Use of Native American Imagery in Sports

[JiriHrdina]

Originally Posted by superfarmer

The dead horse is dead. But let's beat it some more. Pretty sure this site has had its fill of this for a long while. We get it. But it won't change.

I disagree. It will change abd when it does we will look back with embarrassment over why it didn't change sooner

[4oh3]

Red skins is meh , Indians, chiefs, Blackhawks all fine.


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[superfarmer]

This site should really just stick to being a hockey discussion site rather than a Human morality and tolerance discussion site.

[wingmaker]

Originally Posted by PaperBagger'14

I'm offended by it.

Edit: Isn't it fair to say that someone out there is actually offended by the term Stampeder? And since Jiri you have posted on the last page saying that it shouldn't require a majority to make change, that should have met all of the requirements necessary to make change. Or is there a caveat that a objective non-majority population is sufficient for change? There's far too much grey area, with no net benefit short of potentially sparing some liberal arts majors feelings.

Dude, the issue being discussed in this thread is systemic racism, as indicated by the use of language and imagery in popular culture that is abusive towards a group of people through the continuation of generalizations and stereotypes relating to a race of people that is demeaning and disrespectful. You make it sound like people taking offense to this are just doing so for political reasons.

African Americans are still fighting racism across this continent and aboriginal people's are much further behind in terms of winning respect and pride for their heritage in the eyes of North American society. The fact that we as a society think the traditions of a sports team are of more value than being respectful and inclusive to all people who live here (not to mention the people who lived here long before white people did) is damning. We live in an era where we know the effects of systemic racism. We know from all that has happened over the last century how racist language is a cover for a much deeper and more ingrained problem and set of beliefs. The fact that we know these things and can still think this is a topic for debate is appalling. Political correctness and politics have nothing to do with this. Racism is by-partisan.

I wonder how many posters who don't think this is a big issue are white?

[Ped]

Originally Posted by superfarmer

This site should really just stick to being a hockey discussion site rather than a Human morality and tolerance discussion site.

Or maybe this site can continue to discuss any and all aspects relating to sport, as well as any other issue it damn well pleases (OT Forum), and if you don't like it then stop wasting your precious time in threads you don't agree should exist.

[PaperBagger'14]

Watch how with a few changes in words to your quote it can be used to fit my "stampeders" argument:

Originally Posted by wingmaker

Dude, the issue being discussed in this thread is systemic prejudice, as indicated by the use of language and imagery in popular culture that is abusive towards a group of people through the continuation of generalizations and stereotypes relating to a city of people that is demeaning and disrespectful. You make it sound like people taking offense to this are just doing so for political reasons.

And I do not believe they are doing it for political reasons, because that would actually involve doing something. Seems like a high horse for the overly self righteous.

[puckluck2]

Originally Posted by superfarmer

This site should really just stick to being a hockey discussion site rather than a Human morality and tolerance discussion site.

You can always just not discuss things you don't want to discuss.

[Vulcan]

I wonder how many posters who don't think this is a big issue are white? __________________

or any race or nationality that it is no longer politically correct to use their insulting ethnic slurs, but don't see the harm in redskins would be offended. I was going to list off a few but everyone probably knows most of them. How would they like the Washington ........

sorry for the awkward sentencing, I edited to not make it too insulting.

[flamesfan1297]

I do not see how people take offence to these names, Blackhawks,Indians,Chiefs, or Redskins. How does this upset people, honestly? These franchises were not given these names to try and offend people. It is just a name and not meant to be racist or stereotypical. People need to stop with all this political correctness garbage. It is only offensive if you choose it to be. Just my opinion,

[PaperBagger'14]

Originally Posted by Vulcan

or any race or nationality that it is no longer politically correct to use their insulting ethnic slurs, but don't see the harm in redskins would be offended. I was going to list off a few but everyone probably knows most of them. How would they like the Washington ........

so for the awkward sentencing, I edited to not make it too insulting.

I for one would get an absolute kick out of the Washington Whities or the Washington Crackers. But then it would be racist for under representing minorities.

[Cole436]

Originally Posted by PaperBagger'14

Watch how with a few changes in words to your quote it can be used to fit my "stampeders" argument:



And I do not believe they are doing it for political reasons, because that would actually involve doing something. Seems like a high horse for the overly self righteous.

