Sam Bennett as a center or winger?

[dustygoon]

Why can't Janko and Bennett be on same line and both take on center responsibilities?

Between Thornton and Pavelski, who is the center? Face-offs don't define the position. They play exclusively together and Thornton had 375 face-off wins last year while Pavelski had 449 FW wins. Yes....one is left handed and the other right so they flip based on side of ice, but after the face-off these two guys are constantly switching position as the play unfolds.

Rakell is a center for the time being...he's doing fine and is pretty young.

Bennet should play whatever position he has most success at for the time being. He isn't going to forget how to play center if he plays wing for a while. Give him some confidence and let him start generating some shots.

[Flash Walken]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

That's not what I'm saying at all. I'm just saying when he plays with Johnny and Monahan, who are pretty slick, he falls into a habit of trying to do fancier plays like they do. He forces low percentage passes and gets away from his hard hitting game. It's not attitude at all. I am not suggesting this is intentional or that he's not trying hard. I'm just saying it's a habit he sometimes gets into. Any player can get away from their A game like that.

Sorry, not trying to misrepresent you or be combative, but I think this kind of thinking is indicative of expectations that are based more on 'want' or 'belief' than offerings on the ice.

Here's the thing about his 'low percentage passes' and 'hard hitting game': he's not skilled enough to turn lower percentage passes into higher percentage ones, and he's not skilled enough to be a devastating hitter while being responsible in other areas of his game. I just think his lower percentage passes are more noticeable when he's surrounded by guys with high skill because they are making those passes look higher percentage than they really are.

I don't really think it's a case of him saying "oh I have to make a high skill play here because I"m not playing with Tanner Glass" it's more of a "these guys are moving the play significantly faster than I am used to." I think it's a matter of not being able to keep up, which is ok.

The thing with his shot is, if his shot is so great, why doesn't he score more goals with it? To be sure, he scores beauties on occasion, really rips pucks. Just about every guy in the league can rip a puck now though, guys who score goals just score goals, no matter which line they are on. A guy like Patrick Eaves is a great example. He routinely ends up with more goals than assists because he happens to shoot the puck really well. Shean Donovan scored 18 goals, and no one would confuse him with a goal scorer.

Part of that is his shot is not as great as one might believe based on his highlight reel, but also that he lacks the skill to consistently find himself in a position to use his shot effectively. Obviously he's no Monahan, but if you look at how Monahan plays, he is constantly and consistently finding ways to put pucks on net, doesn't matter if it's Gaudreau or Brouwer out there with him, he's getting his shots away in high traffic areas. That's just not something Ferland can do and I think it's unreasonable to expect him to do it.

Right now, if Ferland is taking a regular shift and isn't hurting the team, I think that's all you can really ask of him at this point. It's also important to remember though that the team is 28th in league scoring right now because they are in a situation where they are relying on guys who can't score consistently to score. It's not really Ferland's problem he's not a top line winger, it's an organizational problem. It would be great if he turned into a 25 goal guy, but as far as the history of the Flames is concerned, just having a contributing draft pick in the lineup is a big step forward.

When Ferland gets hot he'll get icetime and when he's not he won't. Such is life. I just don't think playing with star players means too much to his game other than having added pressure on each touch of the puck he get. Maybe that means he's trying to move the puck sooner than he normally would, but I think it is more so to do with his linemates playing a much quicker game than he's used to, or comfortable, playing.

When Iggy was on the ice, there was always lots of pressure to get him the puck. However, the difference between him scoring or not didn't come down to whether a crash and banger continued to play crash and bang hockey when on a line with Iggy, it came down to how skilled his linemate was, pure and simple. Same is true with Monahan and Geaudreau. It's not like if you put Lance Bouma up there running everyone through the boards that they produced, they happen to produce more with a guy like Hudler or Versteeg riding with him. If you put up Freddie or Hathaway with them, it'll be the same story.

Comes down to top 6 skill or no and I just don't think Ferland has it.

[Kovaz]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

Sorry, not trying to misrepresent you or be combative, but I think this kind of thinking is indicative of expectations that are based more on 'want' or 'belief' than offerings on the ice.

Here's the thing about his 'low percentage passes' and 'hard hitting game': he's not skilled enough to turn lower percentage passes into higher percentage ones, and he's not skilled enough to be a devastating hitter while being responsible in other areas of his game. I just think his lower percentage passes are more noticeable when he's surrounded by guys with high skill because they are making those passes look higher percentage than they really are.

I don't really think it's a case of him saying "oh I have to make a high skill play here because I"m not playing with Tanner Glass" it's more of a "these guys are moving the play significantly faster than I am used to." I think it's a matter of not being able to keep up, which is ok.

