[PGT] Growing pains continue! Flames still get a point!

[moon]

Originally Posted by JiriHrdina

Not having a quality backup arguably cost the Flames in terms of a higher seeding and the number 1 being overworked when playoffs started. Again if it was that easy why did the Flames struggle to find a capable backup?

I disagree with it costing them and disagree that they didn't find a capable back-up. Joseph was fine, Noodles was fine, Toskala was fine.

I think the problem with the Flames is that twice they made bad choices on who to go with (McBackup and Karlsson). That has more to do with them making a poor choice rather than guys not being available. When they realized this and got guys to fill in with Toskala and Joseph it seemed pretty easy for them to bring in guys that were available and were upgrades.

Just because there are available guys out there doesn't mean GM's are going to make the right choice on who to get or who to use.

[Calgary4LIfe]

Originally Posted by moon

I disagree with it costing them and disagree that they didn't find a capable back-up. Joseph was fine, Noodles was fine, Toskala was fine.

I think the problem with the Flames is that twice they made bad choices on who to go with (McBackup and Karlsson). That has more to do with them making a poor choice rather than guys not being available. When they realized this and got guys to fill in with Toskala and Joseph it seemed pretty easy for them to bring in guys that were available and were upgrades.

Just because there are available guys out there doesn't mean GM's are going to make the right choice on who to get or who to use.

Karlsson was a bit of a gamble to start with, but he instantly became a favorite because he did win games his first season - the most in a while, actually. Kind of lost it in the 2nd half of the season, and took a giant step back the following season.

He looked good for the first while, and with the cap the way it was and Karlsson's performance, I don't think that was a mistake at all.

[strombad]

Originally Posted by moon

So if every move made by hockey coaches or GM's aren't able to be criticized by us is there really much of a point of having a message board?

I guess we can pass on news to each other but the argument that Hartley is an NHL coach so no second guessing him seems pretty silly on a message board.

Most people (if not all) are being pretty reasonable about it and just trying to figure out the reasoning behind it because based on what we have seen and heard it doesn't make a whole lot of sense. I think most people should be able to do that on a message board without the Hartley is the coach so he knows best so leave it at that.

I'm beginning to see why you have a reputation.
That comment was not directed at EVERYONE, but rather the person who I quoted, who said Hartley made his decision "for whatever reason (faulty I'm sure)". That's why I quoted that person, so you (moon, since I apparently have to be specific) didn't think I was referring to the criticism levied by everyone.
It's simply ridiculous for some random on a message board to assume that Hartley couldn't possibly have a good reason for sitting Ramo, and that somehow we all have a better sense about the situation. That's all.
Try not to confuse my issue with people saying "Hartley knows nothing" as me saying "Hartley knows everything". They are not the same moon, not the same at all.

[kyuss275]

[QUOTE=JiriHrdina;4425627]Not having a quality backup arguably cost the Flames in terms of a higher seeding and the number 1 being overworked when playoffs started. Again if it was that easy why did the Flames struggle to find a capable backup?[/QUOTE]

I wish i could answer the bolded part. I have no idea why and how the flames for a decade found it hard to pick up a quality veteran back-up. I watched Auld go from team to team for 3-4 straight years and flames management sat by thinking Noodles, Karlson ect. was good enough. Not sure why the flames seemed to be the only team, not only picking up less than average back-ups, but also rewarding them with multi- year deals. Other teams did not seem to have this problem and i will never know why the flames did? Toskala and Joseph were the 2 best and they were mid season pick ups when the regular back-up could not do anything. Even worse was when they were done with those 2 they would go back to regular crappy back-up who needed to be replaced the year before. Still do not get it.