General Ongoing Coyotes saga thread

[Calgary4LIfe]

I haven't followed the Coyotes in-depth since they moved to Phoenix, but weren't they actually 'decent' in terms of support until they moved to Glendale? If this falls through, couldn't they move back? Sounds like the biggest issue in terms of fan support is how far away Glendale is. I may completely be in the dark and this could very well have just been a completely idiotic question, but is there anything other than bad optics that would prevent them from returning to wherever they first arrived in the area?

[kyuss275]

Originally Posted by Calgary4LIfe

I haven't followed the Coyotes in-depth since they moved to Phoenix, but weren't they actually 'decent' in terms of support until they moved to Glendale? If this falls through, couldn't they move back? Sounds like the biggest issue in terms of fan support is how far away Glendale is. I may completely be in the dark and this could very well have just been a completely idiotic question, but is there anything other than bad optics that would prevent them from returning to wherever they first arrived in the area?

They played where the Phoenix suns played for the first bunch of years. The staduim was not built for hockey, but i think attendance was good because of location.

[Jay Random]

Hockeydb has yearly average attendance figures for Phoenix here:

http://www.hockeydb.com/nhl-attendan...h.php?tmi=7450

According to their figures, attendance averaged at least 13,000 each season, and usually hovered around 15,000, until the team filed for bankruptcy in 2009. There was a substantial increase when the team moved to Glendale in 2003, which makes sense, actually. You would expect to draw better in a building that was actually designed for hockey and has unobstructed sight lines from all the seats.

What I can't find as easily is paid attendance or the average price of the tickets sold. How many of the pre-2009 tickets went to paying customers, and how many were used to paper the house, is not information that people seem eager to disclose.

[kerriffic]

Uh Oh, now what?

Nick Kypreos ‏@RealKyper 4h
Hearing Glendale council will not approve 15M cash demand by RSE group 2 manage #Coyotes arena. RSE asked for 15M to help secure #125m loan.

Nick Kypreos ‏@RealKyper 3h
Council believes debt created by team is so gr8 that team is all but guaranteed to fail + move shortly because of loses created by no equity

Nick Kypreos ‏@RealKyper 3h
#NHL experiencing issues caused by debt loads on some clubs like #Devils. Seattle appears not to b option as rink won't be ready til 2014-15

[PegCityFlamesFan]

Don't worry, Monday is almost here....

[Jordan!]

Originally Posted by kerriffic

Uh Oh, now what?

Nick Kypreos ‏@RealKyper 4h
Hearing Glendale council will not approve 15M cash demand by RSE group 2 manage #Coyotes arena. RSE asked for 15M to help secure #125m loan.

Nick Kypreos ‏@RealKyper 3h
Council believes debt created by team is so gr8 that team is all but guaranteed to fail + move shortly because of loses created by no equity

Nick Kypreos ‏@RealKyper 3h
#NHL experiencing issues caused by debt loads on some clubs like #Devils. Seattle appears not to b option as rink won't be ready til 2014-15

Kypreos is full of it. He has ZERO sources throughout all of this and is purely speculating.

[kyuss275]

Originally Posted by Bouw N Arrow

Kypreos is full of it. He has ZERO sources throughout all of this and is purely speculating.

Yep. His last statment of Seattle not being an option makes no sense. He says the arena will not be ready until 2014/15? Its going to be a lot longer than that for Hanson's building to be built. The mayor of Seattle already said that Key Arena would be ready for this season, even though its less than ideal.

[kerriffic]

Yeah, you know I can buy that his last tweet is just speculation, just brought it up for discussions sake.

I don't understand though bouw, how you can say that his comments on the RSE matter is complete speculation. What motive does he have to do that? Some people on here chastise others for making guesses on what the NHL has done because "we don't know what goes on in the boardrooms". Someone who is more connected than you or me makes a comment and they are "full of it". I don't care what happens with this either way, just bringing stuff up for the sake of discussion

Personally I've never found Nick Kypreos to be that bad, he's no Garrioch. Maybe I'm way off.

Honest question who would you trust to be reporting issues on this matter?

[Jordan!]

Originally Posted by Bouw N Arrow

The groundwork for an agreement is in place, there will be give and take on the minor issues.

Vote is July 2nd.

raig Morgan @cmorganfoxaz
21st June 2013 from TwitLonger



Glendale spokesperson Julie Watters: "We are continuing our negotiations with the Renaissance group and we expect that early next week we will have some sort of a statement or press release and it will be with the council's direction for the management of our arena.

"We are also hopeful that in that time, we can discuss everything in more specific detail such as deal points. Our current anticipation is that we will take this to a public vote -- for the council to bring for a public vote on Tuesday, July 2."

[troutman]

New proposal gives city option to purchase Coyotes


http://www.glendalestar.com/news/art...a4bcf887a.html

In the drama that is the proposed sale of the Phoenix Coyotes, yet another possible sale attempt has been given to the Glendale City Council in documents obtained by The Glendale Star.

The Star has learned that a private company has come forward with a plan that would allow the City of Glendale to present a proposal to help the city buy the Coyotes directly from the National Hockey League. The company has asked to meet with city council to discuss the details of their proposal and how, “…they can make this alternative a reality for the city, the Phoenix Coyotes and the NHL.”

When approached before Friday’s council executive session meeting, Mayor Jerry Weiers said he had not seen such proposal.

