So yea... that Ukrainian Naval base that the standoff happened at before. Seems like the Russians finally made it into the base and smashed up the electrical rooms so the rest of the base can't be used. http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-26408115
The G7 nations have cancelled all preparatory work for the G8 summit in response to Russia's actions and refusal to back down. They've issued a condemnation of Russia's military buildup. Looks like the G8 summit might not happen in Sochi later if this situation doesn't calm down. http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-26412914
A former ambassador to Russia has written a very long open letter regarding the situation in Russia. Among the issues he discusses is Russia's continued willingness to use force, in both brutal and efficient manners, flies right in the face of a continued western decline. Putin is counting on Western weakness. For some countries a show of strength may be necessary for them to back down though I don't think the EU, Obama (and by extension the uninformed American public) will have the political will for that. Money is the problem. The west have mostly become nations run by wealthy careerists who do not have the backbone to start the uncompromising show of strength necessary to reverse the Russian incursion into the Crimea. He also points out other Baltic nations may be in trouble if the West does not respond.
Excerpt from the article. I don't want to post too much of it.
Quote:
In a nutshell, Russia is fighting ruthlessly and brutally, and proving to all that the post-Cold War world has been replaced by the post-post-Cold War world in which Moscow no longer considers the current international order, law, and organizations competent to solve problems.
What is applicable then? From Moscow’s point of view, only force and the willingness to sacrifice human lives when force is applied.
Is the West willing to do that? That is extremely unlikely. It is one thing to mount military operations against Afghan poppy growers and quite another to accept the challenge of a nuclear power with the world’s largest territory and the richest deposits of natural resources, which feels cornered in a deepening confrontation with the West and is not going to surrender its habitats without a fight.
Moscow knows – and so does the West but it is not willing to admit it even to itself – that Western civilization in its decadence has reached the final stage of its degradation where only money and comfort count. Careerists and anglers, who are able to navigate the ship only in good weather, have risen to the top during decades of inert existence. They will lose their heads in a storm, and can only utter banalities and behave accordingly.
Oswald Spengler in his “The Decline of the West” predicted more than correctly that money will bring down Western democracy (that is exactly what has already happened), and then the power of money will be conquered by force. Europe, fighting for the rainbow flag and gender quotas, is a complete impotent in that respect; the United States, on the other hand, when considering intervening, is thinking about moves of a broader global game and must inevitably take into account that average Americans do not have a clue where someplace called Crimea is located. Moreover, the United States is tired of the problems of the rest of the world and wants to take a rest. And we do not know whether it intends to wake up and do something if a small country like Estonia screams for help at some point.
Ugh...the thing about this story is that the USA wants a lot of this turmoil to happen (they supported the revolution in Ukraine...a place that had an election scheduled next year). And so I think this might get much worse before it gets better. I think that there are people (on both sides) who want another cold (hopefully) war and they might be able get their wish.
In the long run the really bad outcome would be if the Russians and the Chinese cooperate to try to balance out the US' influence.
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Russian foreign policy department claimed that China's opinion on Ukraine is very similar to the one's of Russia. Is it true or is it a bluff, remains to be seen.
So yea... that Ukrainian Naval base that the standoff happened at before. Seems like the Russians finally made it into the base and smashed up the electrical rooms so the rest of the base can't be used. http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-26408115
The G7 nations have cancelled all preparatory work for the G8 summit in response to Russia's actions and refusal to back down. They've issued a condemnation of Russia's military buildup. Looks like the G8 summit might not happen in Sochi later if this situation doesn't calm down. http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-26412914
A former ambassador to Russia has written a very long open letter regarding the situation in Russia. Among the issues he discusses is Russia's continued willingness to use force, in both brutal and efficient manners, flies right in the face of a continued western decline. Putin is counting on Western weakness. For some countries a show of strength may be necessary for them to back down though I don't think the EU, Obama (and by extension the uninformed American public) will have the political will for that. Money is the problem. The west have mostly become nations run by wealthy careerists who do not have the backbone to start the uncompromising show of strength necessary to reverse the Russian incursion into the Crimea. He also points out other Baltic nations may be in trouble if the West does not respond.
