Freeway's Pre-Draft Flames Prospect Scouting Report Thread

[Pierre "Monster" McGuire]

Originally Posted by Bar-Down

I really really hope we can get Mark McNeil at pick #13

Big centerman, Alberta kid, exactly what we need. Getzlaf type of player (kind of balding already too )

I would be so jacked if we got him.

I know! Me too. Contrary to some people on this forum, I would much rather have McNeil than some small European who is a liability on defense (i.e., Bartschi, Zibanejad, Khokhlachev, etc.)

Plus, McNeil can score just as well (maybe not as flashy) as any of the Europeans.

[flamesrule14]

Here's a good article about McNeil that I read a week or so ago.

http://thepipelineshow.blogspot.com/...neil.html#more

I wouldn't be dissapointed in McNeil if that is who the flames ended up with, but after reading that I wouldn't mind if the flames went with one the flashy forwards.

[Pierre "Monster" McGuire]

Originally Posted by flamesrule14

Here's a good article about McNeil that I read a week or so ago.

http://thepipelineshow.blogspot.com/...neil.html#more

I wouldn't be dissapointed in McNeil if that is who the flames ended up with, but after reading that I wouldn't mind if the flames went with one the flashy forwards.

Interesting blog post. The major criticism of McNeil, then, is inconstancy. IMO, I can see a good hardnosed coach being able to straighten that part of his game out.

If that's the worst part of his game, I'm fine with that. It can be changed.

[Freeway]

I think McNeill or Zack Phillips would be a good fit. Based entirely on the Flames ONLY having WHL prospects right now, there may be a tendency to skew picks towards WHL guys, since they will have been scouted in-directly when the Flames were watching Reinhart or Howse or the Heat.

That said, they may skew AWAY from the WHL as a means of diversifying the prospect base. Could go either way.

[flamesaresmokin]

Originally Posted by Da_Chief

imo you should draft a goalie every other year with one of you the late picks.

I don't know about every year but you should definitely never draft a goalie in the first round imo. I like the irving pick as he will likely be an nhler at some point (maybe even a starter for us if he keeps progressing). But history has shown there is more success taking skaters in the first round. Its way more likely to pluck a starter out of the later rounds then it is to pick a top skater.

[flamesaresmokin]

Personally i'd like the flames to target Mark Schiefle out of Barrie or Mark McNeill out of prince albert. Big guys who had strong years as 18 year olds on below average teams. Both have a offensive skill (schiefle is likely more gifted) but are strong defensively according to many reports. The fact that they aren't putting up numbers due to playing on stacked rosters makes me really like them both. I can see both being available when we pick.

[The Original FFIV]

Originally Posted by Freeway

I think McNeill or Zack Phillips would be a good fit. Based entirely on the Flames ONLY having WHL prospects right now, there may be a tendency to skew picks towards WHL guys, since they will have been scouted in-directly when the Flames were watching Reinhart or Howse or the Heat.

That said, they may skew AWAY from the WHL as a means of diversifying the prospect base. Could go either way.

I hope they pick the best prospect when their time comes to pick, regardless of what league they play in. It appears without doubt that there was too much bias towards the WHL with the last regime. Let's hope that changes under Uncle Feaster.

There is something about Matt Puempel from the limited readings I have done that stands out. He looks like he could emerge as a 1st line LW, and I would prefer a 1st line LW over a 2nd line C. Tom Webster is an astute hockey guy and if he believes that this is the best player available at the time of selection, I hope that he pulls on the Flaming C.

[The Original FFIV]

Originally Posted by flamesaresmokin

Personally i'd like the flames to target Mark Schiefle out of Barrie or Mark McNeill out of prince albert. Big guys who had strong years as 18 year olds on below average teams. Both have a offensive skill (schiefle is likely more gifted) but are strong defensively according to many reports. The fact that they aren't putting up numbers due to playing on stacked rosters makes me really like them both. I can see both being available when we pick.

Flip side to your point is perhaps they put up the numbers they did as a result of increased ice time due to being on a bad team. How would they have fit in on a mid-upper range team? Did they get the points they did more from default or do they have the high level talent the numbers indicate?

Not saying you're wrong but just a counter point to think about.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by Pierre "Monster" McGuire

Interesting blog post. The major criticism of McNeil, then, is inconstancy. IMO, I can see a good hardnosed coach being able to straighten that part of his game out.

If that's the worst part of his game, I'm fine with that. It can be changed.

People seem to like to compare him to Getzlaf (as in the blog posted), but when I read the breakdown for him, I can't help but think of Kyle Chipchura.

The positive seems to be that he is good at most things, but does nothing extremely well. He lacks competetiveness and isn't a great skater.

That blog just didn't sell it to me.

[Freeway]

Originally Posted by The Original FFIV

Flip side to your point is perhaps they put up the numbers they did as a result of increased ice time due to being on a bad team. How would they have fit in on a mid-upper range team? Did they get the points they did more from default or do they have the high level talent the numbers indicate?

