[Rumour] LeBrun: Flames to add secondary scoring. Friedman: A lot of people think Toffoli

[kyuss275]

Originally Posted by dammage79

IMO , Monahans not the issue. It's who he is playing with. Namely Ritchie. He is death valley on that line and nothing near him survives.

Originally Posted by Monahammer

There are some of y'all are too hard on Money. His advanced numbers have cleaned up awesomely this season. He is playing with dead weight at even strength.

Then there are some of you who literally post almost exclusively (or at least 50% of your posts) about Monahan being ####. These people are cancer to our fan base. You are what cause players to not want to play in markets like this. You can go #### yourselves.

Lol. If this isn’t an over reaction, I don’t know what is.

[Gaskal]

Originally Posted by kyuss275

Lol. If this isn’t an over reaction, I don’t know what is.

I mean they have a point. He's playing with Dube, who has glowing possession numbers but is so snakebit we could have Dube-branded anti venom... and Brett Ritchie.

https://twitter.com/user/status/1415766024172019721

If Dube finds even a bit of his scoring touch and we sub Ritchie out with an actual scoring winger and something that's not dead weight (like his old buddy Toffoli, make it happen Brad), I'd say we have the '22 version of the Nieminen-Nilson-Donovan line.

[NewFan]

I like Duehr play with Dube - Monahan.
Or call up Phillips. He and Dube should have some chemistry.

[Flamesfan05]

Originally Posted by kobasew19

Ritchie is a guy I can see being very valuable come playoff time. Plays heavy hockey, good skater and hits everything in sight. I wouldn't mind keeping him on the 4th line for these reasons.

Cool…except plays tend to die on his stick. He would be useful as a 3 min/night goon but the Flames already have Lucic, Gudbranson and Zadorov to handle the fisticuffs if needed
Nobody is going to miss him

[GioforPM]

Ritchie's useful for games where the Flames are getting blown out and Sutter sends out a line of Ritchie, Ruzicka, Lucic, Gudbranson and Zadorov to take the faceoff, like that time against the Sharks.

[talladega.25]

Originally Posted by dammage79

IMO , Monahans not the issue. It's who he is playing with. Namely Ritchie. He is death valley on that line and nothing near him survives.

I agree, I have actually liked Monahan all around game since Christmas. I honestly think Ritchie is horrendous, and Dube is borderline AHL talent right now too.
If we acquire a top 6 forward I would bump Coleman down to that line and I think it could be a legit middle six line.

[CsInMyBlood]

Originally Posted by Monahammer

There are some of y'all are too hard on Money. His advanced numbers have cleaned up awesomely this season. He is playing with dead weight at even strength.

Then there are some of you who literally post almost exclusively (or at least 50% of your posts) about Monahan being ####. These people are cancer to our fan base. You are what cause players to not want to play in markets like this. You can go #### yourselves.

The fact is Sean Monahan is the 3rd highest paid player on the team. $6.375 is worth 7.8% of the Flames cap.

He is a team worst -13. In 44 games he has 7 even strength points. The only players on the team with less are Richardson (4 in 24 games), Ruzicka (4 in 13 games), Pitlick (2 in 25 games), Valimaki (2 in 8 games) and Ritchie (0 in 23).

When defensive defensemen like Gudbranson, Zadorov and Tanev have more even strength points than your 3rd highest paid player its going to get noticed.

To me, blaming Brett Ritchie for Monahans woes is pretty weak. Monahans linemates have been:

MILAN LUCIC - SEAN MONAHAN - DILLON DUBE 81:48
MILAN LUCIC - TREVOR LEWIS - SEAN MONAHAN 73:30
TYLER PITLICK - SEAN MONAHAN - DILLON DUBE 66:49
BRAD RICHARDSON - TREVOR LEWIS - SEAN MONAHAN 44:08
BLAKE COLEMAN - SEAN MONAHAN - ANDREW MANGIAPANE 42:32
BRETT RITCHIE - SEAN MONAHAN - DILLON DUBE 34:55
TREVOR LEWIS - BLAKE COLEMAN - SEAN MONAHAN 29:03
SEAN MONAHAN - DILLON DUBE - ANDREW MANGIAPANE 24:40
SEAN MONAHAN - JOHNNY GAUDREAU - MATTHEW TKACHUK 18:56

As you can see Sean has played alongside Blake Coleman and Andrew Mangiapaine more than Brett Ritchie. So we actually need to blame Blake and Andrew for more of his woes than Ritchie?

The biggest problem is the Flames need cap for Gaudreau, Tkachuk, Kylington and Mangiapaine. Not to mention decisions made on Gudbranson and Zadorov. Players that are performing for the team. Again, 7.8% of the cap is tied to Monahan.

He's a problem.

[GioforPM]

^^ now do Monahan’s stats in those combinations. IIRC his stats away from the guys like Ritchie and Pitlick are pretty darn good. And at this point his salary, like Lucic or Zadorov, are not that relevant when choosing who to play with.

