that's said I don't mind the Seahawks. We want characters (good and bad) in the game and want them to speak (or not) speak their minds. Made for a fun week. I mean do we really want everyone to be like Joe Flacco?
Conversely, I cannot stand the Seahawks. Okay, not true. I actually like Sherman and Lynch, for they provide us with a source of realistic entertainment with their off-field shenanigans, but seriously trying to start a fight with the opposing team after your team loses the Super Bowl just reeks of poor sportsmanship.
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Reading this post about luck with the definitive comment about Brady not being lucky to win this super bowl is so contradictory. So in short, everyone was lucky to get to the game, the fate of Brady and patriots offense was out of their hands and needed some luck to win the game...
So after all that, it turns out Brady did luck into his super bowl ring today. sort it out.
EDIT: I'll show myself out as it seems folks would love to celebrate the demise of the Seahawks or a Pats win. I'll take my Pats and Brady hate out now.
seahawks throwing a ball down deep, receiver doesnt catch it as the NE player makes a play, and then when the ball comes down on the fallen seattle player and hits him in the leg so it then goes to his hands close enough to make that catch = luck
a defender making a good play (interception) on a poor play call is not luck, it's a good play by a player to make the INT, game saving play, but nothing to do with luck.
I just heard it so I don't remember it exactly but Carroll said "we just threw the ball to waste that play cause we didn't like the match up to run the football. If it worked then good, if not, then we'd just run it on third and fourth downs."
I just heard it so I don't remember it exactly but Carroll said "we just threw the ball to waste that play cause we didn't like the match up to run the football. If it worked then good, if not, then we'd just run it on third and fourth downs."
Yeah. Why not call timeout and get the right personnel on the field.
Why not run it anyway, even if get stuffed again it runs time off.
Why not pass but throw a bootleg action where you can throw it away if needed.
Instead they run a high risk pass play. Don't think Carroll's explanation will make anyone feel better.
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Both teams played and excellent game but I mean that was just an awful and anti-climactic final play. Seahawks had a guaranteed victory and they literally threw it away.
Both teams played and excellent game but I mean that was just an awful and anti-climactic final play. Seahawks had a guaranteed victory and they literally threw it away.
just like Green Bay did 2 weeks ago.... good to see
Ok, last time in here, promise. After an hour or so of trying to process, from a Seattle standpoint, and this is going to be needed for me to talk out to prevent mental breakdown....:
Seattle holding the Pats down to 2 score in the first half, considering the defense and how quickly Brady was getting rid of the ball (by plan) negating the pash rush, was huge...as huge was Wilson hitting a big play to Matthews and then really getting into the groove with that drive at the end of the first half, I thought things were ok for Seattle. Then walking down the field and getting the FG on the opening drive of the 2nd half showed that Wilson was in the groove, which, having watched him the past 3 years, once he gets into it (it takes a while), he's very efficient.
Another Brady INT, and then another Seattle TD and in full control with Wilson looking good and Brady looking lost.
Here comes the big play which was the turning point, looking back, even though it didn't seem at the time. Late in the 3rd, Kearse has an over the shoulder catch chance on 3rd down early in the 4th...he has his hands on it but drops it. Would've set Seattle up at the 25 or so, in at least FG range to go up by at least 17. Instead a punt. Teams then both went 3 and out, but then on the second NE possession, they got back into the swing of things with the first TD.
Credit to Brady and Belichek for the game plan to get the ball out quick. They stiuck with it, and moved the ball down the field. Losing Avril on the second INT was tough on the end of the line, but outside of a sack, Seattle just had to hold serve, and they contained the run...but the Pats chipped away and then took the lead on some short dink and dunk plays, and took the lead while Seattle kept going 3 and out on offense.
Fast forward to last drive. Fantastic catch by Lynch to get 30 yards. Then a great throw and catch to Lockette to get the next first down on 3rd down.
Here's another turning point though. After that first down, Wilson took too long to snap, and had to call a timeout to avoid the delay of game penalty. That wasted timeout, IMO, haunted them and forced them to do what they did at the very end.
Anyways, where they were on the field at that point, I knew Wilson was going to throw down the field deep and did it twice. Got fortunate on the Kearse catch, but Kearse never lost sight of the ball and it bounced his way. They then had to burn another timeout after that play, a little more forgiveable since all the hub bub around that play.