I'm going to requote myself

Originally Posted by Cole436

The use of the word "Redskins"..... are both repressive, and used as words or images that control ideas of "otherness" or ethnocentrism.

Being informed and aware of issues isn't being overly PC. The real issues deal with people who stick their head in the sand and say "this is the way it's always been".

Case in point, would you believe it to be appropriate to address a Native as a "Redskin"? That has the connotations as myself being addressed as a "Wop".

It's not ok to use an ethnic slur as the name of a professional football team.

[wingmaker]

Originally Posted by PaperBagger'14

Watch how with a few changes in words to your quote it can be used to fit my "stampeders" argument:



And I do not believe they are doing it for political reasons, because that would actually involve doing something. Seems like a high horse for the overly self righteous.

First of all, "Stampeders" doesn't refer to Calgarians. It is the name of sports team. When has anyone called you a Stampeder? When has anyone ever called anyone a Stampeder in reference to anything other than the sports team?

But how about Redskin? Do you feel comfortable calling an aboriginal person a Redskin? You'd be cool with that? And if you ran into a group of aboriginal people, you would feel all good saying "Hey you redskins"? And if they took offence, you would be all like "hey man, don't be a liberal jerk." Is that how that would go?

[PaperBagger'14]

Originally Posted by wingmaker

First of all, "Stampeders" doesn't refer to Calgarians. It is the name of sports team. When has anyone called you a Stampeder? When has anyone ever called anyone a Stampeder in reference to anything other than the sports team?

But how about Redskin? Do you feel comfortable calling an aboriginal person a Redskin? You'd be cool with that? And if you ran into a group of aboriginal people, you would feel all good saying "Hey you redskins"? And if they took offence, you would be all like "hey man, don't be a liberal jerk." Is that how that would go?

In my lifetime I have heard Calgarians being referred to as stampeders the exact same number of times I have heard natives be referred to as redskins. Would you go up to some random person in the city and call them a stampeder? No and if you did I bet they would either be confused or angered that you approached them in such a manner regardless of what you said.

[corporatejay]

Originally Posted by PaperBagger'14

In my lifetime I have heard Calgarians being referred to as stampeders the exact same number of times I have heard natives be referred to as redskins. Would you go up to some random person in the city and call them a stampeder? No and if you did I bet they would either be confused or angered that you approached them in such a manner regardless of what you said.

[flamesfan1297]

I just want to say that if anyone is offended by the term "Stampeder's" then they need to man up and grow a pair

[strombad]

Originally Posted by PaperBagger'14

In my lifetime I have heard Calgarians being referred to as stampeders the exact same number of times I have heard natives be referred to as redskins. Would you go up to some random person in the city and call them a stampeder? No and if you did I bet they would either be confused or angered that you approached them in such a manner regardless of what you said.

I don't think you understand things.

"Stampeder" is NOT a derogatory name for a Calgarian, it is (at worst) a nickname for someone who is going to the stampede. Whatever reasoning you're trying to use for that, you're wrong.

"Redskin" IS a derogatory name for Native Americans.

Nobody would accept the "Washington (N-words)", nor should they accept the Washington Redskins.

Grow up.

[PaperBagger'14]

Once again to each their own, I'll leave this thread so the entirety of First Nations problems can be solved by changing the name of a football team.

[strombad]

Originally Posted by PaperBagger'14

Once again to each their own, I'll leave this thread so the entirety of First Nations problems can be solved by changing the name of a football team.

Probably should never have entered into an issue you had no desire to learn about in the first place.

You stampeder!

[Cole436]

Originally Posted by PaperBagger'14

In my lifetime I have heard Calgarians being referred to as stampeders the exact same number of times I have heard natives be referred to as redskins. Would you go up to some random person in the city and call them a stampeder? No and if you did I bet they would either be confused or angered that you approached them in such a manner regardless of what you said.

How many times have you heard a random person go up to a Black man and call him a N*gger? That should give you your answer.

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by PaperBagger'14

In my lifetime I have heard Calgarians being referred to as stampeders the exact same number of times I have heard natives be referred to as redskins. Would you go up to some random person in the city and call them a stampeder? No and if you did I bet they would either be confused or angered that you approached them in such a manner regardless of what you said.

What in the serious F? Is this serious?