[PGT] Flames lose another season opener

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by Weitz

Does Brodie's fall in play coincide with moving sides? Or moving to a different pairing than a top D man in Giordano?

Neither. It has to do with playing a system that doesn't ask him to skate, make high skill plays, and push the tempo.

Also I think the flames should load up their top line better. Bennett should play instead of Ferland... I don't think a line of Versteeg-Bennett-Jagr is going to be very good, Bennett needs to play a higher pace game. These comments are with keeping the 3M line together.

This is going to come across as a bit controversial but I would be more interested in Bennett replacing Monahan on line one than Ferland. Monahan and Gaudreau don't have that on-the-rush chemistry they used to because we don't play a high-risk rush style anymore. Bennett in this responsible style of game we do play is better suited to pushing the tempo and keeping Gaudreau involved. Ferland was not the problem on line one last night.

[Ashasx]

Originally Posted by Toonage

This isn't an Anaheim situation, not even close, but how long before the media picks up on the Flames having yet to win in Edmonton's new arena and it becomes a thing?

Already a thread on HF.

[ResAlien]

We really think the precipitous decline in Brodie’s game is more related to moving sides and not a change in coach and philosophy? I guess it depends on how much you want to blame Gulutzan for Brodie’s struggles but it seems that maybe the transition from Hartley’s “system” to Gulutzan kind of mirrors the change some players saw when going from Keenan to Brent Sutter.

Of course I could be way off and all that has to be done is move him to the right and he’ll return to the player we thought he was. Anxious to see how this team looks at the 20 game mark, I’ll try to avoid any extra hot takes until then.

[bigrangy]

Originally Posted by TheKurgan

I am not an advanced stats guy but am I reading this right? Did 20 of the 45 shots Edmonton had against us last night come in the 4:01 of ice time McDavid had against Brouwer? If so, please shoot Brouwer into the SUN!

On a positive note, I thought Smith looked great. Everyone else ranged from average to really, really bad.

CF is corsi for, which includes shots, missed shots, and blocked shots.

20 corsis happened in the 4 ish minutes Brouwer was floundering about against mcdingus, but in terms of shots it was probably closer to 10 shots against. Still awful but not unbelievably awful.

[Cali Panthers Fan]

How's the suicide watch going after that one?

This is why I avoid this forum after losses, especially to Edmonton. Rationality is out the window, and nobody can put anything into context.

Listen, I saw what I wanted to see last night. I saw Mike Smith play a great game and make big saves when his team needed it. I saw Hamonic fit into his role flawlessly, and get better as the game went on. I saw a team that was playing composed and structured hockey and not panicking even though McDavid was doing his best to break down the defense single-handedly. I saw them try to play a defense-first road game, but couldn't overcome McLellan line matching advantage with McDavid's line.

I was disappointed by the effort in the offensive zone, but this team needed to improve their defense and goaltending drastically from a year ago, and I saw that tonight. The offense will come when players find their groove and get a little more comfortable. If you looked at the Oilers, nobody outside of McDavid was generating a lot of offense for pretty much the same reasons: It's early and players haven't worked out chemistry yet.

This team will score goals once they get into the full swing of the season, so it's pointless to worry about game 1, even if it IS against the Oilers. There's 81 more of these to go, and the season really is a marathon, not a sprint. The good news is that the goaltending looks rock solid and the defense pairs have solidified a lot (as long as Brodie picks his game up). I'm reasonably confident that this is going to be a pretty darn good team this year, especially with the addition of Jagr in a few days to a week.

Take a deep breath everyone.

[camm13]

Originally Posted by Weitz

Does Brodie's fall in play coincide with moving sides? Or moving to a different pairing than a top D man in Giordano?

Also I think the flames should load up their top line better. Bennett should play instead of Ferland... I don't think a line of Versteeg-Bennett-Jagr is going to be very good, Bennett needs to play a higher pace game. These comments are with keeping the 3M line together.

I agree, every team has a good 1-2 line. Right now the 3rd line is glass half empty and you hope the 4th only plays 7 mins a night. We need to inject some speed, Janko needs to be up here. I'm glad Glass beat up Kassian, but his spot could be used for another prospect.

[Toonage]

Originally Posted by Ashasx

Already a thread on HF.

Crap. This will be a thing on TSN/Sportsnet etc by the end of the year. Just something else to ask the players constantly before important games.

[Cecil Terwilliger]

Originally Posted by Toonage

Crap. This will be a thing on TSN/Sportsnet etc by the end of the year. Just something else to ask the players constantly before important games.

The media always makes a big deal out of these things, even when the "streaks" are totally meaningless.