Lynch then ran for 3.5 yards, down to the 1, going over 100 yards on 24 carries. Clock continued to tick.
But then the worst call in NFL football history. With only one timeout, the plan was, I think, to try and throw as a bit of deception, and at worst stop the clock...as opposed to running it, as MAYBE getting stopped (Lynch didn't get stopped for anything less than 2 yards all game) would mean they had to figure out what to do, and not have another timeout if they called the last one.
But if you're going to do that, the throw should not be to an area, since on the goal line, where there are 4 or 5 sets in of hands in there, where the ball could bounce, deflect etc off of. At very worst if going to throw, put a ball up to the back corner of the endzone to tall Matthews...putting it only where he could catch it, or it goes out of bounds and the clock stops and Seattle then can go back to the run with the clock stopped and still a timeout.
If Seattle had two timeouts, not wasting one as they did earlier uselessly later in the drive, I think they would've run Lynch that next play. If for some reason the run was stopped, call one of the timeouts, and still have one to burn, and run at least two more plays. But they only had one timeout and didn't want to risk being too predictable.
That's the only thin logic I can think of, given the one time out that they had left. But from the half yard line, even with only a single timeout, you let the Pats stop Lynch from getting a half yard, 2, probably 3 plays to win the game. Not throw a ball into a busy area as some sort of deception in a much much much riskier situation.
But there should be no overthinking...Lynch was steamrolling all game and had just run 3.5 hard yards, the ball was 1/2 yard away from a TD, the Pats were reeling from the Kearse catch and the realization they had a very good chance of losing that game. Hand it to him 1000 times out of 1000. If he's stopped again for anything less than a 6 yard loss, call a timeout and hand it to him again probably.
When I saw Lynch slide out from behind Wilson, presnap, I was instantly alarmed.
Carroll has taken responsibility this evening, and Lynch doesn't seem upset about it, but that was 95% on Bevell and 5% on Wilson for even attempting the play. He and Wilson exclusively call the plays, and while a HC can nix something, Carroll trusts his coaches and players sometimes to a fault.
Can do a lot of second guessing about that last drive, and over as long as you follow the NFL, that play will standout for most fans, and sting perpetually for Seahawks fans to be a half yard away from a back to back SB...but if 17 minutes earlier Kearse holds onto that tough catch on third down, and Seattle drains 3 or 4 more minutes of clock with a new set of downs, and kicks at least a FG to go up by 17, there may not have been the drama at the end.
Credit to Brady, Belichek and the Pats, but this will hurt for a long time for Seahawks fans.
Last edited by browna; 02-01-2015 at 10:20 PM.
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Ok, last time in here, promise. After an hour or so of trying to process, from a Seattle standing point:
Seattle holding the Pats down to 2 score in the first half, considering the defense and how quickly Brady was getting rid of the ball (by plan) negating the pash rush, was huge...as huge was Wilson hitting a big play to Matthews and then really getting into the groove with that drive at the end of the first half, I thought things were ok for Seattle. Then walking down the field and getting the FG on the opening drive of the 2nd half showed that Wilson was in the groove, which, having watched him the past 3 years, once he gets into it (it takes a while), he's very efficient.
Another Brady INT, and then another Seattle TD and in full control with Wilson looking good and Brady looking lost.
Here comes the big play which was the turning point, looking back, even though it didn't seem at the time. Late in the 3rd, Kearse has an over the shoulder catch chance on 3rd down early in the 4th...he has his hands on it but drops it. Would've set Seattle up at the 25 or so, in at least FG range to go up by at least 17. Instead a punt. Teams then both went 3 and out, but then on the second NE possession, they got back into the swing of things with the first TD.
Credit to Brady and Belichek for the game plan to get the ball out quick. They stiuck with it, and moved the ball down the field. Losing Avril on the second INT was tough on the end of the line, but outside of a sack, Seattle just had to hold serve, and they contained the run...but the Pats chipped away and then took the lead on some short dink and dunk plays, and took the lead while Seattle kept going 3 and out on offense.
Fast forward to last drive. Fantastic catch by Lynch to get 30 yards. Then a great throw and catch to Lockette to get the next first down on 3rd down.