According to the documents, the proposed plan would, “..cost the city less and provide it more flexibility while still providing the NHL what it seeks,” a full buy-out within five years.

[Northendzone]

the laughs in the soap opera keep coming.........the optics of a city owning an NHL team are awful. imagine pressing for a tax increase or layoffs to city staff, while trying to keep mike smith's salary below $5.5 million per year......

[Cowperson]

the laughs in the soap opera keep coming.........the optics of a city owning an NHL team are awful. imagine pressing for a tax increase or layoffs to city staff, while trying to keep mike smith's salary below $5.5 million per year......

The Province of Manitoba was guaranteeing Jets losses for a few season before the team moved to Phoenix, basically the same thing, so it wouldn't be the first time for this particular franchise.

Cowperson

[Jordan!]

Originally Posted by troutman

New proposal gives city option to purchase Coyotes


http://www.glendalestar.com/news/art...a4bcf887a.html

In the drama that is the proposed sale of the Phoenix Coyotes, yet another possible sale attempt has been given to the Glendale City Council in documents obtained by The Glendale Star.

The Star has learned that a private company has come forward with a plan that would allow the City of Glendale to present a proposal to help the city buy the Coyotes directly from the National Hockey League. The company has asked to meet with city council to discuss the details of their proposal and how, “…they can make this alternative a reality for the city, the Phoenix Coyotes and the NHL.”

When approached before Friday’s council executive session meeting, Mayor Jerry Weiers said he had not seen such proposal.

According to the documents, the proposed plan would, “..cost the city less and provide it more flexibility while still providing the NHL what it seeks,” a full buy-out within five years.

Pretty sure that's against the NHL charter - it was also David Pastor who brought this up to Glendale. Dude is straight DESPERATE for the team. His PR company was sending this to Canadian media.

[Northendzone]

Originally Posted by Cowperson

The Province of Manitoba was guaranteeing Jets losses for a few season before the team moved to Phoenix, basically the same thing, so it wouldn't be the first time for this particular franchise.

Cowperson

but these new proposals seem to suggest that the CoG can own the Yotes for several "small" payments......given that the Yotes have already sunk $50,000,000 or so in, they may as well go in for the remaining $170,000,000 or whatever the number.

[Brannigans Law]

Originally Posted by Cowperson

The Province of Manitoba was guaranteeing Jets losses for a few season before the team moved to Phoenix, basically the same thing, so it wouldn't be the first time for this particular franchise.

Cowperson

I think there's a fairly large difference between owning something and propping something up as a city though. This is getting pretty ridiculous... we're now in July. I can't possibly fathome how this team moves out of Phoenix this season... and they still aren't anywhere near finding an owner. It's looking just pathetic for the NHL.... but I honestly am not shocked. There's no way this team is moving to QC or Ontario to screw the NHL out of expansion fees.

Of course, the NHL could simply ask for a monster relocation fee instead? Or is that difficult to justify considering they didn't ask Winnipeg owners to shell out much by comparison to what an expansion/relocation fee to Southern Ont?

[troutman]

Welcome to Glendale Arizona
You can check-out any time you like,
But you can never leave

[troutman]

The Fortress loan is at 9%:

http://www.arizonasports.com/43/1644...ship-situation

As currently constructed, RSE seems like a group of investors, to say it nicely, or carpet-baggers, to say it with attitude. Putting so little money into this up front while accepting a loan at a high interest rate makes the plan obvious. Buy the team and lose a little bit of money at first, and then make a lot of money selling the team to another ownership group. If RSE can't put up more of its own money, where are they going to find the money to put into the team? If they skimp on the team, fans won't show up. If there's no fans, the owners can then claim they tried to make the Valley hockey country, but it was all of us that failed.

All of this goes away if Bettman lowers the price. There are local, hockey-loving people in this Valley who will buy the team for $140 million and ensure stability for years to come. Bettman isn't interested in years to come. Glendale must stand its ground. Just because Bettman wants his money doesn't mean Glendale should pay off the new ownership group. Bettman can have his sale price for a long-term lease or he should allow a different ownership group to buy it cheaper on a short-term lease.

As this situation is currently constructed, I predict the Coyotes/NHL/RSE come to an agreement in the next two weeks. There will be loud celebration. Then, little will be done to improve the team. Don't blame GM Don Maloney. As the losses mount and the fan support dwindles, RSE will claim massive losses. They will act like millionaire victims. The Coyotes will be sold and moved.

If nothing changes, we will have hockey next year. In 2018, however, some city in the US or Canada will have a contest to name their new team. It appears Glendale is choosing a slow death.

[troutman]

Dave Zorn ‏@davezorn72
GWI Bolick: “we will be watching very, very carefully.”

Dave Zorn ‏@davezorn72
GWI Clint Bolick: If the deal is over 6-mil and “at the end of the day to keep the hockey team, it looks like it will be illegal subsidy”

[Resolute 14]

I was wondering when Goldwater would start blowing more hot air. Been a while since they got back into their PETA like "look at me!" attention whoring.

[Sidney Crosby's Hat]

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

I was wondering when Goldwater would start blowing more hot air. Been a while since they got back into their PETA like "look at me!" attention whoring.

You would think that they'd have a case considering that there are actual bids on the table for $6 million to manage the rink.