The Blue Jays Thread: 2008 Season

[dissentowner]

If Bonds is gonna come it will be now with the Wells out but considering who the GM is it won't happen...sad that the greatest hitter the game has ever had is ripe for the pickings.

[Sylvanfan]

Well lets face it....29 other MLB teams aren't taking him on either. No need to feel sorry for Bonds, he brought a lot of this upon himself. I think it's not GM's but owners who are basically colluding to keep him out of Majors with the black eye he's basically given their game with his cheating. They have themselves to blame for it, but they still feel good about having scape goats and Roger Clemens and Barry Bonds will be the scape goats of the steroid era.

Bonds could still be a productive bat....no one has a better eye at the plate than he does, and it's not like he was a talentless hack who needed roids to get into the bigs...he was a Hall of Famer who used them to become the all time Home Run King.

[dissentowner]

Sure he gave the game a black eye for cheating but so did a bunch of players. Regardless he would certainly help a Toronto team struggling to score.

[Caged Great]

I don't think I've ever seen a team with as good of a group of pitchers between the starters and the BP and such a horrid bunch of useless crap for hitting.

It's so pathetic that you have to hope for our pitchers to throw a shutout in order for us to get a win because we can't score more than a run or two in a game.

After Sizemore hit the homerun in the first, I jokingly said well, that's the ballgame.....
It's sad that I was right.

[KTown]

This team needs a shakeup.

Sure the pitching was horrid tonight, but most nights the damn pitching keeps this team in the game.

Riccardi needs to go and he needs to take that useless manager gibbons.

I've never seen a manager play russian roulette with pitchers. He goes through so many pitchers late in a game that he's bound to find one that's going to get lit up.

If a reliever is hot, leave him in for another inning or two, stop playing the lefty on lefty and righty on righty matchup all the damn time.

I can't stand gibbons!

[habernac]

Bonds is a bag of crap. Every story out of San Francisco this year is a happy one. Why? Because the world's biggest prima donna is no longer poisoning the locker room. He's old, injury prone and unwanted. And can you imagine how much he would demand salary wise anyway? Not worth it.

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by habernac

Bonds is a bag of crap. Every story out of San Francisco this year is a happy one. Why? Because the world's biggest prima donna is no longer poisoning the locker room. He's old, injury prone and unwanted. And can you imagine how much he would demand salary wise anyway? Not worth it.

Bonds aside what in the world do they have to be happy about? Their team is not a contender really.

[Iggy's Forehead]

Originally Posted by habernac

Bonds is a bag of crap. Every story out of San Francisco this year is a happy one. Why? Because the world's biggest prima donna is no longer poisoning the locker room. He's old, injury prone and unwanted. And can you imagine how much he would demand salary wise anyway? Not worth it.

What is this "happy" news coming out of San Francisco you speak of? Is it them having the first guy this year to get 50 games for testing positive? Is it Barry Zito blowing up and his massive contract?

You obviously don't follow baseball very closely, San Francisco is in an even worse boat than Toronto, with the 2nd worst offense in the bigs and below average pitching.

At this point, I don't see Bonds demanding a high salary. How could he? There is obvious collusion in MLB not to sign him, I think he'd take whatever he could get at this point.

[Sylvanfan]

Originally Posted by Iggy's Forehead

At this point, I don't see Bonds demanding a high salary. How could he? There is obvious collusion in MLB not to sign him, I think he'd take whatever he could get at this point.

Yeah, but it's not like he's poor having made over 200 million in career earnings that he needs the money to feed his family, or buy more steroids. He also has one of the biggest ego's on Earth so he's not going to play for nothing either. He probably won't play unless someone pays him 8 million as a minimum. He probably still thinks in his own mind that he's worth 16 million a year.

[Iggy's Forehead]

Originally Posted by Sylvanfan

Yeah, but it's not like he's poor having made over 200 million in career earnings that he needs the money to feed his family, or buy more steroids. He also has one of the biggest ego's on Earth so he's not going to play for nothing either. He probably won't play unless someone pays him 8 million as a minimum. He probably still thinks in his own mind that he's worth 16 million a year.

Production wise, he is.

[moon]

Originally Posted by Iggy's Forehead

Production wise, he is.

No he isn'. He can't play in the field, he is a liability on the bases, he has nowhere near his old power numbers, can't leg out doubles. He can single-handidly kill chemistry on a team, which can be huge.

I think on a team like the Yankees with vets and money he could help for a few months and the play-offs. On a team like the Jays that isn't going anywhere anyways I would be worried about his affect on the younger guys and team overall.

There is a great article on the Cards not bringing him in written last week when I get home I will post the link. It shows why despite how it looked smart in the offseason that not bringing Bonds in was the best thing for the team.

[JayP]

Originally Posted by moon

No he isn'. He can't play in the field, he is a liability on the bases, he has nowhere near his old power numbers, can't leg out doubles. He can single-handidly kill chemistry on a team, which can be huge.

Bonds would DH almost exclusively.

Base-running is hardly worth even considering in any baseball discussion. Either way we're not talking about Benji Molina here.

His power numbers may be down, but that doesn't mean a whole lot when you're dropping from the best in the league.

23th best SLG% in 2006 at .545 (Highest Jays is Wells at 24 with .542)
11th best SLG% in 2007 at .565 (Highest Jay is Rios at 39 with .498)

9th best OPS in 2006 at .999 (Highest Jay is Wells at 31 with .899)
3rd best OPS in 2007 at 1.045 (No Jays in top 50)

Oh, and he led the league in OBP in both 2006 and 2007 by a sizable margin.

