[News] Monahan knows what's on the line this season: 'I have a lot to prove'

[GreenLantern2814]

Originally Posted by Classic_Sniper

I don't think that's gone at all. His ability to shoot still exists, however the opportunities in which he can use it has dropped off a cliff. As I've said in the past, Monahan lacks the ability to create his own shot, so he needs a playmaker to get him the puck in prime scoring areas. Dube doesn't appear to be that guy.

So at this point, it's up to Monahan to change his game if he wants to stay in this league. He's added more assertiveness and aggression in his game in recent years, so perhaps it's time for him to play in the dirty areas of the game. Start using his big frame to screen goalies, tip pucks, create havoc and capitalize on chances in and around the goal mouth.

Perhaps it's too big of a transformation, but I don't think he has a choice at this point. He certainly has the tools to at least try.

He could also try playing with a longer stick. Using such a short twig forces him to put all the force on his wrists to generate power on his shot, and his wrists have been slashed to ribbons the last eight years.

Using a longer stick might allow him to generate more leverage and let his stick do more of the work. It would also make him better defensively.

[timbit]

Originally Posted by Classic_Sniper

I don't think that's gone at all. His ability to shoot still exists, however the opportunities in which he can use it has dropped off a cliff. As I've said in the past, Monahan lacks the ability to create his own shot, so he needs a playmaker to get him the puck in prime scoring areas. Dube doesn't appear to be that guy.

So at this point, it's up to Monahan to change his game if he wants to stay in this league. He's added more assertiveness and aggression in his game in recent years, so perhaps it's time for him to play in the dirty areas of the game. Start using his big frame to screen goalies, tip pucks, create havoc and capitalize on chances in and around the goal mouth.

Perhaps it's too big of a transformation, but I don't think he has a choice at this point. He certainly has the tools to at least try.

Too big a transformation? Are you serious?

Those areas you pointed out, that’s where he’s scored 90 percent of his career goals.

[Classic_Sniper]

Originally Posted by Draug

Not to mention, Mangiapane has 15 goals. Probably not all, but many, have been with Backlund as Center. Yet Backlund has only 4 assists.

Backlund has been absolutely awful offensively given his spot in the top 6. Granted, he's been better than Monahan, but Backlund has not been good, except maybe defensively.

The Backlund-Mangiapane duo were re-united November 18th. That was 5 games ago. Backlund has definitely not assisted on many of Mangiapane's goals.

Outside of the top line, every skater has sort of played with everyone, so Mangiapane's goals have likely been assisted by a shmorgishborg of players. Actually kind of shows how good Mangiapane is, he can play with any one and produce. It's just a matter of optimizing who he plays with and keeping him territorially in the offensive zone.

[Classic_Sniper]

Originally Posted by timbit

Too big a transformation? Are you serious?

Those areas you pointed out, that’s where he’s scored 90 percent of his career goals.

Right, that's the point I'm making. I'm not asking him to become a player he can't possibly be. He just needs to re-direct that new found aggression of his in front of the night, fighting for space and loose pucks which has never been his game. He's no Tkachuk. I can't even remember the last time he scored a goal on a tip in.

But he has the hands and the big frame to at least stand there and try. Darryl's system actually would benefit players with this style because there's such a big emphasis on high shot volume and constantly funnelling pucks towards the net. It's just a matter of whether Sean Monahan is willing to take the abuse in front of the net.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by Classic_Sniper

The Backlund-Mangiapane duo were re-united November 18th. That was 5 games ago. Backlund has definitely not assisted on many of Mangiapane's goals.

Outside of the top line, every skater has sort of played with everyone, so Mangiapane's goals have likely been assisted by a shmorgishborg of players. Actually kind of shows how good Mangiapane is, he can play with any one and produce. It's just a matter of optimizing who he plays with and keeping him territorially in the offensive zone.

Backlund's most frequent five on five forward linemates

Coleman 170 min
Pitlick 101
Mangiapane 76
Lewis 55
Dube 47

Monahan's slate

Lewis 96
Lucic 71
Dube 69
Mangiapane 63
Pitlick 57
Coleman 52

Backlund deserves better linemates for sure, but he's certainly had a better chance of it. Almost 300 minutes with Coleman/Dube or Mangiapane. Monahan about 170

[Classic_Sniper]

Originally Posted by Bingo

Backlund's most frequent five on five forward linemates

Coleman 170 min
Pitlick 101
Mangiapane 76
Lewis 55
Dube 47

Monahan's slate

Lewis 96
Lucic 71
Dube 69
Mangiapane 63
Pitlick 57
Coleman 52

Backlund deserves better linemates for sure, but he's certainly had a better chance of it. Almost 300 minutes with Coleman/Dube or Mangiapane. Monahan about 170

Right, and Monahan has 2 even strength points to show for it this season. This is the same player who many were convinced drove the bus between the Gaudreau-Monahan duo. I've probably spent half my CP life debating this very topic with an endless number of people.

At the end of the day, the numbers are not on Monahan's side no matter how anyone wants to spin it. Fact is, if he wants to help this team win, he needs to stop being on the ice for more goals against than goals for. If he only scores at a bottom 6 rate, then that's fine.

But my biggest problem for him right now is his play in his own zone. For his roles and his minutes, his 9 GA in comparison to Backlund (4), Lindholm (3), Richardson (2) is what needs to change the most IMO. He has the worst GF to GA ratio on the team and this is what needs to be fixed right now. I already anticipated his lack of offensive production even before the season started, but to help this team win, he can't be hurting the team like he currently is.

