[PGT] Flames vs. Oilers. Flames lose 4-2.

[nik-]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

He's a prospect.

Do you understand what a rebuild is?

Do you think other teams are going to give up guys who have fully developed into solid NHLers for 4th round picks?

Show some reasonability in your arguments

lol what? You posted their heights as a reason they are good to have. I posted about what happens on the ice, yet it's me that needs to be reasonable?

Yes, I know what a rebuild is, which is why I don't want this horrible GM running it.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by moon

Solid argument.

I can see why Feaster is such a great GM.

Solid post. When did I claim he was a great GM?

You are such a hypocrite. You whine if anyone pulls garbage like that on you, but you'll do it whenever you have nothing better to say.

[AC]

Sounds like we're starting Berra again on Monday.

Scott Cruickshank ‏@CruickshankCH
#Flames starting Berra in Wpg. #nhlpn

I think Ramo should be starting though, you can't force a number one to emerge.

[moon]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Solid post. When did I claim he was a great GM?

You are such a hypocrite. You whine if anyone pulls garbage like that on you, but you'll do it whenever you have nothing better to say.

You said something about not getting Getzlaf for a 4th and it is me that has nothing better to say?

What exactly to you expect from that garbage post trying to put made up words in my mouth?

[pikester]

Originally Posted by JiriHrdina

I'm sure the flames and oilers were both strongly rumoured to have interest but the Canucks wanted more. Could be wrong

Reasonably accurate from what various hockey media reported off & on throughout the summer & early season. On Oilers Now, Stauffer claimed that Canuckleheads wanted one of either Hall or Eberle + a prospect (probably Klefbom)+ 2014 1st rnd pick + a later pick in 2015 to send Schneider to Edmonton; waaay too much! Pretty sure they would have been asking Monahan + Brodie + 2014 1st pick from Calgary.

[CaramonLS]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

I would definitely add moving Tanguay to the .good. list because it was integral to changing the culture.

So if dumping Tanguay is considered a good move, then what kind of move is re-signing him to a long term contract.

[memphusk]

Originally Posted by CaramonLS

So if dumping Tanguay is considered a good move, then what kind of move is re-signing him to a long term contract.

Tanguay wanted out as soon as player #12 left. On top of that, he wasn't dumped. Calgary ate a couple bad contracts on that one.

[Flames Fan, Ph.D.]

Originally Posted by AC

Sounds like we're starting Berra again on Monday.

Scott Cruickshank ‏@CruickshankCH
#Flames starting Berra in Wpg. #nhlpn

I think Ramo should be starting though, you can't force a number one to emerge.

I'm not surprised. Hartley's approach to this season is pretty clear now. I'm just worried that his intent is in conflict with where this franchise is.

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

Well, I see it like you're bending over backwards to find positives for Feaster's tenure. Sometimes it's not cherry picking when confronted with such a substantial list.

Letting Comeau walk the second time when he should have let him walk the first time is not a creditable transaction.

It's an imbalanced discussion because the criteria for good and bad is so horribly imbalanced.

Did you forget the Flames moved Comeau for a 5th round pick?

[Flash Walken]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

lol

This conversation has been a 'Feaster has been complete shat' orgy.

I offered a couple counter points and you think I'm bending over backwards?

Knock yourselves out guys - bitch away. Feaster is the worst GM ever.

You don't need to take your ball and go home. We think your arguments are bunk, we don't have our eyes shut to them.

The best things Feaster has done in the last year as GM is move out a bad contract he signed for questionable return, and added a couple of luke warm bodies to the lineup for mid round picks.

That your counter argument consists of having to resort to things like letting Roman Cervenka walk, Kipper retiring or getting Corban Knight (WHO!?) for 4th is pretty much all the indictment needed towards this notion of Feaster being unfairly criticized.

I know you agree with me about how Sven has been used. Well, guess who hired the coach who we both think is not that good?

The list is long man. Kris Russell for a 4th is a good move. Part of how we can tell it's a good move is the wasteland around it. It's an oasis in the desert.

[Flash Walken]

Originally Posted by Vinny01

Did you forget the Flames moved Comeau for a 5th round pick?

I did forget that.

That is a decent deal all things considered.

[Henry Fool]

Originally Posted by AC

Sounds like we're starting Berra again on Monday.

Scott Cruickshank ‏@CruickshankCH
#Flames starting Berra in Wpg. #nhlpn

I think Ramo should be starting though, you can't force a number one to emerge.

This is just putting too much on Berra. What if he has another bad game?

I love this riding the losing goalie strategy from the "we're in the business of winning games" coach. I guess eventually you'll look like you made the right choice given that eventually the team will win - but that might be 10 games later, and then you'll have one goalie who is cold and poorly adjusted and another who is a nervous wreck.

[djsFlames]

Russell was a GREAT trade. No matter what way you look at it. Blues fans I've heard from are kicking themselves a bit at that one.

Knight is yet to be determined. He hasn't played at the NHL level but is looking really solid at the AHL level. Second leading scorer and I think top in +/- and a good faceoff guy. You can't even really judge that trade until we see what he can do with the Flames but he's looking to be a great pickup for a 4th.

Colborne's been good. He may not be producing much and may be playing some top 6 minutes when that's probably not where he should be, but he's been noticeable and has great tenacity with the puck. He always seems to get it up the ice when he wants to. Really like colborne and I hope he can be a 3rd line guy for us in the future. Again, good trade. Rarely would a 5th even play in the NHL.

[EYE_Overstand]

If Cammy returns a first round pick and a prospect at the deadline, I consider that a good trade for Bourque, Patrick Holland and a 2nd.... Return would be Ramo + ________ + _______ .

