[Trade] Tkachuk (8 yrs x $9.5 mil) + `25 4th to FLA for Huberdeau, Weegar, Schwindt & `25 1st

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by Funkhouser

I agree in the short term, but the Panthers also avoided $17M for Huberdeau/Weegar. So, starting next season, they get the younger star + and extra ~$8M cap space to spend on the market.

Cap space has value, but I agree that this season they are worse off. We will see going forward.

They will spend that to replace them with worse players... Tkachuk already took 9.5. Also they could have kept them for less than what the Flames paid.

I guess it depends if you think Tkachuk is actually a 100 point star player...I don't.

[CalgaryFan1988]

I don't get this from the Panthers perspective cap-wise either.

This season they would have paid less for Huberdeau and Weegar combined (9.15) than Tkachuk (9.5).

Next season they have Hornqvist, Gudas, Darling coming off the books and Yandle (buyout relief) and could have afforded to give Huberdeau and Weegar raises while keeping their core together. Instead they are 3.3M over the cap with worse defense.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by CalgaryFan1988

I don't get this from the Panthers perspective cap-wise either.

This season they would have paid less for Huberdeau and Weegar combined (9.15) than Tkachuk (9.5).

Next season they have Hornqvist, Gudas, Darling coming off the books and Yandle (buyout relief) and could have afforded to give Huberdeau and Weegar raises while keeping their core together. Instead they are 3.3M over the cap with worse defense.

And spent numerous firsts adding rentals for a win window only to move their own value rentals to diminish their window for next season.

[bax]

Originally Posted by CalgaryFan1988

I don't get this from the Panthers perspective cap-wise either.

This season they would have paid less for Huberdeau and Weegar combined (9.15) than Tkachuk (9.5).

Next season they have Hornqvist, Gudas, Darling coming off the books and Yandle (buyout relief) and could have afforded to give Huberdeau and Weegar raises while keeping their core together. Instead they are 3.3M over the cap with worse defense.

The trade doesn’t make them better this season, but probably extends their window to contend with their current core. Zito is basically playing the age curve game.

It’s not the worst plan in the world, but it badly contradicts the previous moves he has made giving up picks for rentals.

They have a really great core, but they aren’t championship caliber yet IMO. Their defense needs a lot of work and now they are really short on picks.

[Jay Random]

Originally Posted by bax

It’s not the worst plan in the world, but it badly contradicts the previous moves he has made giving up picks for rentals.

Almost feels like someone in the owner's suite lost a game of chicken.

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by CalgaryFan1988

I don't get this from the Panthers perspective cap-wise either.

This season they would have paid less for Huberdeau and Weegar combined (9.15) than Tkachuk (9.5).

Next season they have Hornqvist, Gudas, Darling coming off the books and Yandle (buyout relief) and could have afforded to give Huberdeau and Weegar raises while keeping their core together. Instead they are 3.3M over the cap with worse defense.

I think we can assume that the Panthers weren’t comfortable with the contracts that Huberdeau and Weegar would require, nor did they simply want to have them play out their contracts.

[Scroopy Noopers]

Originally Posted by CalgaryFan1988

I don't get this from the Panthers perspective cap-wise either.

This season they would have paid less for Huberdeau and Weegar combined (9.15) than Tkachuk (9.5).

Next season they have Hornqvist, Gudas, Darling coming off the books and Yandle (buyout relief) and could have afforded to give Huberdeau and Weegar raises while keeping their core together. Instead they are 3.3M over the cap with worse defense.

IMO they threw in the towel knowing they have a ton of young talent, more now with Tkachuk, but their biggest rival is loaded. Push that window down the line into TBay rebuild territory.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by The Cobra

I think we can assume that the Panthers weren’t comfortable with the contracts that Huberdeau and Weegar would require, nor did they simply want to have them play out their contracts.

I think that they felt that they couldn't keep both and it's pretty clear they like Tkachuk more than Huberdeau. I get it as after losing to the Lightning back to back years in the playoffs and in embarrassing fashion they felt they needed to change the makeup of their core. I tend to agree with that as teams like the Flames, Jets, and even Leafs kept their cores together for a long time and neither organization has had any playoff success. Tkachuk is a really good player and from rose colored lenses and advanced stats looks like a guy that's going to offer something different from Huberdeau. He just might but I would say Tkachuk is a player that looks a lot better via advanced stats than he does on the ice and I don't know if he's a guy that's loved in the locker room which is a problem when you fancy yourself as captain material.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

I think that they felt that they couldn't keep both and it's pretty clear they like Tkachuk more than Huberdeau. I get it as after losing to the Lightning back to back years in the playoffs and in embarrassing fashion they felt they needed to change the makeup of their core. I tend to agree with that as teams like the Flames, Jets, and even Leafs kept their cores together for a long time and neither organization has had any playoff success. Tkachuk is a really good player and from rose colored lenses and advanced stats looks like a guy that's going to offer something different from Huberdeau. He just might but I would say Tkachuk is a player that looks a lot better via advanced stats than he does on the ice and I don't know if he's a guy that's loved in the locker room which is a problem when you fancy yourself as captain material.

They won a playoff round for the first time since the mid 90s and the presidents throphy...short sighted to not bring that team back. You know who else struggled in round two multiple years? The Avs.