The thing with his shot is, if his shot is so great, why doesn't he score more goals with it? To be sure, he scores beauties on occasion, really rips pucks. Just about every guy in the league can rip a puck now though, guys who score goals just score goals, no matter which line they are on. A guy like Patrick Eaves is a great example. He routinely ends up with more goals than assists because he happens to shoot the puck really well. Shean Donovan scored 18 goals, and no one would confuse him with a goal scorer.

Part of that is his shot is not as great as one might believe based on his highlight reel, but also that he lacks the skill to consistently find himself in a position to use his shot effectively. Obviously he's no Monahan, but if you look at how Monahan plays, he is constantly and consistently finding ways to put pucks on net, doesn't matter if it's Gaudreau or Brouwer out there with him, he's getting his shots away in high traffic areas. That's just not something Ferland can do and I think it's unreasonable to expect him to do it.

Right now, if Ferland is taking a regular shift and isn't hurting the team, I think that's all you can really ask of him at this point. It's also important to remember though that the team is 28th in league scoring right now because they are in a situation where they are relying on guys who can't score consistently to score. It's not really Ferland's problem he's not a top line winger, it's an organizational problem. It would be great if he turned into a 25 goal guy, but as far as the history of the Flames is concerned, just having a contributing draft pick in the lineup is a big step forward.

When Ferland gets hot he'll get icetime and when he's not he won't. Such is life. I just don't think playing with star players means too much to his game other than having added pressure on each touch of the puck he get. Maybe that means he's trying to move the puck sooner than he normally would, but I think it is more so to do with his linemates playing a much quicker game than he's used to, or comfortable, playing.

When Iggy was on the ice, there was always lots of pressure to get him the puck. However, the difference between him scoring or not didn't come down to whether a crash and banger continued to play crash and bang hockey when on a line with Iggy, it came down to how skilled his linemate was, pure and simple. Same is true with Monahan and Geaudreau. It's not like if you put Lance Bouma up there running everyone through the boards that they produced, they happen to produce more with a guy like Hudler or Versteeg riding with him. If you put up Freddie or Hathaway with them, it'll be the same story.

Comes down to top 6 skill or no and I just don't think Ferland has it.

I think the truth lies somewhere in the middle. Ferland definitely isn't a legitimate top-6 winger, and he's probably never going to score more than 30-35 points unless he has a Clarkson-like crazy puck luck season. But he does get away from his game sometimes when he's playing in the top-6, and it does affect his line. I think you're both right, just framing it a little differently. When Ferland is presented with "these guys are moving the play significantly faster than I am used to," I think his big mistake is in even trying to keep up, when he should keep it simple and safe, and allow his two more skilled linemates to make the creative plays.

Despite his flaws, I still think he's a good fit with Gaudreau and Monahan, because he has strengths in areas they lack as a pair. Dumping the puck in is much more effective for both of them when they've got Ferland to chase after it. And he's great at winning puck battles, something both Gaudreau and Monahan can struggle with at times. Plus he back-checks well, so Monahan can be more aggressive in getting to the net. The biggest thing for Ferland is to keep his game simple and predictable. His job is to retrieve pucks, make simple, safe passes, and go to the net. As long as he's doing that, Gaudreau and Monahan can read off of that and use their creativity knowing where Ferland will be.

I'd still argue that Ferland has a great shot, but he doesn't have the offensive hockey IQ to create good chances, which really limits his ability as a scorer. I'd even say his shot might be better than Monahan's, but Monahan is miles and miles ahead at reading the play and knowing how to finish. Last year, Monahan had a little less than twice as many shots as Ferland, and a little less than twice as many goals. A lot of Ferland's goals were from absolute lasers on only moderately dangerous chances, whereas Monahan scores a ton of goals that are basically tap-ins. Before anyone jumps all over that last bit, I'm complimenting Monahan's hockey IQ in that he's able to find easy goals that no one else on the team can. Monahan still scores a dozen or so goals a year on crazy shots as well.

[stone hands]

Monahan has this crazy elite ability to put the puck on net when there is 7 guys around him all whacking at it and it almost always ends up in the back of the net. I really think you could put him with anyone and he would rack up points based on that alone

[Bonecrushing Hits]

Bennett's move to the wing tonight reminded me of the time my dad traded in my Micron skates for some Bauers... fu#*!ng smooth

[calgaryblood]

What a shocker that Bennett looked great tonight on the wing.....if only some could have predicted that he wasn't getting it done as a Center.

Hopefully he stays there for at least this season.

[Yrebmi]

Yeah - I was a Bennett at center defender - but damn he looked good on the wing tonight.

