2014/2015 Trade Speculation and Rumors

[Poe969]

Maybe he's just saying he won't to drive up prices. Maybe he's had talks with Carolina about Semin but wants to be over paid to take that contract and is saying that to drive up his price. I highly doubt it but I guess it's a possibility. Treliving seems like the kind of guy who's pretty honest and doesn't BS for the sake of BSing.

[Fire of the Phoenix]

Originally Posted by Vinny01

With all the talk of taking contracts from the Hurricanes what are people's thoughts on Jeff Skinner? He is only 23 and has scored 30+ a couple of times. He has 4 more years at $5.5M but some highly questionable concussion history.

Ward+Skinner for Hiller, Granlund, 2nd, Raymond/Jones?

I'd do that trade without hesitation.

[DJones]

If we put push Wideman to our 5th defense that would be ideal. Have a trustworthy 3rd pairing and a power play specialist.

[mikephoen]

Originally Posted by DJones

If we put push Wideman to our 5th defense that would be ideal. Have a trustworthy 3rd pairing and a power play specialist.

Yeah, Wideman was 4th in LEAGUE scoring for defensemen. Probably best to keep a guy like that's minutes down and spend a lot of money on someone else to do it.

[DJones]

Originally Posted by mikephoen

Yeah, Wideman was 4th in LEAGUE scoring for defensemen. Probably best to keep a guy like that's minutes down and spend a lot of money on someone else to do it.

15 minutes with a bottom pairing partner. Give them favorable zone starts.

Then another however many minutes on the powerplay and there is always the option of playing him more when needed.

He'd get his chances and we wouldn't be trapped in our end as much. Love them both but Wideman and Russell had some scary moments this year.

[Poe969]

Ya, Wideman would be a second pairing guy and Russell would slide down and be an ideal #5. It would be great to get someone to either be a top pairing guy or a really good second pairing guy.

As for the trade with the Hurricanes for Skinner....hec no! We'd have to give up Granlund and a 2nd???? Skinner is a cap dump at this point, the kid plays so scared that he isn't really productive anymore. If it wasn't for Semin, Skinner would probably have the worst contract on that team.

[Poe969]

Originally Posted by DJones

15 minutes with a bottom pairing partner. Give them favorable zone starts.

The issue with this is that if Wideman is on your bottom pairing, the guy with him isn't going to be that good, say an England type guy. Why would you start the not that good guy in the offensive zone. Breaking up the pairings isn't the best idea too often as you want the guys to develop chemistry. Wideman generates a lot of offense and helps out a lot of forwards (specifically Johnny). Wideman is better off on the second pairing with Russell moving down to the bottom pairing.

[Phanuthier]

Originally Posted by Poe969

The issue with this is that if Wideman is on your bottom pairing, the guy with him isn't going to be that good, say an England type guy. Why would you start the not that good guy in the offensive zone. Breaking up the pairings isn't the best idea too often as you want the guys to develop chemistry. Wideman generates a lot of offense and helps out a lot of forwards (specifically Johnny). Wideman is better off on the second pairing with Russell moving down to the bottom pairing.

Bang on. Wideman, Engelland and Treliving have all talked a lot about how everyone was able to play better because they got more minutes. Wideman is a lot better of a player at over 20 minutes then 15 minutes. I think if you go out and sign someone to take Wideman's minutes, you are better off trading Wideman and not keeping him as a No 5. This does not make a lot of sense to me.

Also, I think we already have our #5 guy who subs in for the top #4, in Engelland. I also think we have a #6 guy that can fill into a No 5 or even No 4, and that is Schlemko. I also think Wotherspoon will push for Engelland's spot this year. I think the roster will have to be filled out at the No 7-8 D, but not anywhere in the top 4, otherwise you probably end up trading Wideman, Russell or Engelland to make that happen.

[FlameZilla]

Russell & Wideman really upped their games when Giordano was injured. If they maintain that level consistently from here on out then they're a great 2nd pairing.

Brodie & Engelland were ok together. Brodie's skating really papered over a lot of the 'cracks' in Engelland's game.

If we acquired another top pairing D man to play with Giordano, the other 2 pairings could be rolled out fairly evenly without worrying too much about being exposed or overused.

Let's say we go hard after Dougie Hamilton with an offer sheet. It'd be a miracle, but it would also make our defence corps one of the strongest in the league:

Pairing 1: Giordano - Hamilton
Pairing 2A: Brodie - Engelland
Pairing 2B: Russell - Wideman

Pipe dream, but a good one.

