World Cup South Africa, 2010 Thread

[missdpuck]

Why does Ian Bishop still need a "personal assistant "? He brings her to watch the game and leaves the wife at home.
Other than that, damned Spain . Grrr.

[nickerjones]

Originally Posted by diane_phaneuf

I didnt see this but did this guy get a red or yellow card for this? Or did play just continue on as if nothing happened?

[Phaneuf3]

Originally Posted by nickerjones

I didnt see this but did this guy get a red or yellow card for this? Or did play just continue on as if nothing happened?

It was a yellow. Crazyness. That just goes to show the quality of the reffing that game. Really disappointing considering it's the final.

[GirlySports]

Originally Posted by Phaneuf3

It was a yellow. Crazyness. That just goes to show the quality of the reffing that game. Really disappointing considering it's the final.

I think it's because it was the final that the ref didn't want to 'ruin' the game that early by giving a red card. That's a trap refs have gotten into in the modern game.

For example, if a team is up 1-0 in the first 10 minutes or so the ref will be reluctant to give them a penalty shortly after (unless is blatently obvious) because 2-0 that early would ruin an important game. That's a bit concerning because the ref is not reffing according to the game but according to entertainment factor.

[Phaneuf3]

Originally Posted by GirlySports

I think it's because it was the final that the ref didn't want to 'ruin' the game that early by giving a red card. That's a trap refs have gotten into in the modern game.

For example, if a team is up 1-0 in the first 10 minutes or so the ref will be reluctant to give them a penalty shortly after (unless is blatently obvious) because 2-0 that early would ruin an important game. That's a bit concerning because the ref is not reffing according to the game but according to entertainment factor.

I could buy that explanation for the one particularly dirty slide tackle by the dutch player from behind when he had no chance or intention of playing the ball. This one though.... this one's not only dirty and uncalled for but pretty damn dangerous.

Combine this with all the other blown calls, missed calls and missed dives and this ref had a really REALLY bad game.

[Locke]

I'm glad that Howard Webb won the World Cup, for a while there I didnt think he was going to get the opportunity.

[troutman]

Originally Posted by GirlySports

Proof please? While not greatest I thought Italy were ok.
Won 6 games, 13 goals, beat the hosts along the way.

Stop being biased. If Italy had won this World Cup scoring 8 goals you'd be all over them no matter how they played. So why does Spain get special treatment? As was said earlier, 3 of the most outrageous dives in the tournament.

Biased? You seem to have a big case of sour grapes.

It's simplistic to look at goals for and against. How about quality of opponent? Possession?

Italy was outplayed by USA, AUS and FRA last time IMO. SPA dominated every game they played, even the game they lost to SUI.

Not even close. SPA 2010 >>> ITA 2006

Most commentators are saying SPA is the deserving champion. This was not clear in 2006. ITA had to beat FRA on penalty kicks.

Italy wrote the book on diving.

More proof? I got out-thanked on you 6-1 on this point!

[Cecil Terwilliger]

Originally Posted by troutman

Biased? You seem to have a big case of sour grapes.

It's simplistic to look at goals for and against. How about quality of opponent? Possession?

Italy was outplayed by USA, AUS and FRA last time IMO. SPA dominated every game they played, even the game they lost to SUI.

Not even close. SPA 2010 >>> ITA 2006

Most commentators are saying SPA is the deserving champion. This was not clear in 2006. ITA had to beat FRA on penalty kicks.

Italy wrote the book on diving.

More proof? I got out-thanked on you 6-1 on this point!

Italy was not outplayed by any of those teams. They scored 2 good goals in the final compared to France's zero. France carried the play late in the second half and in extra time but that hardly makes them the better team considering it should have been 2-0 for the Italians.

Spain lost a game, something Italy did not. Also, Italy gave up exactly 0 goals in the 06 WC. Only an OG and a bogus penalty in the final that came as a result of a guy who wasn't even touched by the Italian defender.

Either admit you have a serious bias or that you just don't know anything about football. That was a very good squad that the azzurri had in 06. Also, if the final yesterday taught us anything it is that Italy aren't the worst divers, even if they are among the most prevalent..

As for Spain being the worst WC champs of all time, I think that is a stretch as well. No one wins the WC by accident and I'm sure there have been weaker teams win in the early inceptions of the tourney.

[Pastiche]

In my mind there's no question that Italy was an inferior team to Spain. Spain mind you was effectively missing their top striker which would explain some of their lack of goal scoring. In the end it comes down to just watching them play. They were dangerous every game. They possessed the ball better than anyone in the tournament and showed real panache to score. When they met the second best team in the tournament (Germany) they pretty much dismantled them. Germany rolled through almost every opponent up to meeting Spain and were thoroughly beaten going by the tale of the tape.

Spain are worthy winners. Much more worthy than that sad-sack Italian team of divers, complainers and poor sportsmen. Winning > winning the penalty kick competition.

[troutman]

Originally Posted by Cecil Terwilliger

Italy was not outplayed by any of those teams. They scored 2 good goals in the final compared to France's zero. France carried the play late in the second half and in extra time but that hardly makes them the better team considering it should have been 2-0 for the Italians.

Spain lost a game, something Italy did not. Also, Italy gave up exactly 0 goals in the 06 WC. Only an OG and a bogus penalty in the final that came as a result of a guy who wasn't even touched by the Italian defender.

Either admit you have a serious bias or that you just don't know anything about football. That was a very good squad that the azzurri had in 06. Also, if the final yesterday taught us anything it is that Italy aren't the worst divers, even if they are among the most prevalent..

As for Spain being the worst WC champs of all time, I think that is a stretch as well. No one wins the WC by accident and I'm sure there have been weaker teams win in the early inceptions of the tourney.