Put those numbers together and you clearly have a top 5-10 hitter in the league.

The only real argument against Bonds is the chemistry issue. He would step in and be far and away the Jays best hitter. For all of April you heard the Jays talk about how great the clubhouse is now and how it's going to propel them to great success. How's that working out?

[Iggy's Forehead]

I notice you say "on a team like the Jays who aren't going anywhere". To me that is the exact reason you bring in Bonds. The Yankees have everything to lose, the Jays have nothing to lose. It's May 12th, the Jays are by no means out of it and have arguably the best rotation in baseball. I just don't understand this mentality from Jays fans where they don't disrupt a 3rd or 4th place finish again. Worrying about effecting young players, are we really looking to next year again? And what about next year when nobody can hit, are we still going to talk about the future?

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by Iggy's Forehead

I notice you say "on a team like the Jays who aren't going anywhere". To me that is the exact reason you bring in Bonds. The Yankees have everything to lose, the Jays have nothing to lose. It's May 12th, the Jays are by no means out of it and have arguably the best rotation in baseball. I just don't understand this mentality from Jays fans where they don't disrupt a 3rd or 4th place finish again. Worrying about effecting young players, are we really looking to next year again? And what about next year when nobody can hit, are we still going to talk about the future?

Not only that but didn't a Jay state he played with Bonds and the guy was very nice to him? I think Bond's is a thorn to the media, not his teammates. The bottom line is he would definitely improve the Jays offense not to mention the draw of watching one of the games greatest players.

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by habernac

Bonds is a bag of crap. Every story out of San Francisco this year is a happy one. Why? Because the world's biggest prima donna is no longer poisoning the locker room. He's old, injury prone and unwanted. And can you imagine how much he would demand salary wise anyway? Not worth it.

I think I found your San Francisco story but I think you got it backwards.
http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/8...ut-in-San-Fran

[habernac]

Originally Posted by Iggy's Forehead

What is this "happy" news coming out of San Francisco you speak of? Is it them having the first guy this year to get 50 games for testing positive? Is it Barry Zito blowing up and his massive contract?

You obviously don't follow baseball very closely, San Francisco is in an even worse boat than Toronto, with the 2nd worst offense in the bigs and below average pitching.

At this point, I don't see Bonds demanding a high salary. How could he? There is obvious collusion in MLB not to sign him, I think he'd take whatever he could get at this point.

I follow baseball just fine. Can't find the article, but every sentence from the Giant ballplayers was "no offense to Barry, but it's fun to come to the ballpark now that he's not here". The team isn't going to contend anytime soon, but you can blame management there for that situation.

[habernac]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

I think I found your San Francisco story but I think you got it backwards.
http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/8...ut-in-San-Fran

No quotes from the players in that one. The only people who miss Barry are the fans and the marketers. None of the players do.

[Caged Great]

Well, The jays offensive prowess came to life in game 1 of the double header

3-0 Cleveland

[Saint Troy]

22 innings scoreless and counting........the team will be playing for jobs tonight methinks. There is no way for ownership to sell the poop that is this team to the public without heads rolling. I'd love to see that smug s.o.b. Ricciardi walk the plank, I like Gibbons but he is not a mlb manager, it's obvious his teams do not play hard for him.

[moon]

Originally Posted by JayP

Bonds would DH almost exclusively.

Base-running is hardly worth even considering in any baseball discussion. Either way we're not talking about Benji Molina here.

His power numbers may be down, but that doesn't mean a whole lot when you're dropping from the best in the league.

23th best SLG% in 2006 at .545 (Highest Jays is Wells at 24 with .542)
11th best SLG% in 2007 at .565 (Highest Jay is Rios at 39 with .498)

9th best OPS in 2006 at .999 (Highest Jay is Wells at 31 with .899)
3rd best OPS in 2007 at 1.045 (No Jays in top 50)

Oh, and he led the league in OBP in both 2006 and 2007 by a sizable margin.

Put those numbers together and you clearly have a top 5-10 hitter in the league.

The only real argument against Bonds is the chemistry issue. He would step in and be far and away the Jays best hitter. For all of April you heard the Jays talk about how great the clubhouse is now and how it's going to propel them to great success. How's that working out?

I was referring to him being worth 16 million. Taking out half the league automatically reduces his value. Drop the teams that already have a DH or positional liability player and the number probably drops by 5-7 teams in the AL. Add in the teams that can't afford him and realistically there is about 3-5 teams max that could bring him in. In my view that makes him no longer a 16 million dollar player. And I think at 44 with his knee issues and no steroids to help with the healing, we are talking Benji Molina.

His BA and Slugging have taken big hits lately as well. As seen with Thomas the drop off can come quickly with guys 40+.

Originally Posted by Iggy's Forehead

I notice you say "on a team like the Jays who aren't going anywhere". To me that is the exact reason you bring in Bonds. The Yankees have everything to lose, the Jays have nothing to lose. It's May 12th, the Jays are by no means out of it and have arguably the best rotation in baseball. I just don't understand this mentality from Jays fans where they don't disrupt a 3rd or 4th place finish again. Worrying about effecting young players, are we really looking to next year again? And what about next year when nobody can hit, are we still going to talk about the future?

I am not sure if this was directed at me or not but I am not a Jays fan. I think with the Yankees and Red Sox in the division and Cleveland/Minny/Detroit also in the running for the WC with the start the Jays have and "talent" they have that yes they should be looking to next year already.

Bonds may be able to help a team this year, I just am not sure that he is going to turn around the Jays offense on his own or if he miraculously was able to that at this point it would do that much.