Excerpt from the article. I don't want to post too much of it.
While I neither support Russian action, nor pretend to know the plans of everyone involved, I don't think the view presented above is correct. It is not Russia's step in the alleged campaign to restore USSR or something like that. It is more like after US coup in Ukraine succeded, Russia realized that the next step is kicking their naval base out, so Putin had to take immediate action to hold onto Crimea now that he de facto lost Ukraine.
But he really shouldn't have control over the Ukraine in the first place. It's a sovereign nation. And the people have shown that they wish to fight for their sovereignty.
I don't know a ton about the Orange revolution, but I always thought it was a step in the right direction for them, no?
Russian stock market has plunged 10% and the Ruble is at a historic low.
Quote:
Russian stock markets Monday crashed almost 10 percent and the ruble plunged to historic lows in value against the dollar and euro, as alarm grew over the potentially disastrous economic consequences of military intervention in Ukraine.
Russia's central bank hiked its main interest rate in an emergency move to stem capital flight and the losses for the ruble, amid what risks becoming at least Russia's worst economic crisis since 2009.
President Vladimir Putin on Saturday had won approval from Russia's upper house for the sending of troops to Ukraine due to the standoff in Crimea following the ousting of pro-Moscow president Viktor Yanukovych.
Economists warned the move risks creating a litany of further trouble for the Russian economy, which is already battling chronically slow growth.
Military intervention will drain further resources from a Russian budget already stretched by costs like the Sochi Olympics, alarm already nervous investors, limit Russia's economic ties with the West and force Russian companies into huge write-offs in Ukraine.
Being the avgeek that I am I remember a PC game I had back in the 90's, SU-27 Flanker. Eerily enough it was set in the Crimea as the conflict point, I can't find a synopsis of the plot but if memory serves it was very similar to what is going down right now.
While I neither support Russian action, nor pretend to know the plans of everyone involved, I don't think the view presented above is correct. It is not Russia's step in the alleged campaign to restore USSR or something like that. It is more like after US coup in Ukraine succeded, Russia realized that the next step is kicking their naval base out, so Putin had to take immediate action to hold onto Crimea now that he de facto lost Ukraine.
Here is an update on troop movements including some Ukrainian movements in Blue that were noted over the weekend.
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Euromaidan PR @EuromaidanPR 2h
#Russian NavalVessels are blocking StreletskayaBay in #Sevastopol during last 3 hours -KRYM.SOS |PR #Ukraine #Crimea pic.twitter.com/y1RA69Vt92
Ukrainian navy officers have rejected pleas for them to defect to the self-declared Crimean government at an extraordinary meeting at their headquarters in Sevastopol.
On Sunday the recently appointed navy commander-in-chief, Rear Admiral Denis Berezovsky, appeared on television to announce he was defecting to the Russian-supported Crimean authorities. But despite his appeals to officers on Monday, they said they would remain loyal to their oaths to serve Ukraine. Berezovsky has been accused of state treason by the new authorities in Kiev.
...
At Ukraine's naval command on Monday morning, officers lined up in the yard of their Sevastopol headquarters to be addressed by both Berezovsky and the newly appointed navy chief commander, Serhiy Haiduk.
The officers broke into applause as Haiduk read them an order from Kiev removing Berezovsky from his position, and told them that Berezovsky was facing treason charges. When Haiduk had finished his dry but compelling address, the officers spontaneously broke into the national anthem, and some were seen to cry. Berezovsky showed no visible sign of emotion.
"I know my men will stay loyal to their oaths," Haiduk said before the address. "What Berezovsky has done is a matter for him alone. When he brought intruders in here, we did not offer armed resistance as would have been our right, in order to avoid any provocations the other side would like."
...
Alexei Mazepa, a spokesman for the Ukrainian ministry of defence, said that Russian forces continued to surround bases around Crimea, in an attempt to force Ukrainians to give up weapons and defect to the self-proclaimed Crimean authorities, who want to hold a referendum on the territory's status on 30 March. So far, Berezovsky appears to be the only high-profile defection.
Mazepa also said that Russian naval vessels were attempting to block Ukrainian vessels, and feared that attempts could be made to storm them soon.
