CPHL Free Agents

[notoepik]

Originally posted by JiriHrdina+Apr 25 2005, 03:51 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (JiriHrdina @ Apr 25 2005, 03:51 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-notoepik@Apr 25 2005, 03:20 PM

I have chosen carefully, who I have my eye on have you :P

It's Andre Roy you have your eye on isn't it? Damn you. Stay away from Andre Roy!!! He's mine! [/b][/quote]
darn it! How did you figure it out!

[the_only_turek_fan]

Originally posted by KevanGuy@Apr 25 2005, 03:04 PM
Great point Syl. We cant have teams jacking up salaries if they arent even going to get the player. Plus it will make the teams that will offer sheets to RFAs (and potentially drive salaries up) choose a little more carefully who they go after.

THATS COLLUSION!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[KevanGuy]

Originally posted by the_only_turek_fan+Apr 25 2005, 04:41 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (the_only_turek_fan @ Apr 25 2005, 04:41 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-KevanGuy@Apr 25 2005, 03:04 PM
Great point Syl. We cant have teams jacking up salaries if they arent even going to get the player. Plus it will make the teams that will offer sheets to RFAs (and potentially drive salaries up) choose a little more carefully who they go after.

THATS COLLUSION!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[/b][/quote]
No it isnt.

[Sylvanfan]

Originally posted by the_only_turek_fan+Apr 25 2005, 10:41 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (the_only_turek_fan @ Apr 25 2005, 10:41 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-KevanGuy@Apr 25 2005, 03:04 PM
Great point Syl. We cant have teams jacking up salaries if they arent even going to get the player. Plus it will make the teams that will offer sheets to RFAs (and potentially drive salaries up) choose a little more carefully who they go after.

THATS COLLUSION!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[/b][/quote]
It's exactly how it's done in the NHL, and as per our rules after you sign one, than you have to go get all the picks you just lost back (which might not be all that easy considering you just "stole" that GM's player). So why should team A be negotiating with 5 agents when they can only sign one player. Basically I'd like to see the team and agent come to an agreement, submit a formal offer sheet, and than the team that has the players rights has a specified amount of time to match, organize a trade, or accept the compensation as per league rules. I've always maintained that teams should also have to pay a $250k fee to the other team to make an offer too. That way it ensures that teams are making a serious offer, and aren't just randomly driving up salary's by making offers.

[notoepik]

No one can drive up your players salary if you offer him something fair. BUT it is a buyers market, since there is no one to bid on in UFA.

[KevanGuy]

Originally posted by notoepik@Apr 25 2005, 06:59 PM
No one can drive up your players salary if you offer him something fair. BUT it is a buyers market, since there is no one to bid on in UFA.

Sure someone can. The term 'fair' that you are using is defined by the agent. If you think 3 MILL is fair for your RFA and the agent thinks 4 MILL is fair, then I guess 4 MILL is fair right? So along comes some other GM and puts in an offer sheet for 4+ MILL. Now the players salary has been driven up. And so have the other players who are similar to this hypothetical player.

[notoepik]

But shouldn't the market set the price? If your player is only worth 3 million to you, and he is worth 6 million to me, shouldn't that be the fair market price. Brett Hull is right, I am buying a side of beef.

Mad cow and all B-)

[KevanGuy]

Well, it isnt a free market. We have a salary cap.

[notoepik]

Originally posted by KevanGuy@Apr 25 2005, 08:07 PM
Well, it isnt a free market. We have a salary cap.

Minor detail, When I run out of money, I will stop bidding on your player.

Sound fair?

[Sylvanfan]

Fine but you only have the means to bid on one player in the entire league. What I'm saying is you shouldn't be telling 4 different agents that you want to sign 2 of their RFA clients each for 10 million a contract, when you can only make that offer to ONE player in the entire league. If that guy is on my team, than fine I'll deal with it. But we have restricted rights to our players who are under the age of 28, and by no means am I going to let some other loose cannon GM claim I should pay a guy 6 million a year because they would when I say that player is worth 2.5. The players leverage in these scenarios is withholding their playing services from my team. My leverage is with holding their pay cheque, until I reach an agreement that I'm comfortable with.

