[Rumour] Incoming Flames shake up

[Vinny01]

So people are good with Kulak in the top 4?

Wouldn’t trading a right shot D make more sense?

I am going to predict Stone+prospect for Hoffman is the type of deal Calgary is after. Andersson slides right into the lineup and they likely don’t skip a beat.

Brodie gets moved and Kulak moves to the 2nd pair with Bartkowski or Wotherspoon on the third pair

If the response is “play Hamonic or Stone on their offside” shouldn’t we do that with Brodie before selling super low on him? He has proven to play the right side effectively.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by PlayfulGenius

Even if the pick does become Top 3 after the lotto, it extremely unlikely it would have been had the team NOT traded for Hamonic... so to say he cost the Flames a top 3 pick is ridiculous.

Hamonic made the team worse?

[TheScorpion]

Maybe I'm crazy, but I've personally been fine with Hamonic's play this season. He's seemed to fill the hole Engelland left with ease and is playing like a pretty solid #4.

[Hackey]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

Hamonic made the team worse?

If the team were to finish roughly 10-14 before the lottery its highly unlikely they draft top 3. If it actually did happen it is highly unlikely the result would be the exact same if we didn't trade for Hamonic to begin with.

[GullFoss]

Originally Posted by TheScorpion

Maybe I'm crazy, but I've personally been fine with Hamonic's play this season. He's seemed to fill the hole Engelland left with ease and is playing like a pretty solid #4.

His first 10-20 games were bad, but he's been quite good these past 15 or so games.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by TheScorpion

Maybe I'm crazy, but I've personally been fine with Hamonic's play this season. He's seemed to fill the hole Engelland left with ease and is playing like a pretty solid #4.

If the forwards had buried more chances in the first half the team could easily have 5 more wins and this would be an entirely different convo. Off the top of my head missing empty nets has cost us wins in SJ and Minny within the last couple weeks.

Hamonic hasn't set the world on fire but the goals against has been solid for a while now, the D is overall pretty strong.

[Love]

Originally Posted by TheScorpion

Maybe I'm crazy, but I've personally been fine with Hamonic's play this season. He's seemed to fill the hole Engelland left with ease and is playing like a pretty solid #4.

I agree. I think he’s been solid & better than Brodie

[PlayfulGenius]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

Hamonic made the team worse?

I doubt it... but he didn't make the team exactly the same, which is my point.

If the spot the Flames end up in wons the lottery, it's safe to say they wouldn't have finished there had theyvnot made the trade... make sense?

EDIT : Hackey already explained

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by Hackey

If the team were to finish roughly 10-14 before the lottery its highly unlikely they draft top 3. If it actually did happen it is highly unlikely the result would be the exact same if we didn't trade for Hamonic to begin with.

The Flames traded their 1st round pick for Hamonic. Without him, they’d be theoretically even worse and would have even better chance of top pick. So you’re saying that because he’s on the team, you will never know what the pick could have been. That is factually correct but not sure I totally see your point. The issue is whether a playoff bubble team should have traded so much for a #4 defenseman. I do get that some people saw that as a decent gamble. If Travis Hamonic propels the Flames into a top 10 team this debate would certainly look different.

[IgiTang]

Wonder what’s up with this so called shakeup..

[transplant99]

Hamonic struggled in the first month...no question. New system, new teammates, adjusting to a new city...whatever it was, it was there. He has been fine though since mid-November onward.

His partner on the other hand? Not so much.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by PlayfulGenius

I doubt it... but he didn't make the team exactly the same, which is my point.

If the spot the Flames end up in wons the lottery, it's safe to say they wouldn't have finished there had theyvnot made the trade... make sense?

EDIT : Hackey already explained

I get it, but you could also say they win the lottery (or have better odds) without him. I guess every trade changes what might have happened.

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by PlayfulGenius

I doubt it... but he didn't make the team exactly the same, which is my point.

If the spot the Flames end up in wons the lottery, it's safe to say they wouldn't have finished there had theyvnot made the trade... make sense?

EDIT : Hackey already explained

So then Hamonic would be directly responsible for the Islanders getting a top 3 pick from the Flames?

It can be spun in numerous ways but if that pick somehow finds itself in the top 3 the trade is a disaster. It looks awful if that pick lands in the top 10 imo.

