PC Leadership Race- Redford wins.

[Knalus]

Originally Posted by bizaro86

Could you point me towards available for sale properly zoned land in the inner city suitable towards building 6000-8000 extra dwelling units of a size suitable for families? And that's just to replace the single family housing starts for this year. Next year you need another 6-8k sites, and the year after that, etc.

People on this site talk about inner city redevelopment like it's some sort of panacea that will solve every problem. I wonder how many of them have actually tried to locate and purchase suitable land and get a development permit for a multi family housing project in the inner city. Not the easiest thing in the world.

Inner city redevelopment is wonderful, but Calgary is going to need more new land. We should also focus on making new neighbourhoods functional (walkable, transit, etc) as well as on densification of the existing urbanized area.

Because numbers help:
7000 units * 1 hectare/148 units (most common multi-family zoning) = 47 hectares needed to replace the burbs.

A (large) inner city lot might be 50ft by 120 ft, or 557 m2, which is 0.0557 ha. Thus, it would take 843 50 foot lots zoned for multi family to replace the suburban building.

Note that that is in addition to all the land that is already getting converted to multi-family, and it would be required every single year. I actually doubt there is that amount of acreage in the whole city zoned MC that currently doesn't have a multi-family dwelling on it. Never mind that much available for sale each and every year. Also, family size units are unlikely to fit on parcels at 148 units/ha, as they're probably going to need to be bigger to fit a couple and some kids.

So for those who think densification can solve our problems, I have this question. Would you be willing to convert your neighbourhood into all multi-family zoning?

Hey - I have. I bought a nice lot in Renfrew, and I plan on raising a family eventually on that site. You brought up the exact point I was going to, but thought my post was long enough as it was - the zoning of the land to make the appropriate housing. There are so, so many tiny, little houses in my neighbourhood that are so old (1940's) that they aren't going to last too much longer. These neighbourhoods are perfect for building larger houses to the level that a new, growing family will need. With some great parks, a bunch of smaller schools (that need to be properly funded), a cool community center, and a very quiet neighbourhood, your finding that there are TONNES of strollers and baby bumps in our neighbourhood. It's not a theory, it's happening right now. And it's a 30 minute walk to downtown.

I'm not saying that there should be no growth on the edge of the city - I think that a city like Calgary, of course there will be growth out there, too. It'll be vibrant, and a great place to live as well. But with the amount of growth that this city is currently seeing, there is room for more than just "build new schools on the edge of town". There is enough demand to have communities in the inner city use their schools.

At the end of the day, it's a lot to do about choice. I don't want the inner city schools to close, because I would like to use them. I want that choice. And if they will let me, it will be cheaper for them in the long run, then having to grow, and grow, and grow, and not take advantage of the infrastructure that is already in place and set up.

It's not a one-or-the-other situation. It almost never is. So why should one have to go away to support the other?

[bizaro86]

Originally Posted by Knalus

I'm not saying that there should be no growth on the edge of the city - I think that a city like Calgary, of course there will be growth out there, too. It'll be vibrant, and a great place to live as well. But with the amount of growth that this city is currently seeing, there is room for more than just "build new schools on the edge of town". There is enough demand to have communities in the inner city use their schools.

At the end of the day, it's a lot to do about choice. I don't want the inner city schools to close, because I would like to use them. I want that choice. And if they will let me, it will be cheaper for them in the long run, then having to grow, and grow, and grow, and not take advantage of the infrastructure that is already in place and set up.

It's not a one-or-the-other situation. It almost never is. So why should one have to go away to support the other?

Absolutely. (And Renfrew is also a great neighbourhood. I've spent many hours walking around it, and it's lovely). I would never say to shut down all of the inner city schools, as vibrant inner city neighbourhoods are very important. But there could be some consolidation of unnecessary buildings.

I'm talking more about a situation like Queen Elizabeth High School and Crescent Heights High School. They're very close to each other, old, and underutilized. Could one be closed and the building repurposed/redeveloped in a sensible way? Absolutely.

The biggest problem with underutilized inner city schools is their inefficiency. It costs nearly as much to run a 200 student school as a 600 student school in overhead. In that case I really think it makes sense to consolidate two schools into one and use the savings to improve the education our societies children receive.

In terms of the suburbs, the provincial gov't will only pay for a new school when the existing school infrastructure of a board is being utilized. So an underutilized school in the inner city is taking a neighbourhood school away from someone in the burbs. The inner city types like to rail that they overpay compared to usage for everything, but the old walkable schools they have cost more to operate per student than newer larger ones.