Let's do a poll then.

SPA are Euro and World Champions. Were ranked #1 by FIFA. What rank did ITA have going into 2006?

[GirlySports]

Originally Posted by troutman

Biased? You seem to have a big case of sour grapes.

It's simplistic to look at goals for and against. How about quality of opponent? Possession?

Italy was outplayed by USA, AUS and FRA last time IMO. SPA dominated every game they played, even the game they lost to SUI.

Not even close. SPA 2010 >>> ITA 2006

Most commentators are saying SPA is the deserving champion. This was not clear in 2006. ITA had to beat FRA on penalty kicks.

Italy wrote the book on diving.

More proof? I got out-thanked on you 6-1 on this point!

Passing 100 times is not domination. And then the one team Holland that stands up to them, Spain flop like crazy. I'm shocked Iniesta was able to score the winning goal cause it looked like every bone in his body was broken.

But to totally dismiss Italy's championship and praise Spain's is harsh I think. They both played defensively solid. If Italy had played exactly like Spain this tournament, they'd have been dissed again. Why does Spain get a free ride? And I friggin hate the way Italy, and Spain play the same, even worse.

The difference between Spain's championship and Italy's is 3 minutes.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by Pastiche

In my mind there's no question that Italy was an inferior team to Spain. Spain mind you was effectively missing their top striker which would explain some of their lack of goal scoring. In the end it comes down to just watching them play. They were dangerous every game. They possessed the ball better than anyone in the tournament and showed real panache to score. When they met the second best team in the tournament (Germany) they pretty much dismantled them. Germany rolled through almost every opponent up to meeting Spain and were thoroughly beaten going by the tale of the tape.

Spain are worthy winners. Much more worthy than that sad-sack Italian team of divers, complainers and poor sportsmen. Winning > winning the penalty kick competition.

People have to stop doing this and quit fellating the divers.

Possession doesnt mean anything. Its like hockey's '+/-' stat. Spain 'dominated possession.' Great. How much did they accomplish with it? Not a whole hell of a lot.

Being able to keep the ball is one thing, actually doing something with it is very much another.

Spain won very much the same way Italy won, they dived their way to the top and Iniesta was the worst cuplrit.

[Cecil Terwilliger]

Originally Posted by troutman

Let's do a poll then.

SPA are Euro and World Champions. Were ranked #1 by FIFA. What rank did ITA have going into 2006?

What would that prove? Why would it even matter? We aren't debating who is better, we are debating if Italy is the worst. You said Italy are the worst champions of all time. I think that is beyond laughable.

Most hated doesn't equal worst team.

[troutman]

Originally Posted by Cecil Terwilliger

What would that prove? Why would it even matter? We aren't debating who is better, we are debating if Italy is the worst. You said Italy are the worst champions of all time. I think that is beyond laughable.

Most hated doesn't equal worst team.

GS said Spain was the worst champion.

Who was a worse champion than Italy? Maybe Uruguay, England, a long time ago?

[troutman]

Originally Posted by Locke

Spain won very much the same way Italy won, they dived their way to the top and Iniesta was the worst cuplrit.

People call me biased. LOL!

[Phaneuf3]

Originally Posted by troutman

People call me biased. LOL!

I'm confused. Are you saying Spain didn't dive like crazy in the final?

[GirlySports]

Spain were worse. I'd argue Brazil 94 was worse. Brazil 94 was mindnumbingly boring other than that crazy game against the Dutch. 1-0 against US, 1-0 against Sweden then 0-0 against a beaten up Italy team that had to travel across the country on 3 days rest.

You bring up Italy against USA and AUS and France but they crushed their other opponents. They came out of a much tougher group (CZE, GHA, USA) and they beat a game Australian team with 10 men (and a dive). And they crushed UKR in the QF in about 15 minutes, they let up or it would have been worse than 3-0. And they beat GERMANY IN GERMAMY! That alone make them worthy winners. And battled back from a bogus penalty 7 minutes into the FINAL!

[Cecil Terwilliger]

Originally Posted by troutman

GS said Spain was the worst champion.

Who was a worse champion than Italy? Maybe Uruguay, England, a long time ago?

I disagree with GirlySports. I have only followed the WC since 94 and I know Italy in 06 was a very good team. I couldn't even begin to rank the winners since 94 and that is only 5 teams. To try and rank all 19 winners would be insane and pointless.

Suffice to say I think Spain are no more or less deserving than anyone else. They won, diving or not, and nobody else is able to say that. Champions are champions. This isn't about who is the best team because sometimes the best team doesn't win.

Others might disagree and say that the WC winner is by default the best team. Is the Stanley Cup winner always the best team in the world? WHo knows and who cares.

Spain are WC champs for the next 4 years. I don't think there is anything wrong with debating the best champs of all time, or the worst, but I certainly don't find it meaningful in any way. That does not prevent me from defending any ridiculous statements like "Italy are the worst champs ever". Not only is it unquantifiable but there is little evidence to support it anyway.

[troutman]

Originally Posted by Phaneuf3

I'm confused. Are you saying Spain didn't dive like crazy in the final?

And how is that different than nearly every other team in the world?

Are drop kicks to the chest not worthy of red cards? NED played a bruising game.

[troutman]

Originally Posted by Locke

Possession doesnt mean anything. Its like hockey's '+/-' stat. Spain 'dominated possession.' Great. How much did they accomplish with it? Not a whole hell of a lot.

Being able to keep the ball is one thing, actually doing something with it is very much another.

Tell me then why GER and NED changed their tactics vs. Spain? They were intimidated, and played more conservatively.