quote.

Trudeau seems to be saying (I'm guessing in response to a question along the lines of "Would you ever support Quebec separating?") that if, at some point, Canada became the country Stephen Harper would personally like to see, with no gay marriage and no abortion, he might support separation as that Canada would no longer represent his values.

I don't have a problem with that.

He's not saying Harper is going to do those things, but that they are the kind of things that might tip the scales toward separation.

So, in 2004, when GW Bush II was re-elected, lots of Americans said they were going to "separate" from America and move to Canada as America no longer represented their values.

In Canada, instead of moving out of the country, Trudeau is going to take the country with him when he goes.

Do I have that option in Alberta if something is bugging me?

Seems pretty immature and short-sighted. Governments come and governments go.

The Sovereignty Movement seemed to die pretty hard with 9/11 and the scary world it revealed. I'd seriously wonder if that dog still hunts anymore.

In any event, even mentioning a mostly dead topic and breathing some new life into it doesn't say good things about Trudeau's judgement.

Cowperson