[Slava]

I would like to see a shared-use facility for some of these inner city schools or schools that are under-utilized. There are groups that could use the space during the evenings/weekends so that the space is still used, but the school can remain open and viable. I am not only in favour of kids walking to schools (which is a big deal for a number of reasons) but also because the schools in our communities are such a hub. You meet your neighbours, attend a lot of functions and in general a vibrant and healthy school is huge for healthy communities. Oh, and they also educate our children!

[MoneyGuy]

Has anyone heard that Redford may drop out of this race?

[Cowboy89]

Originally Posted by MoneyGuy

Has anyone heard that Redford may drop out of this race?

I had been reading that her sisters and family had been advocating staying the course because that's what her mother would have wanted.

http://www.calgaryherald.com/Alison+...485/story.html

That said I couldn't imagine being in her situation and forging ahead in a bid to become premier. It's just really horrible.

[Ducay]

Vote day!

Predict a Mar win with 55% of the vote, followed by Redford 30% and other guy 15%

[CrusaderPi]

In fairness, Mary came from a world renowned family of gang bangers. You should see their family crest.

[killer_carlson]

I may go down to the results "party" as it's in my riding.

[The Goon]

No offense to Doug Horner, who I'm sure is a great guy and qualified for the position, but his voice is so weird I don't want him to win just so I don't have to hear him speak for x number of years.

[Ducay]

Originally Posted by The Goon

No offense to Doug Horner, who I'm sure is a great guy and qualified for the position, but his voice is so weird I don't want him to win just so I don't have to hear him speak for x number of years.

He looks identical to my slovakian neighbour, so my mind is always confused when he doesn't speak in a thick accent.

Oh, and Horner has to win solely for having the cojones to sport that pedo-facial hair.

[Bill Bumface]

Originally Posted by bizaro86

Could you point me towards available for sale properly zoned land in the inner city suitable towards building 6000-8000 extra dwelling units of a size suitable for families?

Easy. There are a few massive undeveloped parcels in Bridgeland still, and tons of available land in the East Village. The West Village is sitting in the pipe for when those start to fill up. Solved

[c.t.ner]

Take this again with a grain of salt, but it looks like as the polls (By close I mean 4 hours) are starting to close the #pcldr twitter stream is picking up.

Saw this tidbit from Stephen Carter (Allison Redford's Campaign Manager)

carter_bbold 5:19pm via TweetDeck

Numbers being reported back so far are great. KEEP GOING! More voters. More members. More change. #pcldr

Again taking it with a grain of salt, but Carter was tweeting a lot during Nenshi's campaign and was an observer for the voting process. He called Nenshi's win way before anyone else was calling it.

I'm not expecting a massive surge for Redford, but the tweet is interesting. Could have some ground to it or it's just a campaign manager trying whatever he can to get the vote out.

[Slava]

Originally Posted by c.t.ner

Take this again with a grain of salt, but it looks like as the polls (By close I mean 4 hours) are starting to close the #pcldr twitter stream is picking up.

Saw this tidbit from Stephen Carter (Allison Redford's Campaign Manager)

carter_bbold 5:19pm via TweetDeck

Numbers being reported back so far are great. KEEP GOING! More voters. More members. More change. #pcldr

Again taking it with a grain of salt, but Carter was tweeting a lot during Nenshi's campaign and was an observer for the voting process. He called Nenshi's win way before anyone else was calling it.

I'm not expecting a massive surge for Redford, but the tweet is interesting. Could have some ground to it or it's just a campaign manager trying whatever he can to get the vote out.

Well he was Nenshi's campaign manager (maybe he had a different title there under Chima, but virtually the same effect). I took those tweets during that campaign with a grain of salt.

I am really curious about what a Redford win will mean for the PCs though. There are some pretty wide divides in the party if she wins.

[Jacks]

Just watching a feed that shows Redford and Mar almost tied. 24 out of 85 polls. This could be interesting.

Edit:
http://www.livestream.com/asquaredtv

[Jacks]

27 of 85 polls

Mar 8106 = 43.16%
Redford 7564 = 40.27%
Horner 3112 = 16.57%

[Slava]

Its incredibly tight. I'm not ashamed to say that I told Stephen Carter to pack it in after the first ballot...not looking forward to the "I told you so" conversation, but regardless of the outcome its a brilliant campaign they've run.

Tonight looks like it will come down to second choice support. Should be interesting...

[Resolute 14]

Whoa, whoa, whoa! These results are coming in entirely too fast!

[Jacks]

They really should have a run off between the top two and avoid this preferential ballot. It takes away from the legitimacy of the win such as the case with Stelmach.

I'm sure the Wildrose is loving the thought of running Smith against Redford.

[kirant]

Last count
Mar - 9409 (43.49%)
Horner - 3641 (16.83%)
Redford - 8585 (39.68%)

[Jacks]

Most of these polls only have about 1000 votes, at most 2000, to count. Do they go on dinner break after the poll closes?