What if Sam Bennett has another good playoff performance?

[theslymonkey]

I watch this team play and I have this feeling that the player we lose to the Kraken is Mangi. I don't see a scenario where the Flames leave a top three center unprotected especially when they can be shifted to the wing. Mony and Backs are locks at Center. Johnny and Chucky are the locks at Wing. Lindy, Benny and Dube are all centers who easily can play wing. If Mangi is the guy who leaves, then Benny or Benny can play 3C or second line wing with Backs. It's sad for me to say, but I just don't see Tre exposing Dube in any scenario and Benny at center seems to be working.

[sa226]

Eric D had a good take the other day on the radio. Essentially saying that when all is said and done this season what do you tell Sam Bennett in his exit meeting and throughout the summer? This isn't a one off, you can arguably say that in every playoffs he has played in he is one of, if not the teams best player. Its a trend not an anomaly. How can he look so lost for 80ish games and then play so well?

Maybe his assignment over the summer is to work on his focus. Hire a mental coach or something so that he can be effective in the regular season. Bennett plays a punishing style that is hard to play for 82 games. But if he can bring it for 30 to 50 games thats pretty good. Not many players in the league are playing at the top of their games for 82.

I thought it was an interesting point to bring up. How can you consistently raise your level so much higher and there not be a reason for the crazy breadth in performance.

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[SeanCharles]

Originally Posted by sa226

Eric D had a good take the other day on the radio. Essentially saying that when all is said and done this season what do you tell Sam Bennett in his exit meeting and throughout the summer? This isn't a one off, you can arguably say that in every playoffs he has played in he is one of, if not the teams best player. Its a trend not an anomaly. How can he look so lost for 80ish games and then play so well?

Maybe his assignment over the summer is to work on his focus. Hire a mental coach or something so that he can be effective in the regular season. Bennett plays a punishing style that is hard to play for 82 games. But if he can bring it for 30 to 50 games thats pretty good. Not many players in the league are playing at the top of their games for 82.

I thought it was an interesting point to bring up. How can you consistently raise your level so much higher and there not be a reason for the crazy breadth in performance.

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This postseason has everything to do with the situation he is being put in.

Keep him at C and play him with Dube next season and he will have a good regular season, I have no doubt.

[schteve_d]

Sam Bennett is one of the guys I have always quietly rooted for and held out hope that he was going to have a breakout season, season after season. I was starting to lose hope this season, finally, and was starting to think it was time to give up on him as he was just never going to materialize into the player we hoped that he would be. Maybe he still won't, but these playoffs prove that it is in him. For whatever reason, he needs a little more work put into from the coaches than some other players but when handled correctly he can be a force.

One thing I have always got on him about was taking bad penalties. He still does once in a while but it really seems like he is taking some soft ones in these playoffs. Not to his fault, I mean the officials seem to be calling some really weak calls on him specifically. I'm not sure if he has some sort of target on his back with the officials? It almost seems that way. Maybe he's a dick to them on the ice or something? I'm kidding, but it seems like he is taking penalties that almost every other player in the league would get away with.

I also can't help but wonder how much of an effect, in a positive way, that Lucic is having on Sam's game. Whether it's that playing bigger when you play with the big man feeling or if Lucic is actively teaching Bennett what it takes to play that kind of game at this level. If so, chalk up another advantage in the Lucic/Neal debate.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by New Era

So let a guy slide for 82 games because he "might" turn it on in the post season?

Slide?

Sam Bennett has had a lot of regular season warts but effort and sliding isn't one of them.

6th in the forwards for shots/60
5th in xG/60
5th in shot attempts/60
7th in scoring chances/60

3rd in xGF%
4th in scoring chance splits

and 11th in on ice shooting percentage (which isn't just the player but all players he's on the ice with)

That looks like a middle six guy with bad puck luck if it didn't happen every year.

The guy can't finish, and when he's out there his teammates don't finish. We've debated this for years about whether he ever will. But the guy certainly doesn't coast through the regular season doing nothing.