Just last night they were saying the leafs haven't won a season opener since all the way back in 2013/2014 season. A mind blowing 0-3 in their last 3!! OMG!! That's the definition of futility.

My favorite are the ones where you can frame the situation both ways.

Leafs are 14-3 in season openers since year 2000! They're unbeatable!

Leafs are winless in home openers in 4 years! They'll never win again!

[CaptainCrunch]

Didn't like the Flames face off ability

Didn't like the Flames effort or fight level

Didn't like the Flames forecheck

Didn't like the Flames much at all last night

Did like Smith and Hamonic, that is all.

[Flash Walken]

I offer this as a rebuttal to Cali:

Team can't score, Brodie can't defend, this is 80+ games worth of sample size to go off of.

Team needs guys who score goals. Actual goal scorers. Guys 'with skill' aren't cutting it. Need goal scorers. That's what makes gio and Hamilton so effective, both of them can score. Passing it off is junk sauce. I hope jagr can actually score once he arrives, as having another guy looking to take the puck to the corner looking to pass it off isn't going to cut it.

Ending the Bennett as a centre experiment would help that I think.

Time for Tre to seriously look at moving Brodie for a scorer.

[kukkudo]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

I offer this as a rebuttal to Cali:

Team can't score, Brodie can't defend, this is 80+ games worth of sample size to go off of.

Team needs guys who score goals. Actual goal scorers. Guys 'with skill' aren't cutting it. Need goal scorers. That's what makes gio and Hamilton so effective, both of them can score. Passing it off is junk sauce. I hope jagr can actually score once he arrives, as having another guy looking to take the puck to the corner looking to pass it off isn't going to cut it.

Ending the Bennett as a centre experiment would help that I think.

Time for Tre to seriously look at moving Brodie for a scorer.

Duchene for Brodie & D prospect.

[Badgers Nose]

Smith was great. I hope he can keep that level this year and prove me wrong about him being the answer to the Flames crease problems.

I liked Hathaway and Glass. For the limited amount they played they were mostly positive.

Brouwer really looked bad on Sam’s line.

I guess McD is worth all the hype.

Loss still could not sour the day, JAGR IS A FLAME!!!

[Galakanokis]

Originally Posted by Beninho

I have to agree with Brodie, seems he relies only on his skating and when playing McDavid that's just not gonna work. He needs to be stronger in every facet, his decision making was bad last night and he looked exactly like the Brodie of last season. We have a decent sample size of him playing poorly, something needs to be fixed or he's gonna get traded. Thought he looked spineless yesterday. And for #### sakes get him off the first pp unit, the man has a muffin shot

We have left handed D prospects and i actually hope Brodie turns it around and we still trade him. He's youngish and on a good contract so I think we could get a decent return for him and look to slot Andersson in next year.

It's game 1 which we traditionally suck at so I will temper my anger but man last night was a bummer.

[Wyguy]

What I need to see from the flames in general and more specifically against the Oilers is more contact. Last night I watched the flames line players up for a hit and would just stop in front of them. McCap wasn't touched at all, which was another reason I wanted the 3M line to be against him, throw Tkachuk at David, get in his head. Glass did great last night and I was impressed with Smith. Ferland needs to go, I think he would be great with Bennett and Versteeg. I want Janko playing, don't quite no where yet though. If the Lines look something like this
JG-SM-??
Janko-Backlund-Frolik
Tkachuk-Bennett Versteeg
Glass-Stajan-Hathaway
Guess that leaves Jagr on the first line. This is why i want to do what the Hawks did, split up there best players. So it would look something like,
Tkachuk-SM-Versteeg
JG-Janko-Bennett
Frolik-Backlund-Jagr
Glass-Stajan/Lazar-Hathaway/Lazar
I think the second lines are really good, please point out anything that is wrong or any changes that should be made. But my reasoning behind it is because I think JG and SM play different games, they work well with each other but I don't see it right now. However, when you get Tkachuk with versteeg on the side of Monny I think ti would end up working very well. Plus, Bennett drives the play very nicely and the little nice moves that JG can chip in would make it so much better, Have Janko centring or Bennet, whoever you prefer. In my minds this line would be perfect, you have little JG with two big guys on his line, two move the play very well and Janko has the nice shot and can really use his body to push. Third line is just a possession line, enough said. However, with these lines, I would not give Backlund a new contract unless its very cheap (Under 4m). I hesitate to move Frolik to the Monny line, but it is an option. 4th line is actually pretty nice. And at this point, brouwer as much as I want him to be good, all I saw from him was disappointment last night. (Yes, only one game, but it was horrible). What I think this team needs is a fast player, Ik we are a fast team, but I really want a big strong really fast player. Not necessarily good with hands or maybe can't shoot the puck, but someone who is just fast. Next piece is, we have all this talent but it is all small (On the back). If we can fix that problem of our RW, I think ur next draft should focus big players. Big defence man and big players.
Thank god Smith was good last night, ill admit preseason scared the crap out of me, but last night was more then reassuring.
The next thing is GG needs to figure out what he is doing, Brouwer on the ice with the goalie pulled? Brouwer still has an A? I thought he should have been playing the Backlund line against the Drysaddle line. Also had no idea what he was doing with our defence last game.

