The trials and tribulations of Glen Gulutzan

[Beninho]

Originally Posted by The Boy Wonder

Who is the last rookie the flames have ever developed at the level of Boeser barzel or mcavoy

Tkachuk is younger than Boeser and Barzal*

If Tkachuk played with Johnny he would have 55-60 pts right now maybe more, GG refuses to try this. I’m not a fan of having our second best play maker on the shutdown line. Not saying that’s bad but Tkachuk’s statistics could be even better with more offensive zone starts and easier matchups.

[Angelino]

Originally Posted by nemanja2306

I am a big fan of Treliving, but I agree on the coaching. If he can't admit he made a mistake and let go of this guy, maybe it's time we let go of him.

As for Hamonic, I disagree. This deadline showed that it was actually a fair price for Hamonic. He's been solid after a rough start, but has become a legit top 4 defenceman. The reasons it seems it's horrible is because of our coaching staff who lose games by themselves with their arrogance and stubbornness. If the Flames were performing better, we wouldn't be discussing this trade.

Bennett was a consensus top 4 pick, I don't know what you want. Hindsight is nice but unfortunately you can't predict how a prospect will turn out. Sometimes even top 5 picks bust. Too bad.

I agree Hamonic is a decent player but not exactly sure that is what Calgary needed at the time. Using those assets to acquire a winger to play on the top line would have made more sense. Playing third line players like Ferland etc won’t work. Also wasn’t a fan of a 2nd round pick for Lose-ar.

What I do hope is that Brian Burke isn’t interfering with what Treliving is trying to get done. Whoever hired Gulutzan should be removed.

[nemanja2306]

Originally Posted by Angelino

I agree Hamonic is a decent player but not exactly sure that is what Calgary needed at the time. Using those assets to acquire a winger to play on the top line would have made more sense. Playing third line players like Ferland etc won’t work. Also wasn’t a fan of a 2nd round pick for Lose-ar.

What I do hope is that Brian Burke isn’t interfering with what Treliving is trying to get done. Whoever hired Gulutzan should be removed.

There was nothing wrong about hiring GG. Perhaps we should have gone for an experienced coach, but hindsight and all.... There is, however, something wrong about not canning this guy. It's been (almost) two years since we hired this guy and this team hasn't progressed at all. We're still a bubble team with the same issues we had last year. He is a mediocre coach producing mediocre results. He is stubborn - how long did it take to put Hamilton on the first PP? Bennett with some skilled players? Dave Cameron is still employed. He is arrogant. He blames the goaltending, the refs, the players but never himself and his decisions.

Yeah, we're not out and perhaps we'll make the playoffs, but to be in this position (fighting for our playoff life) at this point in the season is nothing more than a massive failure. Especially since we have no picks until the 3rd, I believe. Even if we do make it in, Gultuzan is going to be manhandled by the opposition coaches.

Last year, the problems were with goalies. If we only had a legit #1. Well, this year we do. We also have a guy who is top 5 in scoring. Great progression from Tkachuk as well. And still, the results are the same.

[Snuffleupagus]

I'm starting to wish this team misses the playoffs because nobody in management should keep their job, GG is a complete moron of a coach, Treliving has 3 good days a year but has failed miserably to use the strengths of the club to fix the weaknesses and blowhard Burke is a total waste of the owners money.

Overall:

-Hartley was a better coach
-Feaster was a better GM
-King was a better President (only because he actually lives here)

[Jetfire]

No matter how much I may advocate a coaching change, I'll never, ever want us to miss the playoffs when we're still in the race. If we flop in the playoffs again, then absolutely, fire away.

This team has a million problems, sure, but I stand behind our core of players and still believe every ounce of playoff experience is vital to them becoming actual winners. If you throw in the towel hoping something will miraculously change for the team in doing so, that's just Oilerism, essentially. "Oh we'll waive the white flag rather than make a final push for the playoffs and this will get us a new coach, a new gm, shiny new players, etc." meanwhile you're breeding the exact garbage team culture that's ruined and nearly ruined so many talented prospects a few hundred KMs to the north, and it's got them precisely nowhere.

Get to the dance (or at least put in a damn good effort to do so!), sink or swim, then work on our problems from there.

[Dajazz]

Originally Posted by Snuffleupagus

I'm starting to wish this team misses the playoffs because nobody in management should keep their job, GG is a complete moron of a coach, Treliving has 3 good days a year but has failed miserably to use the strengths of the club to fix the weaknesses and blowhard Burke is a total waste of the owners money.

Overall:

-Hartley was a better coach
-Feaster was a better GM
-King was a better President (only because he actually lives here)

That's just plain wrong in so many ways. Hartley caught lightning in a bottle, Feaster was horrible and could have destroyed this team for years (Richards/O'Reilly) and couldn't get any value for Iginla, Regehr and Bouwmeester - those three trades could have set this team up for years with picks & prospects. King - I dunno, no insight there but I trust Burke for Hockey Ops more.