[Joborule]

I think for those saying that Bennett is showing up in the playoffs, but doesn't show this in the regular season are not accounting for the biggest reason his regular season stats are underwhelming. You can't bring up those stats, without accounting for him having ####ty linemates, and a extremely short leash in general. The one season he had decent stats? His rookie season, when he had a coach give him legitimate opportunities, and adequate linemates.

And just because it's post season, doesn't mean that Bennett is getting away with stuff he doesn't get away with in the regular season. I disagree that Bennett is getting away with more stuff. The penalties that Bennett takes in the regular season are well deserved penalties where he's trying to do too much. He would hook and interfere a lot, but in the playoffs, I haven't seen much instances of him doing something that would be called if it wasn't the playoffs. He's primarily making more use of his body. And aside from the intensity increasing, I think he has more trust in his linemates, and is more comfortable in knowing his position in the lineup/opportunities he'll be getting, that he's not trying to do too much away from the puck.

Bennett is thriving in these playoffs mostly because he gets to play his style of game, and gets to CONSISTENLY have competent linemates that can press the play, or finish themselves. This is why he's getting results both 5 on 5 and on the PP. You water a plant, you watch it grow.

After these playoffs, there's absolutely no reason why Bennett shouldn't be solidified as a player that plays consistently within the top 9 of the lineup as a centre primarily. He can produce if he doesn't have anchors holding him down, and having to be the one to do everything on the line to try and generate results, with very limited ice time. I actually think that it may be worth looking at how a line with Tkachuk-Bennett would look along with Mangiapane/Dube. Backlund isn't getting any younger, and if Bennett on the second line can be a very productive scoring line, Backlund can then be a strong 3 line centre, where the line can be a good shutdown line, that can still get the puck in.

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by Bingo

The guy can't finish

In his career, Bennett has an aggregate 73.27 expected goals and has scored 74 actual goals. He can finish just fine. Nor is that expected goals a low number considering his lack of icetime, PP time, and it's not as if he's getting backdoor feeds by Wayne Gretzky, he's usually the one driving his line, whether that's regular season or playoffs. Some star forwards might overproduced their expected goals but they're also playing alongside elite talent.

His 2017-18 season was definitely on the wrong side of the finish equation - but he's not the only guy to have a bad season finishing.

[ForeverFlameFan]

If the Flames are nowhere near being a contender next season, I wouldn’t mind having a GM pay a premium to grab Bennett. Playoff Bennett unfortunately isn’t consistent enough. If he was then he’d be an untouchable.

[FlamesAreOne]

@DarrenWHaynes

Since winning the Stanley Cup in 1989, here's your Mount Rushmore of leading playoff goal scorers for the #Flames:
1. Jarome Iginla, 28
2. Theo Fleury, 24
3. Joe Nieuwendyk, 17
4. Sam Bennett, 11

[Calgary4LIfe]

I am sure that there will be more teams inquiring about Bennett in the off-season, but if I am Treliving, this will be my usual response:


"You can pry Sam Bennett from my cold, dead hands."


How about for an over-payment? Depends what an over-payment is. It better be a heck of an over-payment. This is what makes players 'untouchable'. There isn't a single player in the league that is untouchable now after we all saw Gretzky traded decades ago. What it takes is an over-payment.



Again, if I am Treliving I am keeping a close eye on which players are bringing it every night, and I am going to try and find ways to help them succeed next season and hopefully next playoffs.


Bennett is a guy that will do anything and everything to help his team win. He wants to win. He WANTS to hurt the opposition because they are trying to stop his team from winning. He WANTS to score or help his team mates score. He WANTS to get back on defence to help his team mates stop the other team from scoring. He just wants to win.


