Ring Road To Nowhere

[TheSutterDynasty]

Originally Posted by iggy_oi

In an emergency situation if your car could fit I would say sure, lane split if it is safe to do so, unfortunately it's not possible for a car, but it is for a motorcycle so what is the issue? If traffic is flowing in the heat then the wind keeps the rider cooled, it's only in gridlock where this becomes an issue and in gridlock it really makes no difference to drivers if bikers lane split.

If you really need to go to the bathroom and it's an emergency you have the option of pulling to the shoulder and doing your business, so does the motorcyclist, they just would also have the option to lane split instead. Most cops wouldn't ticket you in those circumstances anyways but if that is the main reason you oppose lane splitting I would happily support gridlock bathroom breaks being legalized. Just like I don't want a biker to suffer from heat stroke, I'd hate for anyone to suffer from uromysitisis poisoning.



You knew the air was smokey, you knew that it was hot outside and I'm assuming you know your way home from wherever you were riding from (meaning the hill didn't just magically pop up) so none of these things should have been a surprise to you. And cyclist lane split or have a designated lane to begin with, so even though your post was probably meant to be sarcastic it's kind of a poor example to use in the first place.

So a cyclist has to plan ahead but someone riding a motorcycle doesn't?

[Slava]

Why all these hard feelings towards motorcyclists? Why would it be so terrible to allow lane splitting?

It's strange that people are so consumed with how other people travel. If you want to bike, go right ahead. We should take precautions to protect you as a cyclist with infrastructure and rules of the road to ensure it's safe. We build pedestrian bridges and setup rules and infrastructure to keep them safe. But why not extend the same courtesy, in terms of precautions, for motorcycles?

[Resolute 14]

Umm, we do? We have rules of the road and infrastructure that attempts to keep all vehicles, including motorcycles, safe. That's a whole lot of emotional rhetoric being put forward to justify giving motorcyclists special privileges, the safety of which is being questioned.

[Canehdianman]

Why should we provide special rights to people who can't even afford a proper truck?

If all you can afford is a motorbike (which doesn't even have room for a truck nutz), then you should honestly save yourself the embarrassment and take the damn bus.

[Slava]

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

Umm, we do? We have rules of the road and infrastructure that attempts to keep all vehicles, including motorcycles, safe. That's a whole lot of emotional rhetoric being put forward to justify giving motorcyclists special privileges, the safety of which is being questioned.

I think that a lot of this questioning comes from people who don't ride motorcycles.

[Resolute 14]

So only the safety and desires of motorcyclists matters? Not that of everyone else on the road?

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by Slava

Why all these hard feelings towards motorcyclists? Why would it be so terrible to allow lane splitting?

It's no different from how people don't agree that cyclists should have different rules, like going through stop signs, lane splitting, cutting onto sidewalks. And the arguments are the same - when does convenience for some people on the road trump safety?

[GGG]

There are jurisdictions that allow lane splitting so the evidence is outthere do determine if lane splitting poses risk. If it doesn't everyone would benefit from it as it increases carrying capacity capacity of the highway.

[Resolute 14]

Originally Posted by GGG

There are jurisdictions that allow lane splitting so the evidence is outthere do determine if lane splitting poses risk. If it doesn't everyone would benefit from it as it increases carrying capacity capacity of the highway.

California DOT deliberately does not track incidents involving lane splitting. But in the 14-month period when it did, it found that one in six accidents involving a motorcycle involved lane splitting.

[Slava]

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

So only the safety and desires of motorcyclists matters? Not that of everyone else on the road?

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

It's no different from how people don't agree that cyclists should have different rules, like going through stop signs, lane splitting, cutting onto sidewalks. And the arguments are the same - when does convenience for some people on the road trump safety?

How does this impact you as a car driver? Let's say there is an accident on Deerfoot Trail and traffic is backed way up. It's 32 degrees and for no real reason, you just think that motorcyclists should sit in the traffic? It has literally no bearing on you whether I pass you. There is no safety concern for people in cars because you're just sitting there.

A lot of this seems to stem from people worried that this is somehow motorcyclists "getting one over" on them. Like there is a big backup and they should have to sit and suffer like everyone else. The so-called safety concerns are questionable. We're not talking about lane splitting at 120km/hr and weaving between vehicles inches away from accidents and certain death. It's for obvious situations where there is a legitimate concern for someone sitting in full motorcycling attire in the baking sun. In jurisdictions that allow this it is usually accompanied by a speed at which that is prohibited. That speed doesn't have to be very high to make it both effective for the motorcyclist and at the same time safe for everyone on the road.