[Sylvanfan]

Waaaay behind, but what team is going to be giving the Blackhawks a 1st rounder in this draft for Patrick Sharp? He is a good player and all, but realistically a 33 year old pending UFA forward is usually not worth a top 15 pick.

Does a team like Dallas or Florida want to give a pick where they are in the draft to shore up their depth up front? Because it seems to me that the teams that have the cap space like Dallas, Calgary, Ottawa, Winnipeg are all trying to get younger up front and won't want to move a pick that high. Nashville may be a potential fit, but their picks are highly valuable to that franchise and it would have to be a 2016 first.

I could see a 2016 first in play for Sharp. But of the teams who have 2015 firsts that maybe could use him as a push you over the top piece....they don't have the cap room to be able to add him without sending significant dollars back at Chicago.

[killer_carlson]

Wideman and Russell would be the #1 d-pairing on more than half the teams in the league based upon their play down the stretch and in the playoffs.

If they can put up that kind of performance against top line matchups, imagine what a 2nd pairing of Gio and Brodie could do out there against lesser competition?

[Poe969]

Originally Posted by killer_carlson

Wideman and Russell would be the #1 d-pairing on more than half the teams in the league based upon their play down the stretch and in the playoffs.

If they can put up that kind of performance against top line matchups, imagine what a 2nd pairing of Gio and Brodie could do out there against lesser competition?

Sorry, no. Well I guess Wideman and Russell would be the top pair on half the teams because half the teams in the league don't make the playoffs... They played great down the stretch and against the nucks but were manhandled by the ducks. Wideman's defensive game isn't the best and Russell's offensive game isn't the best either. They played way above their norm and I wouldn't count on that happening again. It'd be a terrible situation if Gio AND Brodie went down because our depth on D is probably the main reason we lost to the ducks. This team needs a big defender who can play the body and still chip in offensively.

[dammage79]

Cut Wideman and Russell some slack. They've earned it.

They're a legit 2nd pairing and proved it.

[Vinny01]

I still think the flames are best served to add a 2nd pairing LHD and slide Russell down to the third pit with Engellend

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by dammage79

Cut Wideman and Russell some slack. They've earned it.

They're a legit 2nd pairing and proved it.

This isn't directed at you - just quoting your post for the topic.

But what is it about defensive pairings that make fans say they've 'earned' it?

If you had 6 good, top 6 forwards, and you had a chance to get another top line guy, would you say 'no, the current guys have earned it'?

It's always better to continue to improve your team, regardless of how well the current guys have played.

(Note: not saying they aren't second pairing guys - they are. Just saying that doesn't mean we shouldn't upgrade)

[Five-hole]

Originally Posted by Vinny01

With all the talk of taking contracts from the Hurricanes what are people's thoughts on Jeff Skinner? He is only 23 and has scored 30+ a couple of times. He has 4 more years at $5.5M but some highly questionable concussion history.

Ward+Skinner for Hiller, Granlund, 2nd, Raymond/Jones?

What? What am I missing here? We trade a decent young center, high pick in a deep draft, and one reasonable contract and one iffy contract for two bad ones? Wtf?

[GranteedEV]

There are the top 3 D on the Blackhawks and Lightning:

Hedman
Stralman
Coburn

Keith
Seabrook
Hjamarsson

The Flames need to add a third top 3D. I think Wideman and Russell can both do fine in the Oduya / Garrison role (with a preference for Russell as he makes less bad pinches). I want to believe somebody in our system, whether that's Kulak, Hickey, Culkin, Wotherspoon, Sieloff, Rafikov, Kanzig, or maybe our draft pick this year, can be that top 3D.

I feel Schlemko-Wideman is an awesome bottom pairing and Gio-Brodie is the best top pairing in the NHL.

All I want is a #3D. From a cost perspective, especially after seeing the sizable Petry contract, I'm not sure we're gonna find that guy in free agency (but I'd still want to take a stab at Franson as he's a statistical possession-driver with size)

Gio-Brodie
Russell-Franson
Wideman-Schlemko

That looks a lot more steady and stable than what we were rolling last year.

