Fake Transcripts?

[Starfishy]

My transcripts have always been mailed by the institution. I have never even seen the actual transcript. I could pay for a copy of my transcript, but official transcripts are sent by the institution.

[DownhillGoat]

Originally Posted by wooohooo

So what keeps students from creating fake transcripts and entering a prestigious profession like Law or Medicine?

Jeff Winger says hi.

[bc-chris]

i knew it was fake.....

[Wormius]

Originally Posted by Lchoy

I always wondered though. With those envelopes, how can the recipiant know that it wasn't previously opened? I know there is some sort of security measure, but wouldn't the evidence of prior opening be hidden by the envelope being opened officially?

I can see the possibility of faking transcripts or degrees for employment purposes, but when I applied to grad schools they wanted me to have my university send the transcripts to them. There was never an opportunity to alter them.

[Wormius]

Originally Posted by GreatWhiteEbola

I know a few people who don't make the distinction between a degree and a diploma, especially in engineering. When they find out there is a ring bearing engineer among them, they change their tune.

I blame Microsoft for suffixing all of their positions, regardless of the educational requirements, with "Engineer". At least they used to when I graduated.

[wooohooo]

Originally Posted by Wormius

I can see the possibility of faking transcripts or degrees for employment purposes, but when I applied to grad schools they wanted me to have my university send the transcripts to them. There was never an opportunity to alter them.

Well couldn't you just send them out yourselves? It usually all goes to the University mailing room themselves to then be sorted out.

[Ben_in_Canada]

Kind of releated.
I know it's wikipedia, but I remember this was a big deal a couple of years ago.
http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jayant_Patel

This 'Dr' was linked to 87 deaths betwen 2003 & 2005!!

[LChoy]

Slightly related:

From the 1980s to 2000s, Smith was a leading Canadian expert in pediatric forensics. He acted as a star witness for the Crown at hundreds of cases involving suspicious child deaths despite any formal accreditation in forensic pathology or formal training.

http://news.nationalpost.com/2011/06...hologist-case/

Although life experience is important in a vocation, there is a reason why formal education and certifications are needed. I'm not saying Dr. Smith forged his degree, but here is an example of the bad that can happen when people are part of a job that they are not formally qualified for

[wooohooo]

Well obviously the people that forge their degrees like MDs or anything else and don't receive the formal training... but how about in the case of forging a transcript to gain entrance into med school or some other graduate study class. I know it's ridiculously difficult to get into med school and that doesn't mean they wouldn't make a good doctor or lawyer or businessman.

[shermanator]

What? You went to Hollywood Upstairs Medical College too?

[Northendzone]

i don't know about you guys - but when i go for some "back door bleaching" i want to know that i am in the hands of a true professional who was legitimately trained by other legitimately trained professionals and experts.

i also beleive that all sports insiders and experts should be subject to a stringent certification process.

[valo403]

Originally Posted by wooohooo

Well couldn't you just send them out yourselves? It usually all goes to the University mailing room themselves to then be sorted out.

Sure you could send them out yourself, assuming you could get access to them, print them on the watermarked paper (after editing them), then get access to the seals that are used to prevent exactly this type of tampering, and then get them back into the proper channels so that they still appear to be coming from the official source. It's not impossible, but it's not as easy as swinging by staples and picking up a pack of heavy weight paper and some envelopes.

[Wormius]

Originally Posted by wooohooo

Well couldn't you just send them out yourselves? It usually all goes to the University mailing room themselves to then be sorted out.

I can't speak for any other school, but when appled to the U of A, they requested that I have the transcripts sent from my alma mater to them. I guess its possible to have them sent to me, modify the transcripts and the envelope and then send them out again.

But you are risking a few things here - 1) the transcripts et al that you request for yourself will be the same as those that they are sending to a university for admission purposes (e.g. white envelopes for students, and green envelopes for another university). 2) There is no communications between the schools to verify any grades, or who were the transcripts sent to.

They probably even use electronic delivery now or online access. I know I can check my grades online, and I graduated nearly 10 years ago.

[Wormius]

Originally Posted by wooohooo

Well obviously the people that forge their degrees like MDs or anything else and don't receive the formal training... but how about in the case of forging a transcript to gain entrance into med school or some other graduate study class. I know it's ridiculously difficult to get into med school and that doesn't mean they wouldn't make a good doctor or lawyer or businessman.

I don't think med school would be that easy to forge. There are tons of interviews and phone calls. You'd have to orchestrate some pretty big charade to get that to work. I would be less worried about people who faked their way into medical school than those who just plain out fake their medical degree.

[bizaro86]

Originally Posted by Wormius

I don't think med school would be that easy to forge. There are tons of interviews and phone calls. You'd have to orchestrate some pretty big charade to get that to work. I would be less worried about people who faked their way into medical school than those who just plain out fake their medical degree.

If you're smart enough to cheat your way into med school, it seems likely to me that you've got a legit chance of being smart enough to be a Doctor. Of course, the ethics of someone like that might come into question, but it's not like they'd be making life or death decisions...

[DrJ]

Originally Posted by Wormius

I don't think med school would be that easy to forge. There are tons of interviews and phone calls. You'd have to orchestrate some pretty big charade to get that to work. I would be less worried about people who faked their way into medical school than those who just plain out fake their medical degree.

Why forge when you can go to the Caribbean

[Wormius]

Originally Posted by bizaro86

If you're smart enough to cheat your way into med school, it seems likely to me that you've got a legit chance of being smart enough to be a Doctor. Of course, the ethics of someone like that might come into question, but it's not like they'd be making life or death decisions...

You'd be living with a very dark cloud lingering over your head hoping the sham was never discovered.

[JD]

Originally Posted by Wormius

I blame Microsoft for suffixing all of their positions, regardless of the educational requirements, with "Engineer". At least they used to when I graduated.

Well in my limited experience overseas, I'm finding they're pretty liberal with the use of the word "engineer". I think it's something we take seriously in Alberta and probably Canada that isn't done the same elsewhere.

Guys that have HS diplomas who work their way up are called engineers. The word refers more to what the person's function is rather than what their qualifications are.

As for the "ring-bearing engineer" thing, I know lots of technologists that I would hire over some 4-year degree "ring-bearing" guys. Trouble is, it's tough to convey that in a resume. You don't know until you work with them.

[shane_c]

I work at a university and we get people trying to pass all kinds of stuff off as originals (transcripts, reference letters, language scores, etc.). Some of it looks so fake that it's laughable. We insist on original, sealed documents sent to us directly from the issuing institution. For reference letters they must come directly from the referee in a sealed envelope. If it comes to us by email it is considered unofficial if it comes from a gmail, hotmail, etc account. If it's emailed it needs to be from the professor or referee's professional work email and followed up with an original in a sealed document. This last application cycle there seemed to be a huge increase in questionable documents over previous years.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by JD

As for the "ring-bearing engineer" thing, I know lots of technologists that I would hire over some 4-year degree "ring-bearing" guys. Trouble is, it's tough to convey that in a resume. You don't know until you work with them.

Same here, in the industry that I am in. The problem is that without a degree, you can't get a professional designation and without that, we can't have the person sign off or stamp a report. If they forged it somehow and it was found out, it could really hurt the reputation of the company. In all honesty though, I know many techs whose actual field skills are better than people with degrees (even if their core understanding of the science is limited).