Federal Election Called for Oct 19, 2015

[Kavvy]

Originally Posted by sworkhard

Not really. 70% of the nation could be fascist neo-nazi's, but it would make them any less far right just because the position had a majority.

There are very few communists or strong socialists in this country, and that is what the left is made of. I don't mean the neo socialism we mean by socialism today which is about redistributing wealth gained via capitalism to keep people from starving and reduce how many are on the streets to the benefit of all, as that's a very centrist position, but rather the older idea of socialism that's only a few steps away from communism.

Except that the mainstream parties hold that 70%, not the commies or neo-nazi's.

[Morozee]

Originally Posted by Kavvy

before posting online about mandatory prison sentences for an illegal drug, we should research? I didn't realize CalgaryPuck was now a medical journal.

It's a forum, post away.

You are absolutely right. I take it back. Got a little emotional there.

[sworkhard]

Originally Posted by Kavvy

Except that the mainstream parties hold that 70%, not the commies or neo-nazi's.

Sure, but my point is that the support of a position doesn't move where the position is on the scale of all possible positions.

Your correct in relative terms (ie, if you were to apply a bell curve to where people stand, and call the middle of the curve centrist), but in absolute terms the country is as a whole still centrist/center-right, that is to say, democratic-socialist with wealth generation via capitalism.

[stampsx2]

Originally Posted by Drak

Left wing? Seems more moderate overall and perhaps right of centre than left wing.

Really? No seriously, look at the threads over the last two years: pro cycling, pro taxes, pro weed, anti guns, anti corporation and so many more.

Now let's look at the right wing threads: the hunting thread

I'm not saying there's anything wrong with left or right wing but imo cp has much more left wing threads and support.

[FlameOn]

So right on the heels of the fake page one advertisements from Postmedia on behalf of the CPC, the Sun is now posting completely fake interviews smack in the middle of the "news" section

[Dion]

The downside of a legal high. Hopefully the Liberal govt is paying attention

Many of Colorado’s starkest problems with legal marijuana stem from pot-infused cookies, chocolates and other surprisingly potent edible treats that are especially popular with tourists and casual marijuana users.

On Colorado’s northern plains, for example, a fourth grader showed up on the playground one day in April and sold some of his grandmother’s marijuana to three classmates. The next day, one of those students returned the favor by bringing in a marijuana edible he had swiped from his own grandmother.

“This was kind of an unintended consequence of Colorado’s new law,” said John Gates, the district’s director of school safety and security. “For crying out loud, secure your weed. If you can legally possess it, that’s fine. But it has no place in an elementary school.”

So far this year, nine children have ended up at Children’s Hospital Colorado in Aurora after consuming marijuana, six of whom got critically sick. In all of 2013, the hospital treated only eight such cases.

In March, the state logged what appeared to be its first death directly tied to legal recreational marijuana when a 19-year-old African exchange student, Levy Thamba Pongi, plunged to his death in Denver. He and three other students had driven from their college in Wyoming to sample Colorado’s newly legal wares. Mr. Pongi ate marijuana-infused cookies, began acting wildly and leapt from a hotel balcony, officials said; the medical examiner’s office said marijuana intoxication had made a “significant” contribution to the accident.

In April, the shooting death of Kristine Kirk raised even more concerns about regulating edible marijuana. Minutes before she was killed, Ms. Kirk called 911 to say her husband, Richard, was “talking like it was the end of the world” and had consumed marijuana and possibly prescription medication for back pain, according to a police affidavit. Police later confirmed that Mr. Kirk had bought the Karma Kandy and a pre-rolled joint from a licensed marijuana shop that evening.

Those two deaths, combined with reports of groggy, nauseated children visiting emergency rooms, forced the state to tighten its labeling and packaging rules for edible marijuana. Regulators are also considering whether to set lower limits on the amount of THC, the psychoactive component of marijuana, that can be packed into one cookie or chocolate bonbon.

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/06/01/us...egal-high.html

[Drak]

Originally Posted by stampsx2

Really? No seriously, look at the threads over the last two years: pro cycling, pro taxes, pro weed, anti guns, anti corporation and so many more.

Now let's look at the right wing threads: the hunting thread

I'm not saying there's anything wrong with left or right wing but imo cp has much more left wing threads and support.

Well your original quote was specific to this thread. I'm not sure I'd classify cycling and pro weed as left wing ideals either. The anti guns thread is in relation to the USA, and I suspect Canadians overall, right and left, don't tend to hold the same view points as the pro gun crowd in the states.

Also, I'd classify myself as left, but I have no problem with hunting as long as it's not trophy based.