Here's another turning point though. After that first down, Wilson took too long to snap, and had to call a timeout to avoid the delay of game penalty. That wasted timeout, IMO, haunted them and forced them to do what they did at the very end.
Anyways, where they were on the field at that point, I knew Wilson was going to throw down the field deep and did it twice. Got fortunate on the Kearse catch, but Kearse never lost sight of the ball and it bounced his way. They then had to burn another timeout after that play, a little more forgiveable since all the hub bub around that play.
Lynch then ran for 3.5 yards, down to the 1, going over 100 yards on 24 carries. Clock continued to tick.
But then the worst call in NFL football history. With only one timeout, the plan was, I think, to try and throw as a bit of deception, and at worst stop the clock...as opposed to running it, as MAYBE getting stopped (Lynch didn't get stopped for anything less than 2 yards all game) would mean they had to figure out what to do, and not have another timeout if they called the last one.
But if you're going to do that, the throw should not be to an area, since on the goal line, where there are 4 or 5 sets in of hands in there, where the ball could bounce, deflect etc off of. At very worst if going to throw, put a ball up to the back corner of the endzone to tall Matthews...putting it only where he could catch it, or it goes out of bounds and the clock stops and Seattle then can go back to the run with the clock stopped and still a timeout.
If Seattle had two timeouts, not wasting one as they did earlier uselessly later in the drive, I think they would've run Lynch that next play. If for some reason the run was stopped, call one of the timeouts, and still have one to burn, and run at least two more plays. But they only had one timeout and didn't want to risk being too predictable.
That's the only thin logic I can think of, given the one time out that they had left. But from the half yard line, even with only a single timeout, you let the Pats stop Lynch from getting a half yard, 2, probably 3 plays to win the game. Not throw a ball into a busy area as some sort of deception in a much much much riskier situation.
But there should be no overthinking...Lynch was steamrolling all game and had just run 3.5 hard yards, the ball was 1/2 yard away from a TD, the Pats were reeling from the Kearse catch and the realization they had a very good chance of losing that game. Hand it to him 1000 times out of 1000. If he's stopped again for anything less than a 6 yard loss, call a timeout and hand it to him again probably.
When I saw Lynch slide out from behind Wilson, presnap, I was instantly alarmed.
Carroll has taken responsibility this evening, and Lynch doesn't seem upset about it, but that was 95% on Bevell and 5% on Wilson for even attempting the play. He and Wilson exclusively call the plays, and while a HC can nix something, Carroll trusts his coaches and players sometimes to a fault.
Can do a lot of second guessing about that last drive, and over as long as you follow the NFL, that play will standout for most fans, and sting perpetually for Seahawks fans to be a half yard away from a back to back SB...but if 17 minutes earlier Kearse holds onto that tough catch on third down, and Seattle drains 3 or 4 more minutes of clock with a new set of downs, and kicks at least a FG to go up by 17, there may not have been the drama at the end.
Credit to Brady, Belichek and the Pats, but this will hurt for a long time for Seahawks fans.
Browna, i am not a Seahawks fan but your posts are always well written, if Wilson doesnt play well, you say he doesent play well. you call it like it is... it will be tougher for the Hawks going forward, with Wilson set to join the 20 million club and perhaps Lynch getting paid and guys like Wagner getting a new deal but Schneider is a great Gm who knows what he is doing.... should be interesting next year
Ok, last time in here, promise. After an hour or so of trying to process, from a Seattle standpoint, and this is going to be needed for me to talk out to prevent mental breakdown....:
Seattle holding the Pats down to 2 score in the first half, considering the defense and how quickly Brady was getting rid of the ball (by plan) negating the pash rush, was huge...as huge was Wilson hitting a big play to Matthews and then really getting into the groove with that drive at the end of the first half, I thought things were ok for Seattle. Then walking down the field and getting the FG on the opening drive of the 2nd half showed that Wilson was in the groove, which, having watched him the past 3 years, once he gets into it (it takes a while), he's very efficient.
Another Brady INT, and then another Seattle TD and in full control with Wilson looking good and Brady looking lost.
Here comes the big play which was the turning point, looking back, even though it didn't seem at the time. Late in the 3rd, Kearse has an over the shoulder catch chance on 3rd down early in the 4th...he has his hands on it but drops it. Would've set Seattle up at the 25 or so, in at least FG range to go up by at least 17. Instead a punt. Teams then both went 3 and out, but then on the second NE possession, they got back into the swing of things with the first TD.