I was upset at losing Ferland in that trade - he was another player that was willing to do whatever it took to win in the playoffs, and he made this team more difficult to play against - more difficult to WIN against. That's Bennett right now. That's also Dube - obviously not as physical - but he is doing whatever he can every shift. That's Lucic too. That's Mangiapane. That's Brodie too IMO. I would say that it is also Talbot - he may have been really lucky with the posts and with Dallas missing wide-open nets that players can only dream about every night, but I will say this about him - I haven't seen him 'give up' on any pucks yet. His second and third efforts can always be counted on, regardless of how good he has been.


You want to win a cup? Put together a team that really wants to win and will do everything they can. That was the 2004 Flames up and down that lineup. It is a good chunk of this team - I may be too harsh on some players and forgetting some plays that they have made, but for the most part, the players mentioned are the only ones that are willing to do whatever it takes to win and don't want to take a shift off.


Does this mean that everyone else on the team doesn't care to win? That they don't actually WANT to win the Stanley Cup? Of course not - I am sure that every single player on the Flames' team (and on Dallas, and on all the other teams as well) want to win the cup. However, not every other player is AS COMMITTED to winning, to do whatever it takes, to practically kill themselves to get that W every night.



There is no one on the team that I can honestly say that the Flames just HAVE to keep - and that includes Bennett. However, if I am making the decisions, I want to keep and reward the players who carry this team on their back, who are willing to step up every single night and push this team closer to winning the cup even if there are team mates that are kicking and screaming. That's the team I want, so those are the players that I would loathe to trade for anything other than ridiculous over-payments, and those are the players that I will be trying to find more of - especially the players who have a track record of doing just that every playoffs.


Sam Bennett is not a God. Sam Bennett is not the second coming of Gretzky. Sam Bennett is not this team's first line centre. However, Sam Bennett sure seems like the player on this team that seems to want to win the most, and he is the player that seems to also be trying the hardest, and just as importantly, Sam Bennett is the player that is having the greatest impact and pushing this team to win.


I can really, really see the similarities between him and Gilmour, or even one of my all-time favourite Flames - Gary Roberts.


Would I trade Sam Bennett? Yep, nobody on 'my team' is untouchable. Sam Bennett is the heart and soul of this team - so if you are not ready to cut out your own heart and throw in your soul, then don't even bother. --- That's the reply I would give out to every GM asking me about Bennett if I was Treliving.

[ComixZone]

^^ by all accounts (well, Friedman's), other teams have been calling on Benny for years. Tree has rightfully kept the player, and (in my eyes) he's going to look like a genius going forward for doing so. I think Sam Bennett SHOULD be the heart and soul of this team, and he should be part of the leadership group going forward - but he hasn't been as of yet, as the miserably incompetent coaches we've had up until this year never set a role/developed Bennett into a role. Clearly, Ward has paved a road for Bennett (and he should be commended for it), and Benny is rewarding that by hauling ass down it. I think we'll see a bigger role for Benny as this team moves forward.

[Enoch Root]

Think about the message it sends to the team if the organization trades Bennett after these playoffs. You want to be the best and hardest working forward on the team? Out you go.

Yeah, that's exactly what the Flames need.

[transplant99]

So fir those saying that "all Sam needs/needed this whole time, is better line mates"....

WELL DUH!!

Is that not true of EVERY player who isn't elite?

It's just a weird argument. Of course a player will be better playing with better players.

That aside and full credit to him, he is bringing all the physicality etc that he shows glimpses of during the season in a large way at the time of year its needed the most. The problem with him, is that stuff is needed DURING the season as well as part of a group that actually makes the playoffs. So that's the dichotomy with him...what is he worth if he really doesnt do much during the season to help the get in? (which means more wear and tear on the others on the club who you need to win in the post season)

I heard the other day there were 132 (i think it was..something like that) players who produced more offensively than he did this past regular season....who made less money than he did. And this is hardly an anomily based on his entire history.

Now, maybe this time will be different and he carries it to regular season play, at least to some degree.

One more year to find out i suppose as he is signed for that 2.55 already, but if he reverts to his 25 point self....then what? They either have to qualify him again at that inflated price or let him walk....he also has arb rights.

