How much do Canadians make?

[Northendzone]

it would be interesting to see a cut of the data by city or area code - just to get a handle on the geographic disparities.

[blankall]

I see a lot of tax returns. There are a loooooooot of people who earn more than 50k, yet report far less. Interesting what your can deduct as a "business expense" or how much work gets done under the table.

Anytime I see a small business owner, real estate agent, tradesman, etc.. who actually files anything close to an honest return, I am floored.

The top earners probably pull similar shaddy schenanigans, but a sustantial portion of the people making less than 50k are making more than 50k.

It's really the lifetime salary earners who get screwed, AKA the middle class.

[blankall]

Originally Posted by Northendzone

it would be interesting to see a cut of the data by city or area code - just to get a handle on the geographic disparities.

I'd be interested too. I've been to small towns where you can drink at a bar for $2.00/drink and buy a huge house/property for 100-150k. You can live like a king there for 50k a year. In Vancouver and Calgary...not so much.

[albertGQ]

Bartenders, servers, and even kitchen staff don't claim all their tips if they even claim them to begin with.

I've talked to girls that have made $200-$400 a night in tips at night clubs. I'm sure they don't claim that income

[calumniate]

Originally Posted by albertGQ

Bartenders, servers, and even kitchen staff don't claim all their tips if they even claim them to begin with.

I've talked to girls that have made $200-$400 a night in tips at night clubs. I'm sure they don't claim that income

Yeah they sometimes put down like 15% on top of their 'salary', so it doesn't really come close.

[squiggs96]

Originally Posted by calumniate

Yeah they sometimes put down like 15% on top of their 'salary', so it doesn't really come close.

I tried explaining it to other servers when I was in the industry while attending university. Most thought my math was wrong, but I never received an audit. They thought 10% of their earnings was fine, because that's about what tips were per bill.

If they worked an 8 hour shift, making $6 per hour, that's about $50 in wage for the night. There is no way they would be making only $5 per night ($50 wage * 10%) in tips. When they did their tax returns, they though it was acceptable to put only $1,000 in tips earned from making $10,000 in wages. There is no way a server could survive on $11,000 a year in earnings if they don't live at home. Many of them were audited and many of them had to pay fines and back taxes. I have never seen anyone who has claimed at least 50% of their wages in tips get audited.

As a male, working in chain restaurants throughout the city, I would consistently make about 4-5 times my wages in tips over the course of a year. Any half decent looking female at a night club would have made much more than I would. It sucked when I went to article at a CA firm and made much less money, working much longer hours, with work that was much harder.

[albertGQ]

I’m actually surprised that they got audited.
I’ve also worked in the industry for years and do not know one person that was audited.

[wookster]

Originally Posted by blankall

I see a lot of tax returns. There are a loooooooot of people who earn more than 50k, yet report far less. Interesting what your can deduct as a "business expense" or how much work gets done under the table.

Anytime I see a small business owner, real estate agent, tradesman, etc.. who actually files anything close to an honest return, I am floored.

The top earners probably pull similar shaddy schenanigans, but a sustantial portion of the people making less than 50k are making more than 50k.

It's really the lifetime salary earners who get screwed, AKA the middle class.

You know, I just started consulting this year and come April will be my first tax return with myself being the boss. I have an accountant and he gave me a list of possible deductibles and told me to keep all receipts and such but that list of deductibles is really mindblowing. I am very interested to see what my income tax is going to be this year compared to the previous. I am doing the same work, only now as a Consultant instead of an employee of a company.

Im no expert yet as to how these taxes will go but I can really see how these tax numbers can be misleading...

[The Yen Man]

A lot of businesses make sales "under the table". They file a lot less than what they take in. If you ever go to a restaurant where they don't actually ring in your bill in the register, you'll know why.

Add to that all the trades and and service guys who will give you a discount if you "pay by cash", and you'll know those don't get reported in tax returns either.