[Angelino]

Originally Posted by nemanja2306

There was nothing wrong about hiring GG. Perhaps we should have gone for an experienced coach, but hindsight and all.... There is, however, something wrong about not canning this guy. It's been (almost) two years since we hired this guy and this team hasn't progressed at all. We're still a bubble team with the same issues we had last year. He is a mediocre coach producing mediocre results. He is stubborn - how long did it take to put Hamilton on the first PP? Bennett with some skilled players? Dave Cameron is still employed. He is arrogant. He blames the goaltending, the refs, the players but never himself and his decisions.

Yeah, we're not out and perhaps we'll make the playoffs, but to be in this position (fighting for our playoff life) at this point in the season is nothing more than a massive failure. Especially since we have no picks until the 3rd, I believe. Even if we do make it in, Gultuzan is going to be manhandled by the opposition coaches.

Last year, the problems were with goalies. If we only had a legit #1. Well, this year we do. We also have a guy who is top 5 in scoring. Great progression from Tkachuk as well. And still, the results are the same.

I agree Gulutzan sucks. He is Calgary’s version of Dallas Eakins. A good coach can make garbage into gold (i.e. Gallant in Vegas) and a bad coach can make gold into garbage. Treliving hired a garbageman, hopefully his next coaching choice is a lot better otherwise he will be out of a job as well.

[OldDutch]

Originally Posted by Snuffleupagus

Overall:

-Hartley was a better coach
-Feaster was a better GM
-King was a better President (only because he actually lives here)

Wow.

It is open knowlege Hartley was a nut job who messed with his players heads. Heck the FAN talks about it as recently as last week. He had 3/4 seasons with no playoffs.

You have a Gm who was going to pay Brad Richards $10MM for eternity. He was going to to lose a first draft pick and lose ROR because he didn’t know his job.

Ken King. Nuff said.

GG was a bad hire but come one. This is some down right crazy talk.

[Infinit47]

Originally Posted by Wild GM

More making stuff up.
The narrative that he doesn’t talk to his team is absurd
But that’s ok. I get that we are on a witch hunt here
So making stuff up is ok
Wonder what the average time outs per game are and how many coaches are now also saving them in case of review
One could look into that
Or just make stuff up

How is it absurd. I've been to many games, Vegas stands out, where the opposing coach is constantly talking to his players, giving direction, and our coach does nothing of the sort. I don't see how that's making stuff up.

This coach has done absolutley nothing in his NHL career other than be mediocre. He's headed for 1 in 4 years in the playoffs, and has never won a playoff game. Once the Flames OT record stopped propping him up we got to see what his coaching record really looks like.

He makes baffling decisions re: player usage, hoards his timeouts like Golum protection precious, and has put a completely lifeless product on the ice.

[Stay Golden]

When Treliving hired Gilly he said he was hired as a HC to take the Flames to the next level. What is this imaginary next level being delivered?
Gilly and his weak staff are the root of the Flames problem.
Even if the Flames finish this season exactly where they are 5th in the division, 11th in the conference I have zero confidense Treliving will demonstrate accountability by firing his next level golden Gilly. If the team somehow goes on a roll and grabs a wildcard Treliving will likely maintain his status quo once again on this scrub HC.
What I find equally disappointing is the group of fans that have blind loyalty to a HC that has failed the team and the fans. We all deserve much better than the results with Gilly.

[sa226]

First of all, this off season, I would be open to finding a new head coach.

Yesterday they had a guy from Winnipeg on the Fan 960 talking about the Jets and the differences from last year to this year. How last year the team was a disaster, a team that was supposed to be on the up and up turned into a boring tire fire that took tom many penalties. Not to mention crappy goaltending. This season they are in contender status.

He was asked why he thought that was. The guy said something that I thought was weird, but maybe there is some truth to that. He said that it seemed like it took the group of players a good 4 years to learn the system. That now things have come together, decision making is instinctual they all know what they have to do, they have to keep being told what to do. As well the consistency of Cheveldayoff sticking with his group of young players paid off.

I don't know if that is a bunch of hooey or not. But I see similarities between the Jets of last year and the Flames of this year. Its pretty easy to grab a pitchfork and join the angry mob, but I would not be surprised in the least if Gulutzan is back next season.

[Ryan Coke]

Originally Posted by Wild GM

More making stuff up.
The narrative that he doesn’t talk to his team is absurd
But that’s ok. I get that we are on a witch hunt here
So making stuff up is ok
Wonder what the average time outs per game are and how many coaches are now also saving them in case of review
One could look into that
Or just make stuff up

I have heard from people who sit near the benches that GG rarely is talking to his players during the game, whereas most of the opposing coaches are much more active in engaging their players. I don’t have that first hand info, but it does line up with what we see on tv. I don’t recall any clips of him actively talking with players during the game. Do you have any evidence contrary to that?