[notoepik]

Well for one thing, I have not talked to 4 agents. I have not asked about 4 players. I HAVE offered to trade for players. I have made some good offers. Failing getting a player in trade, I may well make an offer to an agent for a RFA. I have emailed an agent and mentioned that a certain player would look great in the Hawks uniform. Yep.

Yes I will go high, if I think the player is worth that. What it boils down to, is the worth of the player to you, and to me. Is he worth that salary and losing my picks? I won't make an offer unless he is worth that to me. And I sure won't make an offer and back off. And of course you can't make an offer to 2 players and then not take one of them. There are 2 I want, but I have not made an offer to either of them! I have offered the GM of both them players in exchange though. And I will make an RFA offer to one of them if trading fails.

BTW, I have a few RFA too. I may face the same questions you do. I am not just looking at this situation one way.

[Hanna Sniper]

Correct me if I'm wrong but i think some may be reading the rules wrong.

If a GM does NOT offer an RFA a contract and an opposing GM decides to offer there will be a very high price to pay should you choose this route

Much like in the NHL if the players current GM makes an offer to "X" player before the the deciding date then that player is protected from offeres being made from other GM's. If not this could be a very slippery slope with possiable collusion and back stabing. A scary subject indeed for the league.

Once again the agents have 100% the power with no drags to keep them the honest bunch they are.

[Hanna Sniper]

Even worse I would hate to see an agent go along and hold out negotiations till after July 1st in hopes of getting a better deal else where and if not then go back. Although we strive to be as realistic as possible I would hate to see such scenario made out for the fun of it from an agents perspective. The is a league that demands it’s GM’s to put their heart and soul into the team and then have it left to a Agents that really doesn’t care at all about such team and can toy with it like a cat and mouse game and then just walk away from it without consequences and leaving the GM’s to repair his damage.

The Agents put in a lot of work, and wonderful job but what would he really care about “X” team. I know if someone came along and started toying with Dylan Hunter and removing him from my team for the fun of it I would be flipping mad… really flipping. Sure I have an attachment to Hunter and doubtful anyone here knows, but whom else do GM’s have on their team I would hate to see an Agent mess with unknowingly.

Hopefully it doesn’t get ugly but I looks like where headed that way since we really don’t know what to expect with as this in unfamiliar ground at a few lab mice GM’s expenses….. worse case scenario I agree

Note: I used Hunter in reference here because he isn’t a RFA but if he was and someone stole him away from me… commence flipping trigger in 5.. 4.. 3..

[notoepik]

Don't agents hold out players all the time in the NHL? I would imagine the agents have a price range in mind already for their prize players, and some not so prize players too.


I think you all working yourselves into a lather for nothing. If you have a top player and you are not willing to pay him the money he is worth, he will not be playing for you anyway, as the agent would hold him out to get that money wouldn't he?

I doubt that a price is driven up artificially here. The player will be worth the price to someone. But will it be you? THAT is the only question. Many an RFA have changed hands in the NHL because they could not come to terms with the team that held their rights. You have the right to not sign and not let them play anywhere. If it feels right, do it.

[Sylvanfan]

Yeah, the whole idea of Qualifying offers needs to be addressed too. The way it used to be, you had the choice not to offer a contract to the player. But if you offered a one year deal at 500k than you kept the players restricted rights. I do think that teams should have to be willing to offer the player like 70% of his previous salary or forego the right to compensation and let the player become an unrestricted free agent. But I would like to see us implement measures so that the league does have a record of which RFA's have been qualified, and which guys teams have made formal offers to. The NHL has this largely because of agents. We too need this because we have agents too.

[Hanna Sniper]

Originally posted by notoepik@Apr 26 2005, 12:01 AM
If you have a top player and you are not willing to pay him the money he is worth, he will not be playing for you anyway, as the agent would hold him out to get that money wouldn't he?

If that was so the agent could hold out every player for 10 Million afterall there's no harm to his firm for doing so..... there would be buyers for such players if he holds his breath long enough because there's no rules to prevent it.

Whatever route we travel I only hope that there's long enough time gaps for everyone to adjust their teams. Holdout's/signing of RFA are interesting folds to the game I'm just worried someone will get triped up over it thats all.