So these issues along with all the ones already mentioned in this thread (students and non workers who file tax returns), and I'd have to conclude that this so called study is flawed at best IMO.

[Temporary_User]

I think most people are missing the point of the article. Everyone is trying to justify it by stating it is students, handicap, or people who don't claim their full amount.
Students, handicap, okay...

Don't claim their full amount. The system needs to be reformed.

That is the point of the article. The system needs to be reformed. Under 50k and most people are scrapping by, paycheque to paycheque with very left over.

[ken0042]

How many of those under $50K people are the spouse of somebody making more than $50K? I know in my fiancee makes 1/2 of what I do, but she also has fewer bills than a single person would. With a lot of my friends there are similar situations, one spouse makes a lot more than the other. (And often it is the woman who makes more.)

You can use statistics to prove anything- 43% of all people know that.

[Clarkey]

What income makes you part of the 1%?? I know there are about 3-30 billion people in China and India. Seriously though does that make the vast majority of Calgarians 1%'ers?

[The Yen Man]

Originally Posted by fotze

I call those restaurants "chinese food restaurants".

Now now, its Chinese plus all the pho places.

[bubbsy]

the ridiculous thing about this is how it compares to housing prices.

it seems like the middle class is being pushed into condos (at least here in TO).

[Slava]

Originally Posted by Clarkey

What income makes you part of the 1%?? I know there are about 3-30 billion people in China and India. Seriously though does that make the vast majority of Calgarians 1%'ers?

I think so, but am not sure. Most of the occupy wherever protests are part of the 1% as well, but that definition would be a little inconvenient for them.

[bizaro86]

Originally Posted by Slava

I think so, but am not sure. Most of the occupy wherever protests are part of the 1% as well, but that definition would be a little inconvenient for them.

This source: http://www.globalrichlist.com/how.html indicates that the top 1% of global income starts at an individual income of $47,500. It looks like that data is getting to be a few years old though, and there are lots of newly well off people in various parts of Asia. I would guess the top 1% might be up to around 50-60k now, (using this methodology).

People on this site overuse the #firstworldproblems hashtag, but Canadians are way better off than the vast, vast majority of people elsewhere.

[Cowboy89]

Originally Posted by bubbsy

the ridiculous thing about this is how it compares to housing prices.

it seems like the middle class is being pushed into condos (at least here in TO).

That's really the middle classes own fault for insisting on buying houses at multiples higher than their incomes with high ratio mortgages. They have priced themselves out by getting into bidding wars with borrowed money. Credit has been used to serve as the illusion of wealth.

The globe did an article not too long ago about how much people who live in million dollar homes really have in their houses. They selected a neighborhood of houses valued at between 1-2 million checked the land titles office and it turned out most people there had bought within the last 5 years and had on average less than 25% equity.

[justkidding]

Just like all studies, you cannot always get the real information.

For example, if you look at my land titles document it shows a mortgage of $480000.00 registered against my house. In fact, it's just a line of credit with a ZERO balance owing.

Also, when I hear that the average Canadian is in debt for however much, I wonder if these kind of lines of credit are counted.

[Cowboy89]

Originally Posted by justkidding

Just like all studies, you cannot always get the real information.

For example, if you look at my land titles document it shows a mortgage of $480000.00 registered against my house. In fact, it's just a line of credit with a ZERO balance owing.

Also, when I hear that the average Canadian is in debt for however much, I wonder if these kind of lines of credit are counted.

Just drawn credit is counted in the stats. Household debt is a huge problem in Canada.

[blankall]

Originally Posted by Temporary_User

I think most people are missing the point of the article. Everyone is trying to justify it by stating it is students, handicap, or people who don't claim their full amount.
Students, handicap, okay...

Don't claim their full amount. The system needs to be reformed.

That is the point of the article. The system needs to be reformed. Under 50k and most people are scrapping by, paycheque to paycheque with very left over.

I don't think people are denying there is a problem. However, that doesn't mean people like to be lied to via manipulated data designed to create shocking statistics.