[868904]

Originally Posted by Ashasx

So yeah, Gaudreau didn't create any offence, but his line never actually allowed a goal against. Our 1st line didn't create anything, but it was ultimately our depth that cost the game. We can't lose the depth battle when the other team has McDavid.

They didn't allow a goal because Smith bailed them out lots. The commentators even noted that the top line was defending the whole night against McDavid and that's why they weren't generating offense, this was coming from Louie Debrusk, a former NHL player and paid analyst who Oiler bias aside, is pretty good at his job.

The top line generated nothing, that's a fact. The fourth line is suppose to be outplayed by the likes of Connor McDavid.

The 3M line did nothing either. The top two lines are the ones who are paid the big bucks. if McDavid dominates against the 3rd and 4th lines, it means the Flames top two lines have to do something against the other lines.

Blaming it all on the 4th line or Tanner Glass is ridiculous. They got caught on the first goal and McDavid got a lucky bounce onto his stick. There were many other shifts where McDavid was dominating against the top two lines that Smith bailed them out on.

[Cali Panthers Fan]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

I offer this as a rebuttal to Cali:

Team can't score, Brodie can't defend, this is 80+ games worth of sample size to go off of.

Team needs guys who score goals. Actual goal scorers. Guys 'with skill' aren't cutting it. Need goal scorers. That's what makes gio and Hamilton so effective, both of them can score. Passing it off is junk sauce. I hope jagr can actually score once he arrives, as having another guy looking to take the puck to the corner looking to pass it off isn't going to cut it.

Ending the Bennett as a centre experiment would help that I think.

Time for Tre to seriously look at moving Brodie for a scorer.

I don't even entirely disagree that this team needs a few more guys who are pure goal scorers, but I think there's enough collectively to get the job done as long as you're keeping the puck out of your own net. In fact, handling your own zone effectively leads to more offensive time. What was missing last night was the transition to offense that this team has the horses for if you look at the makeup of the defense. They couldn't break out of the zone effectively, even though they were playing pretty good defense in their own zone. It got even worse once they got to the opposite blue line, as nobody could carry the puck in, and there was little in the way of a forecheck or sustained pressure. A quick turnaround, and the puck is back in your own zone. This is why we were in our own zone so much, not because the defense was particularly bad.

But I maintain that this team has the horses to score enough to be a winning team. Could we use another guy to score goals? Sure, but there's probably only a couple teams who don't need that.

If by game 20 this team is in the bottom 10 for goal scoring, then yes, make a trade. Until then, see how it plays out with this group, especially when you add Jagr to the mix.

[Ashasx]

Originally Posted by 868904

They didn't allow a goal because Smith bailed them out lots. The commentators even noted that the top line was defending the whole night against McDavid and that's why they weren't generating offense, this was coming from Louie Debrusk, a former NHL player and paid analyst who Oiler bias aside, is pretty good at his job.

The top line generated nothing, that's a fact. The fourth line is suppose to be outplayed by the likes of Connor McDavid.

The 3M line did nothing either. The top two lines are the ones who are paid the big bucks. if McDavid dominates against the 3rd and 4th lines, it means the Flames top two lines have to do something against the other lines.

Blaming it all on the 4th line or Tanner Glass is ridiculous. They got caught on the first goal and McDavid got a lucky bounce onto his stick. There were many other shifts where McDavid was dominating against the top two lines that Smith bailed them out on.

The top two lines were not good. I'm not disagreeing with you here.

But they were a hell of a lot better than anything else put out last night. At least I can say they were net negative in scoring opportunities and corsi, but they weren't as completely dominated as our depth was against the Oilers depth.

[GirlySports]

What are Gaudreau's stats on the road again? It's clear he struggles on the road when matchedup.

[Ashasx]

Originally Posted by GirlySports

What are Gaudreau's stats on the road again? It's clear he struggles on the road when matchedup.

He was better last season on the road than at home.

[northcrunk]

The Flames played a marshmallow soft game last night outside of a few players. Brouwer is done. I saw nothing positive out of him or Stajan last night. Switch up Bennett and Monahan.