Even though Rene had size he was extremely inconsistent and had a poor contract.

Edit: our 2nd round was a high one unfortunately haha. But if the first can be a 22-29 pick, it's an upgrade on that 2nd

[The Original FFIV]

Originally Posted by Joborule

I actually don't think what Ference did there was wrong. He was showing that he wasn't going to be physically overpowered, which is something Iggy would've done as well. The issue is the Flames lack of defending their own teammates and allow the other team to push them around. That's not a good thing because it can lead to your own players getting hurt and actually could be detrimental to the intensity the team plays.

The team needs to stand up for one another. It can't just be Jackman and McGrattan being the only players doing that. Otherwise teams are just going to continue to abuse them which won't help the progression of the team's developing players.

Last night highlighted the flaws in the makeup and coaching of this team.

Why was SOB not in? What did Smith bring to the table that SOB does not? At bare minimum he can hit the young stars and slow them down. We always have physical affairs and as others have stated we would probably had seen a response to the Ference attack. Bad coaching move by Hartley.

The makeup of the team is that you have a top nine with little to no physical element and a fourth line that plays five minutes a game and contributes little to the team. We should be rolling four lines and have players with a physical edge who can play a regular shift so a deterrent is out there on a regular basis and the nonsense we saw does not happen.

We might have to sacrifice some talent for grit but it will be worth it in the long run as we reestablish ourselves as a contender.

[Machiavelli]

I really dislike Colborne's playing style. Earlier, someone compared him to a giraffe, which I think is apt. A lot of what he does out there looks awkward; big body and doesn't know how to use it.

[JobHopper]

The Flames are not going to win many games if the average goals per game to this point is under 3.

Good game again by Lee Stempniak, to bad others don't follow and play with more heart like he does every night. Gutless play by Ference reacting to a typical common hockey hit.

I don't think Reto Berra is that bad. He's only played a few games. I would change out some of the forwards at this point to try and improve the team rather than goaltending.

Good to see Monahan get a goal and Brodie jumping into the rush. A couple bright spots going forward.

Interesting to see if Backlund and Baertschi will get the ice time they did last night going forward here. You did notice Backlund out there last night for a change and Sven had an assist. Probably could have had at least one more or even a goal.

Fire Feaster as I don't see where he's going with this rebuild here. Lots of smaller players in the system with still big question marks.

[EYE_Overstand]

Originally Posted by The Original FFIV

Last night highlighted the flaws in the makeup and coaching of this team.

Why was SOB not in? What did Smith bring to the table that SOB does not? At bare minimum he can hit the young stars and slow them down. We always have physical affairs and as others have stated we would probably had seen a response to the Ference attack. Bad coaching move by Hartley.

The makeup of the team is that you have a top nine with little to no physical element and a fourth line that plays five minutes a game and contributes little to the team. We should be rolling four lines and have players with a physical edge who can play a regular shift so a deterrent is out there on a regular basis and the nonsense we saw does not happen.

We might have to sacrifice some talent for grit but it will be worth it in the long run as we reestablish ourselves as a contender.

Agreed! In the first few years of the rebuild I would rather be tougher and grittier than to have a top 9 that can't play on the boards...

Stajan is playing with tons of Jam lately but he gets pushed around... Someone should have jumped Benn when he accidentally knocked down Hudler. Regardless if Benn can throw down with the best of them

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by The Original FFIV

Last night highlighted the flaws in the makeup and coaching of this team.

Why was SOB not in? What did Smith bring to the table that SOB does not? At bare minimum he can hit the young stars and slow them down. We always have physical affairs and as others have stated we would probably had seen a response to the Ference attack. Bad coaching move by Hartley.

The makeup of the team is that you have a top nine with little to no physical element and a fourth line that plays five minutes a game and contributes little to the team. We should be rolling four lines and have players with a physical edge who can play a regular shift so a deterrent is out there on a regular basis and the nonsense we saw does not happen.

We might have to sacrifice some talent for grit but it will be worth it in the long run as we reestablish ourselves as a contender.

Keep acquiring big, talented players that can play in the top 9, like Knight, Poirier, Agostino, Reinhart, Ferland (hopefully) and Colborne (if they can get him to use his size more).

It takes time and patience> Not all of them work out so it takes a long time to acquire enough of them to build a good team.

Some fans here do not seem capable to survive a rebuild.

This was not directed at you, FFIV, just adding to your post.

[Badgers Nose]

Originally Posted by edslunch

I thought the same at first, but really, doesn't that just kill the "blow off steam" argument in favour of fighting? Choreographed right down to the love pats afterwards. Tell me getting rid of this would increase stick work and all the usual BS. Now I would have no problem on the other hand if Grats handed Ference his @ss after beating on Stempniak who clearly wanted no part of it and was already injured from crashing into the boards.

I took a History of the Cmmon Law course a long time ago, the prof was excellent. One of the points that I remember from the course was the belief that contracts and legal documents were devised to be hard to understand and open to interpretation in order to 'keep it in the family' of lawyers and to insure that they would always have work. Essentially it is 100% self serving and lawyers have rightfully earned their reputation in life as a necessary evil.

IMO this fight proves that fighters are the same thing. Gazdic needed the fight, hence the 'good scrap' and 'thanks for the scrap' afterwards. Gratts fighting him helps Gazdic cement his position as an NHLer. These guys make each other relevant. If they were all gone they would not be needed or missed.

Is that right or wrong? I don't know. But it sure is different than Iggy fighting Beauchemin or Hatcher.

I don't like to see a guy lose his job, but I don't think hockey needs these sorts of fights. It certainly has nothing to do with policing or blowing off steam.

If that were true, Gratts would have killed Ott, Burrows or Eager years ago.