[Drak]

Originally Posted by Dion

The downside of a legal high. Hopefully the Liberal govt is paying attention





http://www.nytimes.com/2014/06/01/us...egal-high.html

Cherry picking though. The article from early 2014 goes on to say

Despite such anecdotes, there is scant hard data. Because of the lag in reporting many health statistics, it may take years to know legal marijuana’s effect — if any — on teenage drug use, school expulsions or the number of fatal car crashes.

<SNIP>

The vast majority of the state’s medical and recreational marijuana stores are living up to stringent state rules, they say. The stores have sold marijuana to hundreds of thousands of customers without incident. The industry has generated $12.6 million in taxes and fees so far, though the revenues have not matched some early projections.

Marijuana supporters note that violent crimes in Denver — where the bulk of Colorado’s pot retailers are — are down so far this year. The number of robberies from January through April fell by 4.8 percent from the same time in 2013, and assaults were down by 3.7 percent. Over all, crime in Denver is down by about 10 percent, though it is impossible to say whether changes to marijuana laws played any role in that decline.

[RougeUnderoos]

Originally Posted by FlameOn

So right on the heels of the fake page one advertisements from Postmedia on behalf of the CPC, the Sun is now posting completely fake interviews smack in the middle of the "news" section

Ha ha ha. Christ, there must be a lot of embarrassed people in that "newsroom" right now.

[Dion]

Fighting The Black Market And The Everyday Challenges Of Selling Legal Weed

And then there’s another unique problem: the competing black market dealers who have none of the costs of operating a lawful business and often have access to product of similar quality. Marijuana advocates long suggested that legalization would be the key to wiping out the black market for marijuana, but almost a year and a half into the experiment, that hasn’t been the case.

About five miles from Herban, smoke is in the air and a dealer armed with three small baggies of Sour Diesel marijuana is doing business the old-fashioned way. The dealer spoke with International Business Times on condition of anonymity, in part to avoid possible arrest, but primarily because he fears backlash from people in the legal industry with whom he once worked.

He used to sell marijuana legally, he says. He owned a business that operated out of a modest building in Denver, but he grew disillusioned following what he saw as excessive regulation, uncertainty and taxation. College educated and previously struggling to keep up with the city's rapidly rising rents, he says he now operates his marijuana business much the same way he did in high school: out of his car.

The state’s Amendment 64 ushered in a new era of business last year, allowing for marijuana to be sold for recreational as well as medicinal use. That brought a wave of new customers to pot dispensaries and a flood of cash, but it came with a cadre of regulations governing just about every aspect of who, what, when, where and how marijuana could be sold.

Skirting these regulations and free of overhead costs, sales tax and MED regulations, this dealer estimates he’s making two to three times as much money as when he owned his marijuana business. And his clandestine delivery service is just a tiny part of the equation in the state’s black market.

In March, Colorado authorities announced the arrest of Tri Trong Nguyen, his wife and 30 others in a bust of the largest marijuana-trafficking ring since legalization was passed. Authorities had seized 4,600 pounds of marijuana, nearly 2,000 marijuana plants, 10 pounds of hash oil and about $1.4 million in cash by the time the bust was made public.

"This investigation shut down one of the largest and most sophisticated criminal enterprises uncovered since Colorado voters passed Amendment 20 in 2000," Colorado Attorney General Cynthia H. Coffman said at a press conference following the bust. "Nguyen's drug ring is further evidence of Colorado's thriving black market. Illegal drug dealers are simply hiding in plain sight, attempting to use the legalized market as a cover."

It’s a cover that has been easily and profitably exploited because legalization has given shelter to a number of black-market dealers who no longer need to hide what they’re doing. With so many people now allowed to grow marijuana legally, selling it illegally is now easier than ever.

http://www.ibtimes.com/pulse/colorad...lenges-1913431

[Fire of the Phoenix]

Originally Posted by adc

Rob Ford makes me laugh (and from many reports was a decent politician in terms of what he got done) so yes I have no problem with them "cavorting" with the Fords. I also see Justin Trudeau as a much bigger embarrassment to Canada if he were elected PM than Ford.

Outside of changing their policies right now I don't see a ton they could do to change my opinion. It certainly has a lot more to do with their policies overall than just a "low taxes=good" but getting support from the Fords is a way down the list of things that matter to me in this election especially considering how awful the other options are.

I don't see the Liberals or NDP as options for my vote. The Greens and CHP are a joke so I guess if Harper and other Conservatives went on a murder rampage maybe I wouldn't vote at all but yes I think it would take so sort of ridiculous situation like that for me to change my vote at this point.

Well this is a solid +1 in the argument against mandatory voting

[FlamesAddiction]

No one is saying that there won't be challenges and learning experience with legalized marijuana. Of course there will be. Alcohol has been legal for a long time and there are still challenges faced with that.

