Raptors 09/10 season thread

[Flickered Flame]

Originally Posted by fleury

I had a total love/hate with the Raps this season and I think most here did too. You hope and hope they'll make the playoffs, then at the end, I was kinda hoping they'd fall flat on thier face so that Colangelo can seriously realize that Hedo and Bargnani need to go for guys who'll play harder and will put up crunch and consistent points. Those two have been a major part of this teams' failure and I can't imagine the team building around them if Bosh goes.

You seem to know much more than I do about the Raptors so do they realistically have a chance at signing Bosh to a new contract? I don't follow all that closely but from what I gathered if they missed the playoffs, he was as good as gone.

[Machiavelli]

I believe Bargs will be part of this organization for the foreseeable future.

[malcolmk14]

Originally Posted by Flickered Flame

You seem to know much more than I do about the Raptors so do they realistically have a chance at signing Bosh to a new contract? I don't follow all that closely but from what I gathered if they missed the playoffs, he was as good as gone.

I don't necessarily follow the Raptors too closely but I follow basketball very closely in general. I would be very, very surprised of Chris Bosh stayed in Toronto. It's not impossible, but if I were a betting man I would have him going somewhere else.

The Raptors should have moved him at the deadline.

[Ziggy Lidstrom]

Bosh is out...

The team is in rebuild with bargs, turk, as the long term pieces. Calderon and Jack are here for now and the near future and wright, weems, AJ, De ro, are going to be fixtures for life sans bosh.

This was such a weird season and I hope BC can work some magic with a bosh sign and trade. I pray the raptors don't lose another bonafide star for peanuts and spare parts.

[burning_acid1]

The Raptors are going to be so weak without Bosh.

[bluejays]

I'm with Ziggy on this one. Until probably January I was thinking that Toronto had all the pieces in place that Bosh would basically sign. Now though, this team isn't winning, and after watching Bosh this year, I think he honestly just wants to win - it's not all about the money for the guy. IF he does go, which I seem to think he will now, Colangelo will have to work one hell of a deal out, because IMO, like I said earlier, it's not all about the money for Bosh, and he'll probably leave to a contender and take less money if it comes down to it in order to win. If this team is rebuilding, Jack and DeRozen are who you build around (though it's a little too early to build around DeRozen). Bargnani I'm still 100% sure, would yield a nice return given his "potential" and size (to some sucker GM who only looks at his stats and not his assertiveness). What's scary about this off-season are the quality guys on the Raps are FA's, and are sure to get substantial pay increases. How Toronto fits them under the cap with trying to re-sign Bosh, I don't know.

[I_H8_Crawford]

Raps are a lottery team without Bosh... which may not necessarily be a bad thing.

Hopefully they can pull off a sign & trade. Losing Bosh for nothing would really really hurt them.

[malcolmk14]

The rumor swirling about Bosh S&T to NY for Gallinari and Lee is intriguing.

Doesn't help their defense at all, but I like David Lee a lot.

[moon]

Originally Posted by malcolmk14

The rumor swirling about Bosh S&T to NY for Gallinari and Lee is intriguing.

Doesn't help their defense at all, but I like David Lee a lot.

Gallinari is the big, soft Euro that the team does not need but Lee would definitely fill a need on the Raptors.

I guess if you are going to lose him anyways that isn't a bad package to get back but it certainly doesn't seem to do much other than to add to an overcrowded front court.

If they could make that move coupled with moving Bargnani or Turkoglu then it would make a lot more sense but I doubt there are many takers for those two dogs.

[octothorp]

Originally Posted by malcolmk14

The rumor swirling about Bosh S&T to NY for Gallinari and Lee is intriguing.

Doesn't help their defense at all, but I like David Lee a lot.

Lee is a pretty good defender, and I've actually read some praise for Gallinari's defense, although I have yet to see it myself.
If they're able to draft a guy like Udoh (although there's a whack of PFs available this year in the Raptors range: Udoh, Davis, Whiteside, Monroe, Patterson, Vesely, Motiejunis) I'd be okay with going into next season with a rotation of:

Lee - Evans
Bargnani - Udoh
Turkoglu - Gallinari
DeRozan - Weems - Belinelli
Jack - Calderon

Probably not going to make the playoffs, but some good pieces to build around. I'd like to see what Bargnani can do as a PF every night. And it goes without saying that you make any deal that moves Turkoglu.

edit: heh, totally forgot DeRozan.

[bluejays]

I would be estatic if the Raps could get a Lee/Gallinari combo for Bosh. I fell in love with Bosh this year with his desire to win, but Lee is more or less and old-school centre who doesn't necessarily lumber up and down the court like a lot of centres. I really really really like the potential of Gallinari too. If there is one Euro that I think has serious potential, it is definitely him. The guy actually has balls, can take it to the rack, and can hit the three's if left open, but doesn't rely on it like Bargnani. I think this type of thing to way to premature to call it a "rumor", but that package would be nice to build around. Add in (if possible), Amir back, and I'd personally really like to see Richard Jefferson, and it could be a surprise team. Like others have said, Turkoglu would never be taken by anyone. Bargnani would probably have 25 teams lining up for him simply because of his numbers, but I don't think Colangelo's ego and time invested int he guy wants to get rid of him.

[Gozer]

Coangelo is the most overrated GM in pro sports.