[ForeverFlameFan]

Nm

[jonkaupp]

If tonight was indicative of what Bennett can be as a winger going forward then holy hell. Didn’t hit score sheet but law of averages will fix that. Easily could have factored in three goals. He looked dynamic for the first time since I can’t remember. He’s had decent games in the past year but never had that sizzle to his game like we saw tonight. Two plays stand out, bursting down left wing and passing to whoever was wide open for a one timer than Got robbed and the crazy move down the middle that nearly resulted in a goal of not for a pesky post on the rebound. There were others but those stuck out in my head big time. Tonight was exciting beyond the win because of that.

[pepper24]

Looking better on wing but still no points. Will be interesting to see where he goes as a winger when Jagr comes back.

[DoubleK]

Originally Posted by pepper24

Looking better on wing but still no points. Will be interesting to see where he goes as a winger when Jagr comes back.

He goes to the Press Box.

He's played ~170 NHL games. How much time does a player get?

It's getting to the point where he's earned himself a trip to Stockton and based on his play this year, I think he clears.

[Toonage]

Originally Posted by pepper24

Looking better on wing but still no points. Will be interesting to see where he goes as a winger when Jagr comes back.

Stays on the left and Lazar or Ferland takes the RW spot on that line or Jagr starts there as he eases back into the lineup.

Stajan is probably the one who ends up sitting when Jagr comes back.

[FlamesFanTrev]

Originally Posted by DoubleK

He goes to the Press Box.

He's played ~170 NHL games. How much time does a player get?

It's getting to the point where he's earned himself a trip to Stockton and based on his play this year, I think he clears.

0% chance he goes on waivers, and a 0% chance he clears waivers if he does.

[GreenLantern2814]

Originally Posted by dustygoon

Why can't Janko and Bennett be on same line and both take on center responsibilities?

Between Thornton and Pavelski, who is the center? Face-offs don't define the position. They play exclusively together and Thornton had 375 face-off wins last year while Pavelski had 449 FW wins. Yes....one is left handed and the other right so they flip based on side of ice, but after the face-off these two guys are constantly switching position as the play unfolds.

Rakell is a center for the time being...he's doing fine and is pretty young.

Bennet should play whatever position he has most success at for the time being. He isn't going to forget how to play center if he plays wing for a while. Give him some confidence and let him start generating some shots.

Sam Bennett still has 0 points this season - let's keep Pavelski and Thornton's names away from Sam's, unless all we're doing is making a list of people who are better.

Mark Jankowski looks exponentially more comfortable at centre than Bennett does. His positioning is better, he isn't chasing the game, he knows when to pressure and when to contain. Jankowski's a more mature player, and that's what the centre position requires.

Bennett likes the get the puck and go. He's a very direct player. Which is exactly what you want from a winger. Bennett doesn't have Jankowski's patience, and that's why his game is better on the wing.

Jankowski is the centre. Bennett is the winger. As long as they continue to do their jobs the way they have the last two games, the points will come.

[pepper24]

Originally Posted by DoubleK

He goes to the Press Box.

He's played ~170 NHL games. How much time does a player get?

It's getting to the point where he's earned himself a trip to Stockton and based on his play this year, I think he clears.

Maybe press box if point slump continues but he won't be sent to AHL. I doubt he clears and no point giving up on him quite yet.

[calgaryblood]

Originally Posted by FlamesFanTrev

0% chance he goes on waivers, and a 0% chance he clears waivers if he does.

Yeah no chance that happens. Bennett still has value. He has looked better as a winger.

[Cactus Jack]

This not impatience but Bennett was much quieter in his second game on the wing than the first where he was all over the place. Let´s see hope he looks more like he did against Nashville than St. Louis.

[TheFlamesVan]

Originally Posted by Cactus Jack

This not impatience but Bennett was much quieter in his second game on the wing than the first where he was all over the place. Let´s see hope he looks more like he did against Nashville than St. Louis.

I agree, but he really threw his weight around and was flying against Nashville. Probably a little fatigued on the back to back. I'm expecting him to have another great game against the Stars.

[Tinordi]

Originally Posted by Cactus Jack

This not impatience but Bennett was much quieter in his second game on the wing than the first where he was all over the place. Let´s see hope he looks more like he did against Nashville than St. Louis.

He was still able to keep his high PPG going though. Penalties per Game that is.

[yourbestfriend]

If i'm GG, I'd swap Bennett and Ferland.
Give Bennett some confidence, from the eye test, he's played decently well on the wing and has some chemistry with Johnny already. Even if he gets on the board with a 2nd assist or scores on a deflection off his ass, it should do wonders for his confidence.

Ferland playing with two relatively skilled passers in Jankowski and Versteeg coupled with icetime against some lesser competition should also help him get going as well.