They had a team that could have won now...they don't have the best team in their division now and dont have the best assets moving forward either.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by dino7c

They won a playoff round for the first time since the mid 90s and the presidents throphy...short sighted to not bring that team back. You know who else struggled in round two multiple years? The Avs.

They had a team that could have won now...they don't have the best team in their division now and do t have the best assets moving forward either.

Yeah but the Avs don't have the Lightning in their division. The Lightning swept them even without their best forward this season. I can't fault them for making a big change as the Lightning aren't going anywhere.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

Yeah but the Avs don't have the Lightning in their division. The Lightning swept them even without their best forward this season. I can't fault them for making a big change as the Lightning aren't going anywhere.

See, I think this is a problem. By fixating on his rival Bill Zito has potentially, effectively made his team worse. This is the very definition of myopia.

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[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

See, I think this is a problem. By fixating on his rival Bill Zito has potentially, effectively made his team worse. This is the very definition of myopia.

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Sometimes you have to take a step back to take two steps forward. Tkachuk for Huberdeau makes them different but not necessarily worse. It's clear they did not plan on Weegar being in the mix past this coming season so they were willing to give up one year of him to attain a forward that's younger and $1 million cheaper per season that they think may be able to add something to their core in the playoffs. The verdict on this trade for them will not be decided after this upcoming season.

[dino7c]

It's still a bad deal for them...do you really think the Flames get a better offer than Huberdeau and a first? I don't

They could have moved Weegar in another deal if they wanted to move him so bad.

As for 1M per season cheaper I doubt that too...Florida could have had Huberdeau for less than Calgary paid.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by dino7c

It's still a bad deal for them...do you really think the Flames get a better offer than Huberdeau and a first? I don't

They could have moved Weegar in another deal if they wanted to move him so bad.

As for 1M per season cheaper I doubt that too...Florida could have had Huberdeau for less than Calgary paid.

If the Panthers really coveted Tkachuk the only way they were going to get him was to deal with the Flames. It's no different than overpaying a coveted player in free agency. They overpaid in a trade but got the player they coveted. I'm not exactly sure what you are arguing as the Panthers really wanted the guy and were willing to make a one year sacrifice to get him. I feel they are looking down the road more than just this coming season with this transaction. When McDavid is a year from free agency a lot of teams will overpay for him and there will be a long line of teams willing to make their team worse in the short term to get him if they have to.

[CalgaryFan1988]

I don't think dino is arguing, reads to me like you are both in agreement that Florida overpaid and a lot of us are just surprised by the amount. Thanks jeebus they did.

[jayswin]

I think most are baffled by Weegar as he's far from a throw in. He's a legit top pairing defensman. That combined with a prospect and a first is just a massive price for Tkachuk.

I get it - they maybe thought that Weeger wouldn't come back next year so from their side it's a throw in. But still, you'd think Huberdeau, prospect and a 1st would get it done and then you could get another star player or package for Weegar.

[jayswin]

A lot of people just don't follow Florida. I mean hell even here on CP yesterday I saw someone calling Weegar a 3/4 defensemen that's just a "bonus" to have, so therefore we shouldn't be too worried about extending him.

Or lots of posters not being worried about using him as our "rental" and getting his cap space at the end of the year to add a different player. This is a star player that we should be locking up before the season starts, and if he has no interest you gotta use him to acquire another star player early this season, imo

Thankfully I believe Brad is on the same line of thinking with Weegar and although I'm 95% sure he'll get a contract done before the season, I think he'll make a difficult decision and make a move if Weegar decides to play without an extension.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by CalgaryFan1988

I don't think dino is arguing, reads to me like you are both in agreement that Florida overpaid and a lot of us are just surprised by the amount. Thanks jeebus they did.

It's only a bad deal if the player doesn't work out or the team doesn't accomplish anything in future playoffs which is yet to be determined. It's a great deal for the Flames but clearly the Panthers are more than happy with it or they wouldn't have made the trade. I'm more curious about Paul Maurice as the head coach than the trade to be honest. He's not exactly the head coach I would bring in when trying to get over the hump to win a Stanley Cup.

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

It's only a bad deal if the player doesn't work out or the team doesn't accomplish anything in future playoffs which is yet to be determined. It's a great deal for the Flames but clearly the Panthers are more than happy with it or they wouldn't have made the trade. I'm more curious about Paul Maurice as the head coach than the trade to be honest. He's not exactly the head coach I would bring in when trying to get over the hump to win a Stanley Cup.

Nope, he's more of a placeholder, steady hand coach that you bring in for a rebuild and then replace with a top tier guy a few years down the road when your contention window opens.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

If the Panthers really coveted Tkachuk the only way they were going to get him was to deal with the Flames. It's no different than overpaying a coveted player in free agency. They overpaid in a trade but got the player they coveted. I'm not exactly sure what you are arguing as the Panthers really wanted the guy and were willing to make a one year sacrifice to get him. I feel they are looking down the road more than just this coming season with this transaction. When McDavid is a year from free agency a lot of teams will overpay for him and there will be a long line of teams willing to make their team worse in the short term to get him if they have to.

I'm not arguing anything...they made a poor decision though IMO.

Tkachuk is not what they think he is and they overpaid big time...McDavid!? They could have got him for less. Honestly who was going to beat Huberdeau, 1st, decent prospect.

Flames had no leverage and took them to the cleaners