It's a little confusing then that the Scottsdale mayor is still drilling home the idea that they will not be allowed to draw services from his city. I suppose maybe he doesn't see extending the services several miles in Phoenix as economically or logistically feasible and is anticipating that Meruelo and Pheonix might try to push the issue.
To me, it's a politician in an election year acting like a politician in an election year. It's not a bad strategy. But the statement truly does come down to "not on our doorstep." He's counting on people not actually knowing what's in the auction listing.
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While the piece of land is technically in Phoenix, the roads feeding the site will require approval of both Phoenix and Scottsdale, along with ADOT. As I've mentioned a number of times, the municipalities have to cooperate to get major projects completed. If Scottsdale is against this project they can make this very difficult to impossible to execute without huge infrastructure improvements off the 64th street interchange in Phoenix and may not have contiguous access to the site. This also does not include the potential disruption and likely lawsuits from Desert Ridge and Grayhawk residents. The politics in this are going to get ugly and will make the Tempe shenanigans look tame in comparison. There are multiple municipalities and communities involved, and several of them have very deep pockets. The NIMBY set has yet to get fired up like it did in Tempe. When it does here this is going to be very hard to sell, especially in the midst of an election cycle. Timing couldn't be worse for Meruelo and the Coyotes.
Worth noting those huge infrastructure improvements to the 64th St. interchange are one of the conditions of the land being sold at auction, as the Scottsdale mayor mentioned himself. They're also included in the proposal.
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... as a condition of sale, the 100 acres of property must develop entirely the 64th Street off ramp for access. ...
... I have demanded that the 64th Street - AZ Loop 101 north exit be built out to serve the area, again to the west of Scottsdale Road. At our meeting, the Arizona State Land Department agreed that these requirements will be bundled with any successful bid for the property. ...
It's all in there. Can't speak to the NIMBY opposition, though, although it's hard to say whether it'd be strong enough to actually halt construction or just draw settlements.
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Last edited by TheScorpion; 04-08-2024 at 10:42 PM.
If anything the mayor of Scottsdale saved us the time of having to dig through an Arizona government website with those stipulations. So many more people will read this in the venue he's provided than in the actual posting. Posturing or not, it's useful info.
If getting support from voters means having to prevent your local NHL club from having a barn to play in, you have to wonder how badly citizens in the area actually want a team.
The whole fiasco is so funny to me. At first the situation was that you can't have the arena too far away from certain population centers because the commute sucks, but now you can't have it close either because no one wants the hassle of what a new development would bring. There just seems to be no winning no matter what they do.
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Last edited by FlamesAddiction; 04-08-2024 at 10:51 PM.
Well, I'm just talking about what the Scottsdale and Phoenix mayors apparently discussed, according to the Scottsdale mayor's statement. They both agree that if the project goes forward, the utility lines must be extended from 56 St. in Phoenix. Meruelo claims to have money set aside for utility construction. I don't buy it, but if the auction does end in his favour, that'll be one of the things he'll have to live up to.
I have no intention of dissecting a corpse until it's actually dead. I'll look at the deal as it's presented with the assumption that it's possible until proven otherwise — with the caveat that Meruelo has a terrible track record, but also the knowledge that his proposal has made it this far past the AZ Land Board without meaningful opposition. (The Scottsdale mayor doesn't count).
I would be stunned if the auction process is interrupted, and I would be similarly stunned if Meruelo sells the team if he has the winning bid. That's the one and only path for the team to remain in AZ. There are many other far less successful outcomes — including a Baltimore Ravens-esque one in which the team moves but Meruelo retains control over all "Coyotes" assets.
I don't really understand the bolded TBH. This is about assessing whether the proposal being put forward by the Meruelo group is at all credible. It would be foolish to assess the deal "as presented" based on everything we know.
The bolded just means I'm not going to write the Coyotes' obituary until they're in Salt Lake.
I think if the deal wasn't at least somewhat credible, it would've already failed. Whether Meruelo is financially able to execute it is what I question.
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The Devils, Avalanche, Hurricanes, and Jets 2.0 were all able to get their new branding done over the summer in time to start play in the fall after their sales were finalized in May. The Coyotes had a longer lead time. The Flames and Stars kept the same uniform designs after they moved, but did change logos (in Dallas's case, they just added a shoulder patch).
