[News] Tempe voters reject the Coyotes Arena and Entertainment District

[Buff]

Originally Posted by Sylvanfan

The Stars only kept part of the name as North Stars made less sense in Dallas.

Can you imagine if the Coyotes moved and only kept part of their name?

The Houston Coy


Weird.

[FlamesAddiction]

Sounds perfect actually. It "could" work, but enough challenges so that if it doesn't work, they have something external to lay the blame on. If it works, genius. If it doesn't, hey not our fault... it was the location.

[Lanny_McDonald]

Originally Posted by Buff

Can you imagine if the Coyotes moved and only kept part of their name?

The Houston Coy


Weird.

Sounds fishy.

[JBR]

I recall that they looked into the possibility of building near the Talking Stick/Salt River Fields location about 5 years ago.. There's a ton of room there and freeway access. Wondering what shelved that idea.

[Buff]

Originally Posted by Lanny_McDonald

Sounds fishy.

No. Portland Tuna would be fishy!

[Lanny_McDonald]

Originally Posted by JBR

I recall that they looked into the possibility of building near the Talking Stick/Salt River Fields location about 5 years ago.. There's a ton of room there and freeway access. Wondering what shelved that idea.

It's on tribal land.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Lanny_McDonald

It's on tribal land.

I don't think that's wehat shelved it, since they knew that going in. I think, at the time, Glendale made a stupid offer.

[powderjunkie]

Originally Posted by sureLoss

https://twitter.com/user/status/1659235847495876623

Pretty absurd to imagine what the timeline for this would be, and how many more seasons in the Mullett?

We've just seen the Raptors spend a season in Tampa...I wouldn't be surprised if we see a 1 year interim home (Kansas City?) if they can't nail down a concrete plan.

[Snuffleupagus]

Originally Posted by Lanny_McDonald

Wow, that would be an interesting location. The infrastructure around there is sketchy as is the neighborhood. Mesa has been doing a lot to improve the area, but those improvements would work against the site IMO. The ramps off US60 onto Alma School are short and quite restrictive. Southern Ave has been restricted and narrowed to make the area more approachable for foot traffic, so that's a traffic choke point. There is potential for an entertainment district around a proposed building as most of the businesses have gone toes up as the mall died and lots of pads are available on the north, east, and a few on the west of the property. Hotels are close, but nothing high end. Will be interested to see what Maricopa Community Colleges (Mesa Community College) would have to say, being on the edge of that location and them having interest in that property in the past. Some challenges in the site and some real ugly politics involved but could work.

If the fans wouldn't travel to Glendale they certainly won't travel to Mesa

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Snuffleupagus

If the fans wouldn't travel to Glendale they certainly won't travel to Mesa

Mesa is right there. 13 minutes from the airport. 20 minutes from the middle of Phoenix. 15 minutes from Scottsdale where the prime market is IMO.

[Yeah_Baby]

The Houston Blood Meridians

[powderjunkie]

Originally Posted by Yeah_Baby

The Houston Blood Meridians

The Judge would certainly be an interesting mascot...

[Lanny_McDonald]

Originally Posted by Snuffleupagus

If the fans wouldn't travel to Glendale they certainly won't travel to Mesa

The location is not far from the Tempe location. Tempe and Mesa literally butt up to each other. Instead of the confluence of 101 and 202 it would be one exit away from the confluence of 101 and US60. Considering the market they are trying to tap into is predominantly in the east valley (Scottsdale, Chandler, Gilbert, Mesa, and Queen Creek) Mesa is a pretty central location. Not as good as say Sloan Park would have been (original location before Glendale), but a decent location.

[Snuffleupagus]

Originally Posted by Lanny_McDonald

The location is not far from the Tempe location. Tempe and Mesa literally butt up to each other. Instead of the confluence of 101 and 202 it would be one exit away from the confluence of 101 and US60. Considering the market they are trying to tap into is predominantly in the east valley (Scottsdale, Chandler, Gilbert, Mesa, and Queen Creek) Mesa is a pretty central location. Not as good as say Sloan Park would have been (original location before Glendale), but a decent location.

The location is about 12k to the SE of the Tempe site and 20k from Phoenix and Scottsdale which is where most of the fans come from, It's like putting the Flames new barn in Balzac.

[Lanny_McDonald]

Originally Posted by Snuffleupagus

The location is about 12k to the SE of the Tempe site and 20k from Phoenix and Scottsdale which is where most of the fans come from, It's like putting the Flames new barn in Balzac.