Not saying you're wrong but just a counter point to think about.

Spencer Bennett's numbers in Vancouver took a big jump over his numbers from Portland simply because he got better ice-time with better linemates. Similar things should happen on these stacked teams when their older kids move on.

[Jing]

Originally Posted by Pierre "Monster" McGuire

I know! Me too. Contrary to some people on this forum, I would much rather have McNeil than some small European who is a liability on defense (i.e., Bartschi, Zibanejad, Khokhlachev, etc.)

Plus, McNeil can score just as well (maybe not as flashy) as any of the Europeans.

Zibenajad is neither small or a liability defensively. I am not sold on McNeill, I would rather have someone with much more skill (Armia/Scheifele/Zibenejad/Bartschi), I think McNeill projects more as a 2nd line center as opposed to a Getzlaf type #1.

[8sPOT]

Originally Posted by The Original FFIV

I hope they pick the best prospect when their time comes to pick, regardless of what league they play in. It appears without doubt that there was too much bias towards the WHL with the last regime. Let's hope that changes under Uncle Feaster.

There is something about Matt Puempel from the limited readings I have done that stands out. He looks like he could emerge as a 1st line LW, and I would prefer a 1st line LW over a 2nd line C. Tom Webster is an astute hockey guy and if he believes that this is the best player available at the time of selection, I hope that he pulls on the Flaming C.

I get the same impression regarding Puempel. Has size and goal scoring ability. For some reason I am not so high on McNeil, just don't see him as a top 2 centre in the NHL.

[The Original FFIV]

Originally Posted by 8sPOT

I get the same impression regarding Puempel. Has size and goal scoring ability. For some reason I am not so high on McNeil, just don't see him as a top 2 centre in the NHL.

I think Flames faithful are gunshy when a player is deemed a 'power forward' - see Chucko/Sunblad.

Let's hope the new regime takes a more progressive view in the draft and goes after high level talent, provided it exists at the time of our selection. No more safe, two-way players with our 1st picks.

My humble recommendation - if one of Strome, Bartschi, Armia, Puempel or Hamilton (that's right, a D-man but elite level D-man) is not available at pick 13, try to trade down and get a 2nd round pick in return, with the hope that we can get 2 potential top players as a result.

We saw what happened last year with Fowler/Gormley, you just never know who may be available when it is time to make your selection.

[kirant]

Originally Posted by flamesrule14

Here's a good article about McNeil that I read a week or so ago.

http://thepipelineshow.blogspot.com/...neil.html#more

I wouldn't be dissapointed in McNeil if that is who the flames ended up with, but after reading that I wouldn't mind if the flames went with one the flashy forwards.

Reading that, I'd be happy with an Umberger. That could easily be his best comparable if nothing about him changes, but I see lots of Getzlaf in him as well.

I haven't seen the pure lack of competitiveness mentioned in the article about McNeil. He always struck me as a tough player who just needs his flame lit to become excellent. In this way, he reminds me if a mini-Iginla: As soon as he got in fights and got physical, he got much better. I think if McNeil learns to constantly be "on", he could become a Getzlaf-esc 1st line center.

[Freeway]

What have you guys heard about Joel Armia?
Seems like a skill guy that could be of some use, but I'm not sure how great the Finnish league is at producing NHLers lately.

[Cheerio]

Put me in the anti-McNeil camp, doesn't seem like the kind of player we really want/need right now. At our pick I'd like Zibanejad, Armia, or Schiefele

[Caged Great]

I think it's almost a certainty that the Flames will move from 13 down to 16 or 17 in order to try and get another pick in the top 3 rounds. Might move down again to 22 or so as well if they really want to. There's a group of players in the 10-25 range that are similar players, so they'd still get one, but would be able to get more than one player in the top 100.

[8sPOT]

Originally Posted by Caged Great

I think it's almost a certainty that the Flames will move from 13 down to 16 or 17 in order to try and get another pick in the top 3 rounds. Might move down again to 22 or so as well if they really want to. There's a group of players in the 10-25 range that are similar players, so they'd still get one, but would be able to get more than one player in the top 100.

And I think this is a great strategy, that second pick is an important asset IMO.

[Jing]

I am not sure about trading down. Chances are a player or two will drop out of the top 10. I would rather have one top line player than 2 2nd line players in our current situation.

[JiriHrdina]

Originally Posted by Jing

I am not sure about trading down. Chances are a player or two will drop out of the top 10. I would rather have one top line player than 2 2nd line players in our current situation.

After the first 8 or so players I think this draft becomes a crap shoot without much difference between the guy you get at 13 and the guy you get at somewhere around 18. Someone could drop yes - but I doubt it would be one of the upper echelon forwards that the Flames likely covet. So if there is a team willing to give you a 2nd rounder to move up 5 spots - I jump at it.