I dont think its a slam dunk you keep him no matter what like some are saying, because you cant just ignore history on the basis of 2 good playoff seasons recently.

I dunno...he is certainly a guy i would want on my team because of his style of play and his intangibles but you just cant be spending 2.5 M on a guy who does so little to help you win in the regular season. (Particularly this club who has cap issues as it is)

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by transplant99

I dunno...he is certainly a guy i would want on my team because of his style of play and his intangibles but you just cant be spending 2.5 M on a guy who does so little to help you win in the regular season. (Particularly this club who has cap issues as it is)

As I said earlier he's being paid a million dollars more than the best 4th line winger in the league.

It's pretty easy to make up a million bucks in intangibles and out of the box playoff performances.

[foshizzle11]

Originally Posted by SeanCharles

This postseason has everything to do with the situation he is being put in.

Keep him at C and play him with Dube next season and he will have a good regular season, I have no doubt.

Came here to say this, absolutely keep those two together and Lucic as long as he keeps doing what he is doing. Bennett likes playing centre, so why not keep him there? Maybe having him play some PP on the regular will help build confidence as well, selling on him now is a mistake IMO. Watch him leave and go to a 2nd line somewhere else playing centre and he flourishes, it would be silly to let that happen.

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by Bingo

As I said earlier he's being paid a million dollars more than the best 4th line winger in the league.

It's pretty easy to make up a million bucks in intangibles and out of the box playoff performances.

I disagree.

This club needs value on deals moving forward. This is not that.

When, on average, every other team has 4 guys outscoring him for less money....well that is a TON to make up with intangibles etc.

Doesn't mean if they can find some value elsewhere that Bennett becomes an issue at his current cost, but it better be decided before next June (or whenever next offseason occurs) which means he better at least perform up to his salary level in the regular season.

[SeanCharles]

Originally Posted by transplant99

I disagree.

This club needs value on deals moving forward. This is not that.

When, on average, every other team has 4 guys outscoring him for less money....well that is a TON to make up with intangibles etc.

Doesn't mean if they can find some value elsewhere that Bennett becomes an issue at his current cost, but it better be decided before next June (or whenever next offseason occurs) which means he better at least perform up to his salary level in the regular season.

Well I say let’s give him a chance to do that next year and enjoy the playoff ride right now.

No need to discuss trading him at this point in time IMO.

[Reign of Fire]

Originally Posted by transplant99

I disagree.



This club needs value on deals moving forward. This is not that.



When, on average, every other team has 4 guys outscoring him for less money....well that is a TON to make up with intangibles etc.



Doesn't mean if they can find some value elsewhere that Bennett becomes an issue at his current cost, but it better be decided before next June (or whenever next offseason occurs) which means he better at least perform up to his salary level in the regular season.

No one celebrates regular season champs.

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[ComixZone]

Originally Posted by transplant99

I disagree.

This club needs value on deals moving forward. This is not that.

When, on average, every other team has 4 guys outscoring him for less money....well that is a TON to make up with intangibles etc.

Doesn't mean if they can find some value elsewhere that Bennett becomes an issue at his current cost, but it better be decided before next June (or whenever next offseason occurs) which means he better at least perform up to his salary level in the regular season.

To me, this team needs guys who care about winning and perform at the most important time of the year. I should rephrase that - this team needs more guys who can execute at the most important time of the year. I’m sure others care, but they seem to struggle hugely when the stakes get raised.

This team needs less money tied up in players who vanish during key times. Give Bennett the ice time/role he’s actively earning right now and he’ll prove he’s pretty damn good value - and we have next season to see that come to fruition, so no risk there.

Bennett has 7 points in 8 playoff games while playing 4-6 minutes less per game than others who have produced similarly/more around the league. Ignore that type of production during key times at your own peril.

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by Reign of Fire

No one celebrates regular season champs.

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Or teams that fail to make the playoffs.