Credit to Brady and Belichek for the game plan to get the ball out quick. They stiuck with it, and moved the ball down the field. Losing Avril on the second INT was tough on the end of the line, but outside of a sack, Seattle just had to hold serve, and they contained the run...but the Pats chipped away and then took the lead on some short dink and dunk plays, and took the lead while Seattle kept going 3 and out on offense.
Fast forward to last drive. Fantastic catch by Lynch to get 30 yards. Then a great throw and catch to Lockette to get the next first down on 3rd down.
Here's another turning point though. After that first down, Wilson took too long to snap, and had to call a timeout to avoid the delay of game penalty. That wasted timeout, IMO, haunted them and forced them to do what they did at the very end.
Anyways, where they were on the field at that point, I knew Wilson was going to throw down the field deep and did it twice. Got fortunate on the Kearse catch, but Kearse never lost sight of the ball and it bounced his way. They then had to burn another timeout after that play, a little more forgiveable since all the hub bub around that play.
Lynch then ran for 3.5 yards, down to the 1, going over 100 yards on 24 carries. Clock continued to tick.
But then the worst call in NFL football history. With only one timeout, the plan was, I think, to try and throw as a bit of deception, and at worst stop the clock...as opposed to running it, as MAYBE getting stopped (Lynch didn't get stopped for anything less than 2 yards all game) would mean they had to figure out what to do, and not have another timeout if they called the last one.
But if you're going to do that, the throw should not be to an area, since on the goal line, where there are 4 or 5 sets in of hands in there, where the ball could bounce, deflect etc off of. At very worst if going to throw, put a ball up to the back corner of the endzone to tall Matthews...putting it only where he could catch it, or it goes out of bounds and the clock stops and Seattle then can go back to the run with the clock stopped and still a timeout.
If Seattle had two timeouts, not wasting one as they did earlier uselessly later in the drive, I think they would've run Lynch that next play. If for some reason the run was stopped, call one of the timeouts, and still have one to burn, and run at least two more plays. But they only had one timeout and didn't want to risk being too predictable.
That's the only thin logic I can think of, given the one time out that they had left. But from the half yard line, even with only a single timeout, you let the Pats stop Lynch from getting a half yard, 2, probably 3 plays to win the game. Not throw a ball into a busy area as some sort of deception in a much much much riskier situation.
But there should be no overthinking...Lynch was steamrolling all game and had just run 3.5 hard yards, the ball was 1/2 yard away from a TD, the Pats were reeling from the Kearse catch and the realization they had a very good chance of losing that game. Hand it to him 1000 times out of 1000. If he's stopped again for anything less than a 6 yard loss, call a timeout and hand it to him again probably.
When I saw Lynch slide out from behind Wilson, presnap, I was instantly alarmed.
Carroll has taken responsibility this evening, and Lynch doesn't seem upset about it, but that was 95% on Bevell and 5% on Wilson for even attempting the play. He and Wilson exclusively call the plays, and while a HC can nix something, Carroll trusts his coaches and players sometimes to a fault.
Can do a lot of second guessing about that last drive, and over as long as you follow the NFL, that play will standout for most fans, and sting perpetually for Seahawks fans to be a half yard away from a back to back SB...but if 17 minutes earlier Kearse holds onto that tough catch on third down, and Seattle drains 3 or 4 more minutes of clock with a new set of downs, and kicks at least a FG to go up by 17, there may not have been the drama at the end.
Credit to Brady, Belichek and the Pats, but this will hurt for a long time for Seahawks fans.
When that happened I literally turned to my wife and said "What the f@ck are they doing?" I was in such disbelief.
1) I think the Butler play was mapossible by the video review and prep by the Patriots defensive team in the week leading up to the game. Butler knew exactly where to get to when he saw the play and alluded to it in his interview.
2) What would be the NHL equivalent to that play call?
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Lots of "should've, would've, could've" to be honest. Browna is clearly a much more knowledgable Seahawks/football fan than I ever will be but the Seahawks live and die by the big play, and that final Kearse catch was the last of a long long list of incredibly lucky plays getting the Hawks to where they were. It's about time their luck run out.