One more thing to consider is that Russell is getting a raise in the 2016 season. I really like Kris Russell @ 2.6 AAV right now. I think up to 4.2 mil AAV is fair market value for him. But if you start talking middle pairing money (5.5+) with him, then you have to let him walk. That's doubly so because he's such a poor possession driver that you can only find so many interested buyers. Teams want to acquire solid possession guys like Leddy, Sekera and Coburn in trades, and that's not Russell's game.

So then if you plan to let Russell walk as UFA, that leaves a gap on the middle pairing anyways.

[DJones]

I think Brodie has set the bar for defensemen on the Flames. Don't think Russell would ask for 5.5. Don't think he'd get it in free agency either.

[ForeverFlameFan]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

There are the top 3 D on the Blackhawks and Lightning:

Hedman
Stralman
Coburn

Keith
Seabrook
Hjamarsson

The Flames need to add a third top 3D. I think Wideman and Russell can both do fine in the Oduya / Garrison role (with a preference for Russell as he makes less bad pinches). I want to believe somebody in our system, whether that's Kulak, Hickey, Culkin, Wotherspoon, Sieloff, Rafikov, Kanzig, or maybe our draft pick this year, can be that top 3D.

I feel Schlemko-Wideman is an awesome bottom pairing and Gio-Brodie is the best top pairing in the NHL.

All I want is a #3D. From a cost perspective, especially after seeing the sizable Petry contract, I'm not sure we're gonna find that guy in free agency (but I'd still want to take a stab at Franson as he's a statistical possession-driver with size)

Gio-Brodie
Russell-Franson
Wideman-Schlemko

That looks a lot more steady and stable than what we were rolling last year.

One more thing to consider is that Russell is getting a raise in the 2016 season. I really like Kris Russell @ 2.6 AAV right now. I think up to 4.2 mil AAV is fair market value for him. But if you start talking middle pairing money (5.5+) with him, then you have to let him walk. That's doubly so because he's such a poor possession driver that you can only find so many interested buyers. Teams want to acquire solid possession guys like Leddy, Sekera and Coburn in trades, and that's not Russell's game.

So then if you plan to let Russell walk as UFA, that leaves a gap on the middle pairing anyways.

Franson is not a #3. If we signed him, he'd be playing bottom pairing with Engelland.

... And I just cringed at an Engelland/Franson pairing.

[mikephoen]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

There are the top 3 D on the Blackhawks and Lightning:

Hedman
Stralman
Coburn

Keith
Seabrook
Hjamarsson

The Flames need to add a third top 3D. I think Wideman and Russell can both do fine in the Oduya / Garrison role (with a preference for Russell as he makes less bad pinches). I want to believe somebody in our system, whether that's Kulak, Hickey, Culkin, Wotherspoon, Sieloff, Rafikov, Kanzig, or maybe our draft pick this year, can be that top 3D.

I feel Schlemko-Wideman is an awesome bottom pairing and Gio-Brodie is the best top pairing in the NHL.

All I want is a #3D. From a cost perspective, especially after seeing the sizable Petry contract, I'm not sure we're gonna find that guy in free agency (but I'd still want to take a stab at Franson as he's a statistical possession-driver with size)

Gio-Brodie
Russell-Franson
Wideman-Schlemko

That looks a lot more steady and stable than what we were rolling last year.

One more thing to consider is that Russell is getting a raise in the 2016 season. I really like Kris Russell @ 2.6 AAV right now. I think up to 4.2 mil AAV is fair market value for him. But if you start talking middle pairing money (5.5+) with him, then you have to let him walk. That's doubly so because he's such a poor possession driver that you can only find so many interested buyers. Teams want to acquire solid possession guys like Leddy, Sekera and Coburn in trades, and that's not Russell's game.

So then if you plan to let Russell walk as UFA, that leaves a gap on the middle pairing anyways.

Are you trying to claim that Coburn is a better defenseman that Wideman? Brayden Coburn? Are you serious?

Just in these playoffs alone, Wideman has 3 more points (In 10 less games!) and played 10 minutes per game more. There is no aspect of the game that Coburn is better than Wideman. Other than size, but Coburn doesn't even play that big.

In his last four regular seasons COMBINED, Coburn had ONE more point than Wideman had this year alone.

What on earth could Wideman have done this year to earn some respect. Russell and Wideman were one of the best FIRST pairings in the league from the time Gio went down until the Flames were knocked out. There is no way any team in the league has Wideman on the 3rd pairing.