[puckluck]

Bosh couldn't play with a broken nose? In the most important time of the year? What a baby. I hope he doesn't stay in Toronto. I'm sick of all these basketball players being so selfish. If that was any hockey player they would be playing,

[Regorium]

Originally Posted by puckluck

Bosh couldn't play with a broken nose? In the most important time of the year? What a baby. I hope he doesn't stay in Toronto. I'm sick of all these basketball players being so selfish. If that was any hockey player they would be playing,

I think it was a broken orbital bone or jaw or something. A bit more serious than the nose.

[moon]

Originally Posted by fleury

Add in (if possible), Amir back, and I'd personally really like to see Richard Jefferson, and it could be a surprise team.

I don't know that would be a soft, soft team with no alpha dog and no crunch time scorer in a league dominated by both those things.

I don't think that team is any worse than they are now but still no threat at all to any legit team and at best a 7/8 seed.

Bargnani would probably have 25 teams lining up for him simply because of his numbers, but I don't think Colangelo's ego and time invested int he guy wants to get rid of him.

Bargnani might have 25 teams lining to get for 25 cents on the dollar but nobody is going to give up anything for value for him numbers or not. Scouting is too good nowadays for people not to see that he is third banana at best for a decent team.

[puckluck]

Originally Posted by Regorium

I think it was a broken orbital bone or jaw or something. A bit more serious than the nose.

Still he looked fine today and could have worn a face shield. Maybe i'm being a little to critical.

[Gozer]

I don't have a link, but it's my understanding that Bosh required surgery to put his face back together.
Playing was not an option.

If you want to direct some vitriol at a player, try Turk. Not just that he sucked all year, but the early intentional fouls against elite SFs, milking injuries, and lax attitude really held the team back.

[Ziggy Lidstrom]

Yeah, there was no way he could return with surgery like that required.

I feel they didn't need bosh to play there but had the opportunity to prove to themselves that they could band together and win despite. What we saw as a result is long been deceased, autopsied, buried and waked.

The squad is in need of something that Octo was stating. Another defensive big with potential would really start the transition to a respectable squad once again. IMO, Defense and Intimidation are solid foundations to build a franchise upon. It's like how LA seems to turn it on every year around this time. How Boston did the same the first year of the tranny triumvirate(KG is a b!tch, pierce is a soccer player). After you build strong group of defensive bigs then you address the speed/size/talent rations of the wings and backcourt.

Chi is a good example of keeping the right fruits from being so moribund for so long. They traded TT, EC, and kept Noah then reacquired miller who gets little burn. Noah and Rose are solid fruits to have reaped from their run of mediocrity.

It seems that in the NBA since so few guys(less than 12 people, six tops per side) actually impact a game that having two reliable yet complimentary pieces goes a long way for a squad if combined with a coaching system that has solid defensive principles. Looking at the examples today and yesterday, should give BC a clear direction for tomorrow.

Seemingly, being terrible is the only way to be great in any sport nowadays, so trade bosh and be a lottery team until the right pieces are assembled to see this team be a real contender. This 8th seed business is so meaningless in the grand scheme of things, what good would it be to be bounced by top seeds time after time.

[bluejays]

Few interesting things I read into today's press conference. Firstly, the more obvious strong signal that Calderone is going to be packaged in a deal. If I were to be a betting man, I don't think Colangelo is going to be dealing up in the draft, but rather may package him with the pick. I'm not even certain Jack is the PG for the "championship run" down the road as he's not the very best distributor (more of a SG skillset with better dribbling), but he's done alright this year, and likely the PG for the nearer future (not really a problem to address now). The second thing I noticed was much more subtle and it was moreso the tone of how Colangelo said it - Bosh is gone if he expects Colangelo to get a star in a deal to make Bosh stay.

"(It) depends on what he is looking to achieve out of free agency. There's been talk he wants to be a No. 1 guy ... we have that. If he's content being a No. 2, there's other options for him."

My personal opinion is that Bosh is right - you have to have that all-star scorer to have a lick of a chance. Colangelo probably did some quick digging around to see what was available in the past few days and didn't see anything available and knows he can't satisfy Bosh's demand. One thing Colangelo is very good at doing is preparing the public for something before it happens, and there's a very good chance Bosh is a goner if he doesn't like Colangelo running the show, but boy does Colangelo have to tread carefully. I can't imagine the team building around Turkoglu or Bargnani. At least with Turk, he's shown that if he has a foot up his bum he'll produce. Bargnani though still relatively young, cracked under Mitchell's pressure, and has been wildly inconsistent under the laissez-faire Triano. Under who can the guy produce on a consistent basis and just as important, who can teach him to be aggressive? I don't know what happens now, but this team does not look good if Bosh flat-out walks. If he does though, I think the best thing to do for the future of the team is to deal Bargnani for that defensive centre to build around, along with Demar.

[Gozer]

Originally Posted by fleury

Bargnani though still relatively young, cracked under Mitchell's pressure, and has been wildly inconsistent under the laissez-faire Triano. Under who can the guy produce on a consistent basis and just as important, who can teach him to be aggressive? I don't know what happens now, but this team does not look good if Bosh flat-out walks. If he does though, I think the best thing to do for the future of the team is to deal Bargnani for that defensive centre to build around, along with Demar.

As resident Bargs apologist, I think trading him is a bad idea.