[getbak]

Toffoli is scoring at a 0.74 PPG pace on the worst non-expansion team in recent NHL history and has a cap hit of $4.25 million for 2 more seasons. There's no chance the Habs will retain salary on a trade, nor should they.

[CsInMyBlood]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

^^ now do Monahan’s stats in those combinations. IIRC his stats away from the guys like Ritchie and Pitlick are pretty darn good. And at this point his salary, like Lucic or Zadorov, are not that relevant when choosing who to play with.

How can his stats be pretty darn good when he has 7 points in 44 games?

[Jason14h]

Originally Posted by getbak

Toffoli is scoring at a 0.74 PPG pace on the worst non-expansion team in recent NHL history and has a cap hit of $4.25 million for 2 more seasons. There's no chance the Habs will retain salary on a trade, nor should they.

If Montreal is entering a rebuild and not planning to spend to the cap it’s the opposite - they would be idiots NOT to retain salary and get more value out of their asset

Why would they worry about retaining cap when they are most likely starting over next season and cap won’t be an issue for them?

[Toonage]

NM wrong spot

[Macho0978]

Originally Posted by CsInMyBlood

How can his stats be pretty darn good when he has 7 points in 44 games?

Stats show Dube and Monahan are creating lots of scoring chances and not giving up a ton either. They just are not finishing very many of their chances. IMO monahan is paid to finish so a lot of that is on him. But add someone who can finish to a line of guys creating chances and there is lots of room for production just adding 1 good player

Backlund and Coleman are similar. Create a ton of chances don’t give up many but not great at finishing those chances. Add mangiapane who finishes and you have a great looking line now

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by Jason14h

If Montreal is entering a rebuild and not planning to spend to the cap it’s the opposite - they would be idiots NOT to retain salary and get more value out of their asset

Why would they worry about retaining cap when they are most likely starting over next season and cap won’t be an issue for them?

If they’re planning to sell cap space, the offseason is the best time to do do it.

[CsInMyBlood]

Originally Posted by Macho0978

Stats show Dube and Monahan are creating lots of scoring chances and not giving up a ton either. They just are not finishing very many of their chances. IMO monahan is paid to finish so a lot of that is on him. But add someone who can finish to a line of guys creating chances and there is lots of room for production just adding 1 good player

Backlund and Coleman are similar. Create a ton of chances don’t give up many but not great at finishing those chances. Add mangiapane who finishes and you have a great looking line now

Right. I was responding to the claims that it is Brett Richie that is responsible for Monahans lack of production when in fact Monahan has played with others much more than scapegoat Ritchie.

The reality is you could fill Sean Monahans even strength production with a guy making league min. See Trevor Lewis or Adam Ruzicka. Instead we are talking about a 6.375 price tag. As you said, guys that make that money are paid to finish. Make their linemates better. Hes failing. Hes definitely the elephant in the room on this team.

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by CsInMyBlood

In 44 games he has 7 even strength points.

Now, is that more or less than Connor McDavid?

[CsInMyBlood]

Originally Posted by The Cobra

Now, is that more or less than Connor McDavid?

It's a couple less but Connor McDavid doesnt get to play with Brett Ritchie.

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by The_Rug

Monahan is the type of player that needs to give the puck to someone else, and unfortunately for him, his options right now are awful. Dube and Ritchie can't do anything (I think Dube needs some confidence, Ritchie needs to get away from this team). A skilled winger on that line would be the spark Monahan needs.

I've been advocating a Lucic - Monahan - Phillips line for months.

[Macho0978]

Originally Posted by CsInMyBlood

Right. I was responding to the claims that it is Brett Richie that is responsible for Monahans lack of production when in fact Monahan has played with others much more than scapegoat Ritchie.

The reality is you could fill Sean Monahans even strength production with a guy making league min. See Trevor Lewis or Adam Ruzicka. Instead we are talking about a 6.375 price tag. As you said, guys that make that money are paid to finish. Make their linemates better. Hes failing. Hes definitely the elephant in the room on this team.

I agree and I’m not blaming Ritchie for monahan lack of production. But my point was Coleman and Backlund both were targets just like monahan as high paid no results. Stats show they contribute lots of chances very little against for the whole season. People were all over them even sutter calls out backlund and then they get a guy who can finish on their line and they are producing at a high level now. Coleman has 13 points in last 15 backlund has 10 in last 10. Add mangiapane and the advanced stats guys are producing a ton now

Monahan and dube have great advance stats. No finish but add toffolli who can create and finish and you could see a huge increase in production. Ritchie isn’t killing their advance stats but he will never create or finish. I’d keep him but as a 4th liner

Fix the 3rd line and this team is elite.

[NewFan]

My thought is, if you want to improve your team, which part is the weakest of this time?
For me it's the third line. And one of the top paid forward is on that line.
If we want to bring high priced player and to improve top 6, we need to rid some salary.
If you think bottom 2 lines doing their job okay, the I think we can find much cheaper player to do Monahan's current role.
May be we can sign Eric Staal after the Olympics for playoffs.