If the sale/move is announced before June, they should have plenty of time. I'm sure Smith has already been working behind the scenes on branding concepts.
The one difference here is with Fanatics in charge of NHL jerseys starting next season, they might have to wear blank white sweaters for the first half of next season whether they have a name or not.
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The bolded just means I'm not going to write the Coyotes' obituary until they're in Salt Lake.
I think if the deal wasn't at least somewhat credible, it would've already failed. Whether Meruelo is financially able to execute it is what I question.
My point is that I wouldn’t take any information at face value if it is being presented by a “charlatan”. Everything we know about the deal has been provided by the Coyotes and IMO I have yet to hear anything credible.
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Worth noting those huge infrastructure improvements to the 64th St. interchange are one of the conditions of the land being sold at auction, as the Scottsdale mayor mentioned himself. They're also included in the proposal.
Which will require support and approval from Scottsdale. The condition may exist, but how can that be enforced prior to the sale of the land? Do the Coyotes have to put $200M in escrow for those improvements, or is this just something to drive potential bidders away? I'm thinking the later because of the political hurdles that need to be addressed to make the improvements.
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It's all in there. Can't speak to the NIMBY opposition, though, although it's hard to say whether it'd be strong enough to actually halt construction or just draw settlements.
See Tempe. The NIMBY set can kill any and all development if they hit the local council of the various constituencies. This is an election year and jobs are on the line. No one is going to put their political career in the line for an unpopular development project. This gets loud enough and it will be as successful as every other attempt to get this thing rolling. Just because land is purchased does not mean permits will be approved. Still lots of moving pieces and lots of politicking to go on. I don't see this coming to fruition based on the political and economic climate of the region. Things can change, but that would require a huge change in direction by many of the players involved.
I just want to see if I am understanding this correctly...
So basically the land being purchased is technically within Phoenix, but right up against a more developed area of Scottsdale. The infrastructure on the Phoenix side would have to be extended several miles if they were to service the development, which doesn't sound feasible on their end. The Coyotes owner was told by the City of Scottsdale that they do not have the sewer or water capacity to support a development like that, particularly one not even in their in their city. The Coyotes owner then goes ahead and presents a development plan that needs Scottsdale infrastructure to work, even though he was already told no.
Is that pretty much the gist of it?
That's my take away. Although the strength of the verbal objection makes me think Scottsdale may not have as much control over this as they would like and may have to fight it legally. Other Pheonicians on here will have a better thought here.
I live in San Mateo county and Santa Clara county isn't telling me how to place my drought resistant grass i tell you.
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I don't really understand the bolded TBH. This is about assessing whether the proposal being put forward by the Meruelo group is at all credible. It would be foolish to assess the deal "as presented" based on everything we know.
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Originally Posted by TheScorpion
The bolded just means I'm not going to write the Coyotes' obituary until they're in Salt Lake.
The one difference here is with Fanatics in charge of NHL jerseys starting next season, they might have to wear blank white sweaters for the first half of next season whether they have a name or not.
True, although, my understanding is that the Fanatics changes will be minimal. The jerseys will still be made in the same factory in Quebec that has been making NHL jerseys since the 1970s and they're not even going to change the templates for at least a couple of seasons. From what I've seen, the biggest change might be some different fabrics -- like getting rid of the waffle pattern fabric on the shoulders.
Then, you consider the changes the Jazz have made to their uniforms since Smith bought the team, and they might be going with a very minimalist design anyway.
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Yeah, it's a completely different situation. Lipkin was drafted in 2021 and just finished his 2nd college season, so if he went back for another year, he could have done like Justin Schultz and declared himself a free agent next June 1.
If you have a player in that situation who's willing to sign his ELC, you have to do it even if your hands are tied for other moves.
Didn't the Tropicana just get imploded to make way for the stadium?
Just checked... Not imploded yet. As of Tuesday, it's now closed to begin preparation for the demolition, which is expected for October.
Last I heard they still had to decide (or approve?) the method of demolition. I say give a sledge hammer, crowbar and hardhat to every tourist who walks up and let them have it it.
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The one difference here is with Fanatics in charge of NHL jerseys starting next season, they might have to wear blank white sweaters for the first half of next season whether they have a name or not.
I have not specifically researched the demographics of Salt Lake City recently, but the Salt Lake City Whites would have been fitting last I knew. Maybe Winsor Salt could sponsor the jerseys?
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