[Your Calgary Flames!]

Didn’t read much of the thread but It’s a shame really. Monahan put up 22 goals his first season without Johnny. I do believe he could drive the play early in his career. One must wonder if it was injuries or he got too complacent being dependent on Johnny that he stopped trying to improve other aspects of his game and apexed early.

[GreenLantern2814]

Originally Posted by Your Calgary Flames!

Didn’t read much of the thread but It’s a shame really. Monahan put up 22 goals his first season without Johnny. I do believe he could drive the play early in his career. One must wonder if it was injuries or he got too complacent being dependent on Johnny that he stopped trying to improve other aspects of his game and apexed early.

His shot has declined. Wrist surgery has not allowed him to shoot the puck the way he used to in the style he’s used to.

He hasn’t adapted.

[Your Calgary Flames!]

Which brings us back around that maybe he didn’t develop other parts of his game because he focused on being the trigger man for Johnny. Who’s to say but he has some work to do. I still think there is a defensive player left in him still. The offense may be gone however.

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by Bingo

Are we comparing a 40 year old Marleau to a 27 year old Monahan, with Monahan a quarter of a season into a hip surgery recovery?

Someone in this topic posted a six month recovery time for that kind of surgery for athletes. That's right about now in time frame.

I would imagine teams would have a little more faith on a bounce back from the 27 year old, but clearly I don't know.

But as per usual I find myself in an argument to defend a player that I'm not actually defending.

My points have literally been the following, and nothing more.

- It's still relatively early
- He's still on a 40 point pace
- He may still be recovering (he may not)
- Teams may see his age, history, and last year of his contract as more of a worthy gamble than others assume

I'm not blind to how he's playing.

This is Monahan’s third season of decline. The most likely scenario is this is the new norm. And given his limitations even when healthy, the likelihood he can reinvent himself as a reliable bottom-six guy is small. A buyout or expensive cap dump (2nd round pick) seems more likely than a team giving up assets for him in the hopes of a turnaround.

[Your Calgary Flames!]

Monahan’s days are behind him unfortunately. He will never be a 30 goal scorer again. He is not a dynamic player that can have a couple bad years and rebound. Anyone who thinks otherwise will have a reality check.

[Firebot]

Monahan just isn't doing the little things that made him so good and so nonchalent for so long in the past.

When was the last time we have seen him in front of the net and being the garbageman? Even on the powerplay he isn't doing that.

It's not just his shot, he seems to simply avoid the dirty areas, and has been for the past 2 years.

He's damaged, and just trying to hang as a hockey player these days, and without his shot or his slot play he's pretty much useless since he's never been a strong defensive centerman.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Firebot

Monahan just isn't doing the little things that made him so good and so nonchalent for so long in the past.

When was the last time we have seen him in front of the net and being the garbageman? Even on the powerplay he isn't doing that.

It's not just his shot, he seems to simply avoid the dirty areas, and has been for the past 2 years.

He's damaged, and just trying to hang as a hockey player these days, and without his shot or his slot play he's pretty much useless since he's never been a strong defensive centerman.

On the powerplay he goes where the new system places him - off to the side. That’s on the coaches, not him. And IMO he’s not avoiding hard places. He’s going to different ones, mainly behind the net.

[Your Calgary Flames!]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

On the powerplay he goes where the new system places him - off to the side. That’s on the coaches, not him. And IMO he’s not avoiding hard places. He’s going to different ones, mainly behind the net.

You are correct. But his ability can easily be replaced at the fraction of his cost.

[bigrangy]

He looked like an NHLer tonight, three pretty good slot passes, unfortunately they were to Dube, Zadorov, and someone I don’t remember.

Would have liked to see him in OT. He’s been magic there before, as good as Mangiapane and Coleman were tonight they looked lost out there in OT.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by bigrangy

He looked like an NHLer tonight, three pretty good slot passes, unfortunately they were to Dube, Zadorov, and someone I don’t remember.

Would have liked to see him in OT. He’s been magic there before, as good as Mangiapane and Coleman were tonight they looked lost out there in OT.

Had a nice pass to Hanifin, who was pretty close to scoring.

[Yoho]

I just don’t know if the Flames can afford 11 mil tied up in Monahan and Lucic next year with big contracts needing to be signed.

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by Yoho

I just don’t know if the Flames can afford 11 mil tied up in Monahan and Lucic next year with big contracts needing to be signed.

True, but they are stuck with them at this stage.


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[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by bigrangy

He looked like an NHLer tonight, three pretty good slot passes, unfortunately they were to Dube, Zadorov, and someone I don’t remember.

Would have liked to see him in OT. He’s been magic there before, as good as Mangiapane and Coleman were tonight they looked lost out there in OT.

I only saw last half but Monahan played well. Strong on the puck and some nice passes.

Dube, Mangiapane and Coleman all with shifts in OT. They are all faster but I get worried when they have the puck. Monahan not likely to make an easy turnover.

[GreenLantern2814]

Retain $2M on Monahan and trade him.

The Hurricanes are paying $6.1M of Kotkaniemi who’s been far more disastrous - Monahan at $4.3M for one year will be more than absorbable for a number of teams.

Or buy him out - $2M cap hit one year, 2.35 the year after.

Either way, there’s no need to keep him Around.