Senior US officials dismissed claims that Washington is incapable of exerting influence on the Russian president, Vladimir Putin, but were forced to admit that Crimea had been successfully invaded by 6,000 airborne and ground troops in what could be the start of a wider invasion.
“They are flying in reinforcements and they are settling in,” one senior official said. Another senior official said: “Russian forces now have complete operational control of the Crimean peninsula.”
Emphasis added.
Last edited by worth; 03-03-2014 at 08:21 AM.
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US was heavily behind it, it is pretty much a common knowledge. Just Google Victoria Nuland or check out, how much money US had openly spent on bringing democracy to Ukraine. This is not an excuse for Russia by any means, though and I'm not even anti-american guy (my grandma and two cousins live in New Jersey).
While I neither support Russian action, nor pretend to know the plans of everyone involved, I don't think the view presented above is correct. It is not Russia's step in the alleged campaign to restore USSR or something like that. It is more like after US coup in Ukraine succeded, Russia realized that the next step is kicking their naval base out, so Putin had to take immediate action to hold onto Crimea now that he de facto lost Ukraine.
How is it a US coup? The protesters won out and responded to the $15 billion Russia offered to Yanukovych. Sure you can say Yanukovych was forced out incorrectly following the original agreement, but his own party banished him and he fled. This wasn't the Svoboda that forced him out, this wasn't any of the protesters either. It was a result of the original agreement itself where he threw anyone not named Yanukovych under the bus for the actions during the protests. His allies in Kiev turned on him after that and he fled before the criminal charges came. It had much more to do with his own incompetence and self serving attitude than some US led coup against the government. Also his twisting of anti-protest laws as a justification for using live ammunition against protesters should rightly have led to his impeachment anyways.
Yes you could say this wasn't constitutionally correct to skip the impeachment process, but the same thing could be said about Russia's installation of the new Crimea government under gunpoint. Two wrongs don't make a right.
Having surrounded all the Ukrainian army and naval bases, Russia gives Ukrainian forces in the Crimea ultimatum to surrender their weapons or face military assault. Deadline is set for Tuesday http://uk.reuters.com/article/2014/0...A221AI20140303
How is it a US coup? The protesters won out and responded to the $15 billion Russia offered to Yanukovych. Sure you can say Yanukovych was forced out incorrectly following the original agreement, but his own party banished him and he fled. This wasn't the Svoboda that forced him out, this wasn't any of the protesters either. It was a result of the original agreement itself where he threw anyone not named Yanukovych under the bus for the actions during the protests. His allies in Kiev turned on him after that and he fled before the criminal charges came. It had much more to do with his own incompetence and self serving attitude than some US led coup against the government. Also his twisting of anti-protest laws as a justification for using live ammunition against protesters should rightly have led to his impeachment anyways.
Yes you could say this wasn't constitutionally correct, but the same thing could be said about Russia's installation of the new Crimea government under gunpoint. Two wrongs don't make a right.
I think it would be naive to suggest the US and other western countries didn't try to influence pro democracy protesters or pro democracy initiatives throughout the years in some way, and the same goes for Russians trying to influence Pro Russian supporters and initiatives. This happens in every unstable country. The US will benefit from having a Pro EU Ukraine and will work towards that goal however they can, and the Russians were working against that by keeping Yanukovych in power.
I wouldn't call it a coup, but I don't think it's correct to assume the uprising we saw was only accomplished by pro EU Ukraine supporters.
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US was heavily behind it, it is pretty much a common knowledge. Just Google Victoria Nuland or check out, how much money US had openly spent on bringing democracy to Ukraine. This is not an excuse for Russia by any means, though and I'm not even anti-american guy (my grandma and two cousins live in New Jersey).
I read the transcripts and to me it doesn't sound like the US instigated the coup, but rather they were about who they would support to form the Ukrainian government after the coup.
I did just skim through them, because there is a lot of meaningless chatting in them as well.
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Having surrounded all the Ukrainian army and naval bases, Russia gives Ukrainian forces in the Crimea ultimatum to surrender their weapons or face military assault. Deadline is set for Tuesday http://uk.reuters.com/article/2014/0...A221AI20140303