I think it's a little unfair to expect 100% instant successful results when the current system of prohibition has exist for about 100 years and it still hasn't boasted the successes that it was supposed to.

[sworkhard]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

No one is saying that there won't be challenges and learning experience with legalized marijuana. Of course there will be. Alcohol has been legal for a long time and there are still challenges faced with that.

I think it's a little unfair to expect 100% instant successful results when the current system of prohibition has exist for about 100 years and it still hasn't boasted the successes that it was supposed to.

It's going to be easier to control the black market when the entire country follows the same rules than when only one state or province does. Anyone can brew alcohol, but there's not a huge black market for it, even though you could easily make a decent living if you avoided the taxes, sold it cheaper than in stores, and made a good product. In some ways, legalizing it in an individual state has made it a idea place to grow it for export to other states and countries.

I think the key is going to be to not tax it for the first few years to drive the costs down and make the convenience of picking up what you want from a store worth more than the little you can save from getting it from a dealer. Then start slowly applying taxes and even though you'll see some dealers getting back into it, most people will simply keep going where it's convenient.

[killer_carlson]

Tax the snot out of it, and impose enormous fines on those who do not sell licensed product. Then take 1/2 the resources previously dedicated to searching out illegal marijuana and instead hire inspectors and accountants to track those who do not license or under-report their sales to avoid taxes.

[CampbellsTransgressions]

Of course there are black market dealers. The economies of scale have yet to break through on the pricing side. It's why their tax revenue is so low - the industry is still in its infancy.

Kids were getting their hands on it before, you just didn't see anyone reporting on it.

Even if bad things still happen while its legal, at least functioning members of society aren't being strapped with a life-destroying criminal record. The basic principle behind legalization is very simple. I'm not sure what is so hard to grasp?

[FlamesAddiction]

Here is an interesting synopsis of the legal history of marijuana in Canada (and the racist origin):

http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/2...o_with_it.html


It became illegal in Canada when someone hand-wrote it onto the list of banned substances just prior to it being passed (the previous editions did not have it on there). There was no debate in parliament and no one knows who added it. It very well may not have even have been anyone elected or with special knowledge on the subject.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/health/mariju...-why-1.2630436

[Dion]

Originally Posted by CampbellsTransgressions

Of course there are black market dealers. The economies of scale have yet to break through on the pricing side. It's why their tax revenue is so low - the industry is still in its infancy.

Kids were getting their hands on it before, you just didn't see anyone reporting on it.

Even if bad things still happen while its legal, at least functioning members of society aren't being strapped with a life-destroying criminal record. The basic principle behind legalization is very simple. I'm not sure what is so hard to grasp?

Regulations and all the overhead costs of running a legalised business of selling weed is a big reason why the black market exists. You will never eliminate the black market.

[Dion]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

No one is saying that there won't be challenges and learning experience with legalized marijuana. Of course there will be. Alcohol has been legal for a long time and there are still challenges faced with that.

I think it's a little unfair to expect 100% instant successful results when the current system of prohibition has exist for about 100 years and it still hasn't boasted the successes that it was supposed to.

I'm hoping the Liberal govt is paying attention to what is happening in Colorado.

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by killer_carlson

Tax the snot out of it, and impose enormous fines on those who do not sell licensed product. Then take 1/2 the resources previously dedicated to searching out illegal marijuana and instead hire inspectors and accountants to track those who do not license or under-report their sales to avoid taxes.

Conservatives always say this when they finally give in to the fact that marijuana criminalization is archaic. You don't "tax the snot/crap/hell out of it" like you guys always suggest. If you do that, then legalizing it is pretty much useless, as the black market will defeat the legal market.

I know there's always huge disdain for marijuana from the right, but if you begrudgingly accept that it should be legalized than you also need to accept that it will be treated like alcohol and just taxed normally. The government will need to make the black market redundant, they don't do that and the organized crime and danger to buyers who avoid the "taxed to snot" legal stuff will still be there.

[Dion]

Originally Posted by jayswin

Conservatives always say this when they finally give in to the fact that marijuana criminalization is archaic. You don't "tax the snot/crap/hell out of it" like you guys always suggest. If you do that, then legalizing it is pretty much useless, as the black market will defeat the legal market.

I know there's always huge disdain for marijuana from the right, but if you begrudgingly accept that it should be legalized than you also need to accept that it will be treated like alcohol and just taxed normally. The government will need to make the black market redundant, they don't do that and the organized crime and danger to buyers who avoid the "taxed to snot" legal stuff will still be there.

Alcohol is not being taxed normally. Have you checked the price of beer lately That said I do understand the point you are trying to make.

Making the black market redundant is going to be very difficult. It will be much easier to sell weed when it's a legal product and will require constant policing and monitoring of how it's sold.