I look at the Martin Jones and Phil Kessel deals as great examples. Jones was dealt for a future first when the Sharks were coming off a playoff miss and appeared to be on the downside. They end up making the SCF and who cares about giving up a 29th overall pick for a good young starting goalie.

Kessel was an elite young player scorong 30 before he was 21. The Leafs pod a premium in futures and had those picks not landed in the top 2 then top 9 the deal would look good for Toronto as Kessel was exactly what they thought he would be when they traded for him.

The Flames make thebplayoffs and the pick is 16+ then the deal is fine for the Flames.

[Flamefan1]

I agree with most posters that Hamonic is fine and I think a good addition to the team. I also like Stone, and do not want to see him traded. He is our only defenseman with a good point shot. It may not always be accurate, but when it is it is lethal. I also love the play of Kulak. Bartlowski should not play unless we have an injury or illness. Brodie is a key member of the Flames and I personally hate talk of trading him.

[Brick]

Originally Posted by IgiTang

Wonder what’s up with this so called shakeup..

Delayed by holiday weekend?

I am hoping something happens by the end of the week.

[Cecil Terwilliger]

Originally Posted by Vinny01

So then Hamonic would be directly responsible for the Islanders getting a top 3 pick from the Flames?

It can be spun in numerous ways but if that pick somehow finds itself in the top 3 the trade is a disaster. It looks awful if that pick lands in the top 10 imo.

I look at the Martin Jones and Phil Kessel deals as great examples. Jones was dealt for a future first when the Sharks were coming off a playoff miss and appeared to be on the downside. They end up making the SCF and who cares about giving up a 29th overall pick for a good young starting goalie.

Kessel was an elite young player scorong 30 before he was 21. The Leafs pod a premium in futures and had those picks not landed in the top 2 then top 9 the deal would look good for Toronto as Kessel was exactly what they thought he would be when they traded for him.

The Flames make thebplayoffs and the pick is 16+ then the deal is fine for the Flames.

Even if they miss it’ll probably be fine.

Everyone is acting like the chance of that pick winning the lottery on its own makes the trade a failure or that it is a foregone conclusion it will win the lottery.

And even if it does, if Hamonic is a key piece in the Flames over the next few seasons and we see some playoff success, it could still turn out to be better than the lottery pick.

[GullFoss]

I think this could be interesting with Ottawa:

To Ottawa
brodie (4.7)
brouwer (4.5)
stajan (3.1)

To Calgary
Stone (3.5)
Dion (7.0)
Thompson (1.6)

Johnny Monahan Stone
Tkachuk Backlund Frolik
Bennett Jankowski Ferland
Hathaway Thompson Jagr

Gio Hamilton
Phaneuf Hamonic
Stone Kulak

[bigrangy]

Originally Posted by GullFoss

I think this could be interesting with Ottawa:

To Ottawa
brodie (4.7)
brouwer (4.5)
stajan (3.1)

To Calgary
Stone (3.5)
Dion (7.0)
Thompson (1.6)

Johnny Monahan Stone
Tkachuk Backlund Frolik
Bennett Jankowski Ferland
Hathaway Thompson Jagr

Gio Hamilton
Phaneuf Hamonic
Stone Kulak

While I will never underestimate Melnyk’s willingness to save a few bucks, that trade is ultra lopsided for the Flames. Take out Brouwer and it’s probably close.

I like that as a base for a deal though. Stone would fit great here.

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by GullFoss

I think this could be interesting with Ottawa:

To Ottawa
brodie (4.7)
brouwer (4.5)
stajan (3.1)

To Calgary
Stone (3.5)
Dion (7.0)
Thompson (1.6)

Johnny Monahan Stone
Tkachuk Backlund Frolik
Bennett Jankowski Ferland
Hathaway Thompson Jagr

Gio Hamilton
Phaneuf Hamonic
Stone Kulak

That offer does not get Stone. Brodie has been a bag of poo this year and the other two have negative value. If Tre could pull that off I would build a shrine to the man. Pretty sure Stone is not available and if he was Brodie and junk are not getting it done. You are realistically looking at Tkachuk+

[4X4]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

That offer does not get Stone. Brodie has been a bag of poo this year and the other two have negative value. If Tre could pull that off I would build a shrine to the man. Pretty sure Stone is not available and if he was Brodie and junk are not getting it done. You are realistically looking at Tkachuk+

Pretty sure that taking 7.0 Phaneuf off their hands was the + on top of Brodie, who is probably still a good player, under a different coach.