Tell me you know nothing about Phoenix without telling me you know nothing about Phoenix.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Snuffleupagus

The location is about 12k to the SE of the Tempe site and 20k from Phoenix and Scottsdale which is where most of the fans come from, It's like putting the Flames new barn in Balzac.

It’s a 15 minute drive from the centre of Scottsdale. About the same as the Tempe site. And unlike Balzac, it would be in an actual city.

[Jordan!]

Originally Posted by Snuffleupagus

The location is about 12k to the SE of the Tempe site and 20k from Phoenix and Scottsdale which is where most of the fans come from, It's like putting the Flames new barn in Balzac.

Sorry bud. You have no clue what you’re talking about

Like Lanny said. The fiesta mall location would be almost equal distance from most coyotes fans in chandler, Gilbert, Scottsdale and Mesa.

Tempe probably would’ve been more valuable land wise but there were sooo many hurdles there. Site cleanup, airport. Etc.

This HAS to be secured asap but may be a blessing in disguise.

[CGY12]

Ive stated my position before but I really hope this mess is solved with the team staying. Having a home in Phoenix for the last 10/15 years, I really believe given the right arena location, hockey can do well in Phoenix. The Glendale location was such a bad idea and tough situation for anybody who lives in Mesa, Chandler, San Tan Valley areas, the east part of the Phoenix area. We would go for special occasions or if the Flames were in town, but the idea of going any other time, was a no go due to the distance. It's not exactly ideal for people living in Scottsdale either. I've been to games where it was a sold out or a strong attendance night for prime time teams, mostly on the weekend but the occasional week day games too, in Glendale. Makes you wonder what if the arena was in a way better area. Unfortunate the vote turned out the way it did, hoping Mesa is the answer. I understand the skepticism from the hockey world and fans though, seems like pulling teeth to make it work. Lots of family memories going to games, so I have the emotional attachment.

[TheScorpion]

I keep seeing people trying to compare Phoenix-area municipalities to towns around Calgary and it's just ridiculous. Mesa is absolutely nothing like Balzac. Scottsdale, Tempe, Chandler, Mesa, and Gilbert ALL surround it. There's no comparison to Calgary or really any other Canadian city except Toronto.

Whereas Glendale is way off in its own little world in the NW. No other major municipalities surrounding it.

[Lanny_McDonald]

Agreed Scorp. There is no comparison between Calgary and Phoenix. The scale just doesn't click for most people.

Calgary's urban landmass (Calgary proper) is around 240 sq miles. For future reference, Red Deer is 40 sq miles in size. Phoenix is 520 sq miles., and that is all concrete jungle. Phoenix doesn't have growth potential because it is surrounded by other municipalities or tribal lands. And that is just Phoenix. The bordering municipalities include Avondale, Glendale, Peoria, Anthem, Cave Creek/Carefree, Scottsdale, Tempe, and Chandler. This whole urban area is then constrained by reservation lands (both treaty and military), national forests, and geographic features making expansion impossible. The only directions the metro area can really expand is the far west towards Buckeye and Tonopah and to the far southeast towards San Tan Valley and Florence/Coolidge.

When you start looking at where the interest and population that would support a hockey team, you are looking at the east valley. Those areas encompass parts of Phoenix, including the most affluent neighborhoods that border Camelback, Scottsdale (184 sq miles), Tempe (40 sq miles), Chandler (65 sq miles), Gilbert (69 sq miles), Mesa (140 sq miles), and Queen Creek (40 sq miles). Yes, the area of Chandler/Gilbert/Mesa is larger than Calgary in landmass and almost equal in population. This should start to provide some scale.

From the economic standpoint the east valley is where the money is. The most affluent municipalities in the state of Arizona are mostly packed into the east valley of Phoenix. Through a combination of income and property values the top cities have been identified and Paradise Valley (NE Phoenix bordering Scottsdale) at #1 in the state (median income of $202K), Gilbert is #2 (media income of $105K), Scottsdale #3 (media income of $97K), Queen Creek is #7 (media income of $111K), and Chandler is #9 (media income of $91K).

More importantly you also have to look where the game is being played and where the grassroots of the sport are growing. For metro Phoenix the only ice to be played on are in Peoria (AZ Ice), Scottsdale (the Ice Den), SE Phoenix (AZ Ice in Arcadia), Chandler (Ice Den), Tempe/Mesa (Oceanside), Tempe (Mullet @ ASU), and Gilbert (AZ Ice). The only rink outside the east valley is out in Peoria in the far NW corner of Metro Phoenix, beyond Glendale.

The east valley is the place for the Coyotes. The Mesa site is not great IMO, but it is vastly better than Glendale and would be in the middle of where the support would be.