China's Millionaire Migration

[blankall]

Originally Posted by afc wimbledon

There are 250,000 apartments and townhouses, again you are out in Maple Ridge or Pitt Meadows but that's not some Detroit hell hole! There are worse places to live.

Again I ain't saying it's cheap, I've told my daughter that if she's happy in Halifax she'd be nuts to move back to Vancouver but if you have to or want to live in the area it's do'able.

I also disagree that it's due to foriegn buyers, that's a small part of it but it's low interest rates and stupid buyers that are causing most of it, locals, once they're in the market don't seem to care what they pay as the money is essentially free to borrow and the idiots here think that it's just going to keep rising forever, I'm in east Van, we don't have any foriegn buyers, just a bunch of hipsters that are all using equity to buy new beamers and ducattis.

Trying to get a quote on a bathroom reno is proving a nightmare for me, builders are quoting 40 or 50,000 for a standard small bathroom job, when you push back on the price their answer is 'why do you care the money's free and your house is worth a million?' it's a market that is primed for a huge crash.

I work 10-12 hours days often. Having an 1.5 hour commute each way would be an absolute nightmare. I'd rather move to Halifax than deal with the commute to Pitt Meadows. It's not the area that's bad, it's the distance.

Like I said before, a lot of people are making that choice and simply moving out of Vancouver, and this is the point. When you have an exodus of people aged 30-50 leaving the city, it has disastrous effects on the local economy. And it's not a solution to say people should work harder or live in the suburbs for a few years. That kind of thinking only holds up in expensive places, whereas Vancouver has gone from expensive to unaffordable.

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by blankall

I work 10-12 hours days often. Having an 1.5 hour commute each way would be an absolute nightmare. I'd rather move to Halifax than deal with the commute to Pitt Meadows. It's not the area that's bad, it's the distance.

Like I said before, a lot of people are making that choice and simply moving out of Vancouver, and this is the point. When you have an exodus of people aged 30-50 leaving the city, it has disastrous effects on the local economy. And it's not a solution to say people should work harder or live in the suburbs for a few years. That kind of thinking only holds up in expensive places, whereas Vancouver has gone from expensive to unaffordable.

There is a train out to there you know, half hour into town! Park up a new west and catch the sky train if you prefer a little flexibility.
I lived out there, it really isn't that bad.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by afc wimbledon

There is a train out to there you know, half hour into town! Park up a new west and catch the sky train if you prefer a little flexibility.
I lived out there, it really isn't that bad.

It's still a nightmare if you work away from the train line. The WCE and Skytrain are adequate only in ideal situations. I actually did it from Mission for a while.

[Galakanokis]

train out to Pitt meadows/Maple Ridge doesn't run after 6pm, always a mad dash out of offices to catch that last train. From Poco into Yaletown it is almost an hour commute from doorstep to doorstep taking the westcoast express. An hour commute is really no big deal but you are no longer getting the savings you once did for moving out of Vancouver. There is really no incentive for people to stay if they have other opportunities.

[blankall]

Originally Posted by afc wimbledon

There is a train out to there you know, half hour into town! Park up a new west and catch the sky train if you prefer a little flexibility.
I lived out there, it really isn't that bad.

Last West Coast Express train leaves downtown at 6:20 PM. My work typically runs past that. The drive into New West for "flexibility" is horrendous. I drive out to South Surrey once a week, which goes the opposite way of traffic. That is bad enough at about an hour each way. However, I see what's going on in the incoming lanes, which are a total parking lot.

The issue is that the economy is not keeping up with the growth in expenses, so the government can't afford to build the infrastructure needed. Other people have spoken about cities like London and NYC as examples of how people need to commute. Those cities have massive mass transit structures that Vancouver cannot afford.

I'm not trying to build sympathy for myself. My career and that of my partner is growing at a pace we could actually afford to be "house poor". I'm not investing now, as I see the market dropping another 30% in the next two years. My bigger concern is what will happen to the city as a whole. You shouldn't need a two lawyer salary to afford a place to live. I want to have neighbourhoods and communities and live in a thriving city. I don't want to be surrounded by empty lots.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by blankall

Last West Coast Express train leaves downtown at 6:20 PM. My work typically runs past that. The drive into New West for "flexibility" is horrendous. I drive out to South Surrey once a week, which goes the opposite way of traffic. That is bad enough at about an hour each way. However, I see what's going on in the incoming lanes, which are a total parking lot.

The issue is that the economy is not keeping up with the growth in expenses, so the government can't afford to build the infrastructure needed. Other people have spoken about cities like London and NYC as examples of how people need to commute. Those cities have massive mass transit structures that Vancouver cannot afford.