[Ryan Coke]

Yeah, don't get the argument that them getting in front doesn't affect everyone else. When we are at the next set of lights past the off ramp do we not need to give them space like we do every other vehicle? When the freeway squeezes down to one lane because of the accident I can just stay 10' back if the next 4 wheeled vehicle and ignore the 2 wheeled vehicles between us?

Really, driving in a city is more of a team game, where how each individual plays does affect everyone else. On its face lane splitting seems dangerous, and will slow down vehicles that are being passed later on. The overall efficiency gains seem very short lived. But I'm open to possible conflicting data.

[Resolute 14]

Honestly Slava, it doesn't help that your argument seems to oscillate between lane splitting as a regular practice and lane splitting when the roadway is stopped due to an incident ahead, depending on which is more convenient to argue.

[Slava]

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

Honestly Slava, it doesn't help that your argument seems to oscillate between lane splitting as a regular practice and lane splitting when the roadway is stopped due to an incident ahead, depending on which is more convenient to argue.

Well I don't want people just riding ahead of two cars at a stoplight "just because". I agree that is a bit vague and wishy-washy, but I just think there are circumstances where it makes sense and other times where its just someone who wants to be at the front of the line.

[troutman]

Slava and I were talking - what is the construction on HWY 22X west of where the ring road will be, between the four lane highway?

[4X4]

Originally Posted by troutman

Slava and I were talking - what is the construction on HWY 22X west of where the ring road will be, between the four lane highway?

How far west? Past 37th?

[troutman]

Originally Posted by 4X4

How far west? Past 37th?

Yes, around Red Deer Lake. Well past where I think the ring road will be.

[iggy_oi]

Originally Posted by TheSutterDynasty

So a cyclist has to plan ahead but someone riding a motorcycle doesn't?

Gridlock isn't always something you plan for. If I were riding on a hot day during rush hour I'd avoid southbound Deerfoot around Anderson or northbound Deerfoot pretty much anywhere past memorial, with that being said it is very hard to write up or enforce a law that states you can lane split at certain speeds or lower but only some of the time, so you can't really leave it open to interpretation. I think lower speed lane splitting in gridlock should be allowed because there are situations where it could prevent a potential incident. Yes accidents could happen, they could also happen if the biker didn't lane split and the driver beside him switched lanes into them because they forgot to shoulder check out of their frustration from the traffic jam. How is lane splitting any different from cyclists riding between a vehicle and the curb on a street with no designated bike lane?

[4X4]

Originally Posted by troutman

Yes, around Red Deer Lake. Well past where I think the ring road will be.

I meant to go down there today to double check, but I didn't have time. I'm sure there's an RV storage lot going in around 53rd, not to be confused with the one that popped up on 37th, just north of the cemetary. They had scrapers and whatnot there the last time I drove by a couple months ago.

Also there are plans for another community west of Bridlehood, that wouldn't go through until the RR was underway, so that's what it must be. Upgrades to 22x are just prudent to do now, since the stretch is already under construction.

[Bunk]

Originally Posted by 4X4

I meant to go down there today to double check, but I didn't have time. I'm sure there's an RV storage lot going in around 53rd, not to be confused with the one that popped up on 37th, just north of the cemetary. They had scrapers and whatnot there the last time I drove by a couple months ago.

Also there are plans for another community west of Bridlehood, that wouldn't go through until the RR was underway, so that's what it must be. Upgrades to 22x are just prudent to do now, since the stretch is already under construction.

Not to do with that community (the first phase of which will be closer to 146th Avenue to start)

They are realigning 22x, shrinking median to a more normal width, it also has to do with what will be an on ramp from 22x northbound SWRR.

Also of note, the access from 22x onto 37th street will be permanently closed soon.

[4X4]

Not really ring road related, but since the people that seem to know stuff like this will likely read here, does anyone know how long the construction at 68th st. NE is going to last? It used to connect Country Hills Blvd and 96 ave, but they're doing some undergrounds there, and it looks like it'll be awhile. In fact, the sign says 68th st. is closed (instead of temporarily closed), so I'm not sure what to think. It's a disruption to a route I take often and I'm hoping it eventually connects again.