We have also heard from members of the media that some other top teams have come through, and how fast their practices are run. A completely different pace to GG’s practices, which aligns with the slow pace of game they play. Do you disagree with that?

Hey, if the guy is getting results not talking and practicing slow then that’s awesome, but when I don’t like the methods AND he is not delivering a consistent performance, then it’s fair to question them.

[Toonage]

Ultimately all the arguing in the world doesn't matter. This team misses the playoffs, he'll be fired.

[Infinit47]

Glen Gulutzan is the "Chris Stewart waiver wire pick up" of coaches.

[nemanja2306]

Originally Posted by Toonage

Ultimately all the arguing in the world doesn't matter. This team misses the playoffs, he'll be fired.

I used to think so, as well. However, with the injury to Smith, he might play the "Smith was injured for a while, it's not my fault" card. It's right up his alley. That might buy him some time. I hope not, though.

[Ashasx]

The absolute most frustrating thing about Gulutzan is that there was no reason to dress Glass-Stajan-Stewart as the 4th line last night.

Like, nobody whose job is in hockey should willingly roll that line out in a hockey game. No coach should be dumb enough to dress them. That is the worst line in the league.

It says a lot about Gulutzan when almost two full seasons into his tenure here, he's still making rookie mistakes.

[Toonage]

Originally Posted by nemanja2306

I used to think so, as well. However, with the injury to Smith, he might play the "Smith was injured for a while, it's not my fault" card. It's right up his alley. That might buy him some time. I hope not, though.

Nope. I understand this thinking but the team underperformed so much, with internal expectations so high, that its impossible to move forward with this coach and his staff. Whats the cliche? You can't fire the whole team?

Treliving gets this. You can read between the lines in recent interviews, especially around the deadline. Gulutzan understands this, just look at his demeanor of late.

[Flames_F.T.W]

Originally Posted by nemanja2306

I used to think so, as well. However, with the injury to Smith, he might play the "Smith was injured for a while, it's not my fault" card. It's right up his alley. That might buy him some time. I hope not, though.

That, and he needed some more scoring and Tre didn't do anything at the deadline.

[kyuss275]

Originally Posted by Snuffleupagus

I'm starting to wish this team misses the playoffs because nobody in management should keep their job, GG is a complete moron of a coach, Treliving has 3 good days a year but has failed miserably to use the strengths of the club to fix the weaknesses and blowhard Burke is a total waste of the owners money.

Overall:

-Hartley was a better coach
-Feaster was a better GM
-King was a better President (only because he actually lives here)

If they have a "dummies guide to hockey" then you need to go buy it now. One of the worst posts of all time. What's worse, 2 posters "thank you" for it. Maybe you can get a discount if you buy 3 books?

[The Boy Wonder]

Originally Posted by sa226

First of all, this off season, I would be open to finding a new head coach.

Yesterday they had a guy from Winnipeg on the Fan 960 talking about the Jets and the differences from last year to this year. How last year the team was a disaster, a team that was supposed to be on the up and up turned into a boring tire fire that took tom many penalties. Not to mention crappy goaltending. This season they are in contender status.

He was asked why he thought that was. The guy said something that I thought was weird, but maybe there is some truth to that. He said that it seemed like it took the group of players a good 4 years to learn the system. That now things have come together, decision making is instinctual they all know what they have to do, they have to keep being told what to do. As well the consistency of Cheveldayoff sticking with his group of young players paid off.

I don't know if that is a bunch of hooey or not. But I see similarities between the Jets of last year and the Flames of this year. Its pretty easy to grab a pitchfork and join the angry mob, but I would not be surprised in the least if Gulutzan is back next season.

I think there is something to this. The flames seem to be taking an extra half second to think about where they need to be, who they should be passing to, who they should be covering, etc.

GGs system is difficult to learn it seems and it’s appears that each decision comes with multiple levels of decisions and options they have to consider and it isn’t familiar to the players for whatever reason.

I still go back to what I said a few days ago about soccer managers

If a soccer manager gets hired to a team, he obviously has his tactics and systems that he wants to play, if he has the players that fit his system great, everything works, if he doesn’t have the personnel and the team won’t bring in players who’s skills are maximized in the managers system then successful managers adapt the system to ensure that it gets the most out of the players.

In the flames situation, and we argue his is circles here, there are certain players who just aren’t being maximized in this system, there’s some who are playing exceptionally well, but the team as a whole isn’t.

Systems shouldn’t be so rigid that you can’t adapt them, and if the system can’t be adapted then it’s not s good system.