I'm not trying to build sympathy for myself. My career and that of my partner is growing at a pace we could actually afford to be "house poor". I'm not investing now, as I see the market dropping another 30% in the next two years. My bigger concern is what will happen to the city as a whole. You shouldn't need a two lawyer salary to afford a place to live. I want to have neighbourhoods and communities and live in a thriving city. I don't want to be surrounded by empty lots.

What you are seeing in Vancouver and Toronto more and more are families shacking up together in one home. Buying a decent house closer to Vancouver with 4 incomes isn't the best scenario, but it beats having to commute. If you are really good friends with the other family and construct the interior with a certain amount of separation in mind , it can work.

[Fuzz]

The other issue is it is pricing out people who do things like work in healthcare and childcare. One of the reasons my brother GTFO of Van was they had a second kid on the way, and wait-lists for anything childcare related were ridiculous. It got to the point where it just wasn't worth it to be there. The entire economy could be forced to crises as these workers get forced out of the market completely.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

The other issue is it is pricing out people who do things like work in healthcare and childcare. One of the reasons my brother GTFO of Van was they had a second kid on the way, and wait-lists for anything childcare related were ridiculous. It got to the point where it just wasn't worth it to be there. The entire economy could be forced to crises as these workers get forced out of the market completely.

I know in Toronto, if you are even thinking of having a kid, you need to get on a daycare waiting list because there tend to be longer than a year. Not sure if Vancouver is the same, but it wouldn't surprise me.

[peter12]

Originally Posted by GGG

This is a very entitled comment. The single family home with a piece of land is a very rural or post depression concept. Lots of people raise families without SFH's. Its pretty insulting to call this a need.

When kids sharing a bedroom is considered a terrible burden part of our problem is that we grew up subsidized without paying the true costs for the things we had.

I am just talking about demographic trends. It is a globally recognized fact that condos don't promote fertility rates.

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by peter12

I am just talking about demographic trends. It is a globally recognized fact that condos don't promote fertility rates.

I dunno, you always here that people in condos are literally living on top of each other. You would think that would increase copulation.

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

I dunno, you always here that people in condos are literally living on top of each other. You would think that would increase copulation.

Your clearly not married.

[Fuzz]

Oh, I am. All good on that front.

[Winsor_Pilates]

Originally Posted by peter12

I am just talking about demographic trends. It is a globally recognized fact that condos don't promote fertility rates.

Any recommendations on increasing the availability of detached houses?

[Flamenspiel]

^^To start with exactly what they are doing now, 15% tax, vacancy tax, and perhaps consider monetary policy instruments as well. Right now, foreign buyers can still buy government insured mortgages, no other country allows that.

[GirlySports]

maybe a house can't be re-sold in 12 months?

[Tron_fdc]

Originally Posted by GirlySports

maybe a house can't be re-sold in 12 months?

Supposedly you can't re-sell within 12 months and claim primary residence thereby avoiding paying tax. That's what I heard though, and apparently the government isn't enforcing it.

[peter12]

Originally Posted by Winsor_Pilates

Any recommendations on increasing the availability of detached houses?

None. Vancouver is at the beginning of a demographic death spiral due to economic and political bungling. It is like Singapore but without the actual economic productivity.

There won't be a Vancouver in 80 years at this pace. Why would anyone with family or professional ambitions want to slog it out in this market? They leave.

[Galakanokis]

My company is struggling big time to fill positions, both junior and senior. We have had people from LA, NY, London and Toronto all say it is too expensive here to bring a family. We did hire a junior guy maybe making $45K a year and $1200 a month of that goes to renting a crappy apartment.

[peter12]

Originally Posted by Galakanokis

My company is struggling big time to fill positions, both junior and senior. We have had people from LA, NY, London and Toronto all say it is too expensive here to bring a family. We did hire a junior guy maybe making $45K a year and $1200 a month of that goes to renting a crappy apartment.

Yeah, rents are awful. Commutes are awful. There is a bit of a talent dearth in the city that results from all of this. There is a phenomenon in this city that I call "hot girl with nice little dog." People are almost entirely single. You do not see many children in the inner-city neighbourhoods. It is a lifestyle city, and a darn nice one, but it does not have long-term prospects.

Again, it's not a NYC or a London or a Singapore or a San Francisco as there is no significant industry that will keep attracting a high turnover of young, talented people.

It's a one-stop shop for luxury living, and that can only go on for so long.

But hey, let's build more condos.

[FlamesAddiction]

I recently turned down a job in Vancouver that was going to give me a 10% raise, but after everything, it just wasn't worth it. The mountains and ocean are only nice to look at for so long.